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Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise

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50man

05-29-2002 19:43:12




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I want to check my timing on my 50 with a timing light.I was told to check it at "fast idle". Is fast idle considered wide open (1275 rpm)? I believe I'm looking for the 20 on the flywheel. Is this considered perfect timing for todays fuel or do I need a dyno to tell? Also, I've noticed my tractor seems to puff some black smoke at low idle and I have a lot of carbon in my exhaust.....If I work it at all I end up with carbon deposites on my hood. Is that the problem, a retired tractor not worked enough or is it running a little rich?The fuel metering screw on the bottom of the carb is about 2 1/4 turns open and the carb was just rebuilt at Robert's so it should be fine. And finally...there seems to be alot of tappet noise (I adjusted by the book)Is this normal? Thanks for any info.....there are alot of helpful people that reply here!

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mike

05-30-2002 16:55:17




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
If you really want to dial in the idle mixtures
follow the procedure in the I&T book. you need a good tach. to check engine speed and basically you end up with each cylinder running at the same RPM not differant speeds by adjusting them seperate.



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Thanks for your replys - 50man

05-30-2002 14:06:34




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  



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Mike Aylward

05-30-2002 11:45:01




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
50 man, the term "idle" when talking about engine speed means an engine not under load. Obviously "slow idle" is "idling" and "fast idle" is wide open throttle, no load. If you look at the throttle shaft on a "fast idling" tractor it is not far off of "slow idle" speed. It is when you put a load on it that things change in a hurry..:-) Just a point to ponder. Mike



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Bob K

05-30-2002 09:41:06




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
50man, my 50 knocks pretty good inside the valve cover and everything was adjusted correctly after I reassembled it. It's just noisy that way.

I set the timing on my Wico distributor per the manual (I don't have a timing light) and it seems to run fine, although I don't work it very hard (mowing and put-putting around the place). Mine smokes a little at lower RPMs because I run a little Marvel oil in the gas, but not bad at higher RPMs.

Yes, as contrary as it sounds, "fast idle" means throttle almost wide open.

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Clooney

05-30-2002 03:46:37




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
50man, fast idle [high idle] is 1375 RPM on a 50, with 1250 RPM being the working RPM. ~For timing setting purposes anything over 1000 RPM will give you full advance [if the distributor advance is working as it should]
~If you have the Wico dist., same settings only no advance.
~You didn't say if you have a gas burner or all-fuel? [20* BTDC for a gasser & 25* BTDC for an all-fueler]. I don't know about optimum timing as that depends on how you are using the tractor, but they seem to run pretty good at 20*- 25* BTDC. If you go much over 25* on a gasser it will hammer pretty good under heavy load.
As for the black smoke, that is normal [IF] you trying to idle the engine too low [if you are trying to idle it much below 500 RPM the carb metering will go rich & will need the idle mixture screws turned in to compensate, then put back for normal idle speeds]
~On valve adjustment, the valves are [mechanical lifters] & need a running clearance to keep from burning the valves, if you can't hear them, they are too tight. They must be adjusted hot, [not just run for a few minutes hot, but work it for a while hot]. Due to wear on the rocker arm shaft, rocker arm to valve stems & cam wear the best way to adjust valves on an old 2-cylinder is to not use a feeler gage, but just bring the flywheel to the proper place for the valve(s) being adjusted then turn the valve adjusting screw in until there is "0" lash [or until the rocker arm play is just gone] then back the adjuster out 1/3 of a turn [that is real close to .020�]. If a feeler gage is used & there is rocker arm wear, the feeler gage will bridge the wear area & the resulting setting will be too loose. On my personal tractors that call for a .020� settings I use a dial indicator & set the valve lash to .021� measured at the rocker arm, at a point just above the valve stem. Or if lazy just use the 1/3 turn out method. I was brought up with the saying that �if you can�t hear them they are probably burning�. ~Wih the extensive use of unleaded fuel, the valves will slowly recede into the seat under heavy loads & slowly close the gap up, then burn due to tight clearance��

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mike

05-30-2002 16:48:20




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 Re: Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to Clooney, 05-30-2002 03:46:37  
Wico dist. do have an advance in them. The best thing for worn rockers is to pull off the assembly and resurface the ends with a grinder.



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CLW

05-29-2002 21:25:01




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
50man Slow idle is control lever all the way back. Fast idle is all the way up. Why they put the word "fast" and "idle" together I don't know, but that's the way the I&T Mauual has it.
CLW



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John T

05-29-2002 20:12:19




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 Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to 50man, 05-29-2002 19:43:12  
50 man, fast idle is more like 500 rpm than 1275 in my opinion. I tried setting my timing with a light, but the 20 degrees seemed just a tad slow to suit my ear, so I bump it up just until the sharp popping sound stops. As fas as black at idle, I would suggest you lean (screw in) the idle/air adjustments as opposed to the main power jet at the bottom center. When I adjust my idle setigns, I remove one plug and then set the opposite sides adjuster in till she just leans out then open her up about 1/4 to 1/2 turn. You might try to tighten the valve lash settigns just a tad, but I wouldnt recommend more than just a couple thousandths more then specs to lessen the chance of a burned valve. If the rocker shafts are worn, its tough to totally eliminate a little valve noise. I like to run Autolite 388 plugs also. Good Luck Ol John T in Indiana

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50man

05-29-2002 20:54:11




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 Re: Re: Another Timing Question, Some Back Exhaust Tappet Noise in reply to John T, 05-29-2002 20:12:19  
Thanks for the help...I'll give your ideas a try



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