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3010 fuel gauge, sender also?

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Rod

01-22-2003 06:52:28




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Ive looked at the past posts but one question yet is the new gauge on this old 3010 is subbed over to another no. and the new one has to have a 24 inch ground wire off of it to ground. Because of the difference in the gauge do you have to replace the sender also even if the old one seems to test okay. We hooked it all up and as soon as you turn the key it pegs on empty. thanks for the info.




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Rodney A. Johnson

01-23-2003 07:20:00




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
My 1962 JD 3010D is still 24 volt and has positive ground for the fuel gauge. I have a fused line from the positive of the left side 12 volt battery that when it isn't working the fuel guage and the oil pressure light won't work. If you are replacing the gauge, I'd believe you would need to have the a positive ground gauge in order to work with your sender unit...assuming it is the same as mine (one wire attached to the post on sender unit).

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Gunner

01-23-2003 04:52:06




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
The old sending unit should still work. I just replaced the gauge on my 4520 and had to go with the sub gauge also. It is a 12 volt but had the extra ground wire like you are talking about. I ended up replacing the sending unit als but only because it was also bad not because of the different gauge.

Gunner



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G-MAN - gauge part number

01-22-2003 15:38:33




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
Try gauge number RE54427 and see what that does for your problem, unless that's the gauge you're already trying.



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G-MAN

01-22-2003 13:55:41




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
Rod, I think there is some service bulletin and parts notes info available on this subject, I will check on it and get back to you after work. I think it's as simple as ordering a different part number gauge. I hate to see you smoke a gauge by overcomplicating the situation and doing creative troubleshooting. I'll repost within a couple hours or so.



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John T

01-22-2003 11:49:13




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
Dear Rod, sorry I cant exactly answer your questions as to which gauge or sending unit you have to buy, but can toss out some theory of operation (if its the type gauge I think it is??) and maybe we can figure it all out. On some general purpose DC Voltage gas gauge and senders, they work by applying power to one of the gauge terminals (when ignition is turned on)while the other terminal leads to the tank sender which is nothing more than a variable slidign resistor, and it completes the circuit to ground because the opposite end of the sending unit (after its resistor) is grounded either directly through the tank or an external ground wire. That way as the fuel level fluctuates and the senders float rises up or down, the difference in resistance causes a different deflection in the fuel gauge needle.

Now, the gauge may be a galvo magnetic field type, which means the current flow through it (a coil of wire) causes a magnetic field which deflects a metal needle. (Amount of deflection dependant on amount of current dependant upon resistance of sender) If so, if the current is flowing in the wrong direction (i.e. pos or neg grnd) the needle may not deflect properly, because the direction of current flow also determines the magnetic field polarity (North or South).

Other (non magnetic) gauges are bi-metallic type where the difference in curent through them just causes different heat which expands or contracts metal different and direction of the current wouldnt matter in that type of gauge.

THEREFORE, if you hook up the gauge to the sender, and with the sender not yet in the tank (so you can move it and see what the gauge does) and it moves to just the opposite of what it should (should obviously go full when sender float at top and empty when float at bottom), it must have to be a correct pos or neg grnd gauge, but I dont see why, as you asked, the sending unit should make any difference whatsoever, as its only a non polarity sensitive passive variable resistor. Also, if the sending units resistance is not a match for the gauge, it could either not deflect much at all (too much resistance) or peg full (too little resistance) and agian youre out of luck. If they are too little, I add external resistance to make them work, but if they are too much resistance, thats not a quick cheap possible jury rig of a fix.

If your gauge pegs to empty like you said, my guess is it a galvo type and NOT the correct polarity, (wont work) because if you ground out most gauges, they usually go to full (max current flow) or stay on empty if no power or resistor is an open circuit or they arent grounded properly. Whether or not the sender will work is not because of proper polarity (it has none) but whether or not its resistance matches that needed by the gauge.

If the senders mounting frame is electrically isolated from case ground and connects only via its external lug and the ground wire you mentioned, it might be possible to feed it hot there and let the opposite end of the gauge be ground to make it work ASSUMING THE RESISTANCE OF THE SLIDER IS RIGHT FOR THE GAUGE AND THE GAUGE IS INDEED POLARITY SENSITIVE AND OPPOSITE FROM WHAT YOU HAVE. Thats the kind of thing I might try myself but am not gonna officially recommend it here on this board lol.

Let us know, Ol John T Nordhoff in Indiana

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G-MAN

01-22-2003 07:51:53




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 Re: 3010 fuel gauge, sender also? in reply to Rod, 01-22-2003 06:52:28  
I fought this problem long ago, and it seems to me that if your tractor is positive ground, you'll need a positive ground gauge. I believe there are two different gauges available. I fought one for a few days doing the same thing once.



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