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Ignition timiing late B

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Farmuse

05-09-2002 05:22:38




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I am in the process of timing the Wico magneto ignition. I have the flywheel turned to top dead center for number one cylinder and have turned the magneto counter clockwise until the spark occurred on number one cylinder. When i crank it only one cylinder will fire. (clooney if you read this) I do have good blue spark now after changing wires to solid wire. I am also getting two sparks during the full four stroke cycle. one at TDC and one at exaust TDC (bothe times the piston is at the top) could the mag cap be crosfiring? Cap is new any help

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John T

05-09-2002 14:15:26




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 Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Farmuse, 05-09-2002 05:22:38  
Although I dont know which mag you have, I bet its one of the Wico's which fires at TDC of each piston on BOTH compression and exhaust. To set its initial static timing (assuming the governor to cam timing is correct in which case at TDC on compression on left number one cylinder, the mags female drive cog slot is flat horizontal) you turn the mag CW to retard and CCW to advance until you hear it snap over and fire when the LH impulse timing mark on the flywheel crosses that mark at 3 O Clock on the side of the tractor. Now if its only firing one cylinder, rememebr its the same set of points and condensor that fires either, so the problem can be in the mag cap or the wire or the plug. Try reversing/swapping wires and plugs to eliminate what the problem is. If you have a reduction gear type mag that only fires at TDC on Power and not Exhaust, post back. Let us know and Good Luck Ol John T

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Clooney

05-09-2002 11:40:42




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 Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Farmuse, 05-09-2002 05:22:38  
Farmuse, we will need just a little more info [maybe]
~It sounds like you might have a gear reduction mag. What Wico mag do you have? Does it have any numbers or markings on it? Are you positive it is a Wico? Does the mag rotor spin one revolution for each revolution of the flywheel [I'm betting not]
~Lay both plugs side by side & see if both are firing at once, if so let us know.



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farmuse

05-09-2002 12:05:56




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 Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Clooney, 05-09-2002 11:40:42  
Clooney, definately a WICO, it does have numbers i will get those and repost. This is the same tractor you responded about back a few days ago. (Run good until uder a load and them black smoke and flood out) At that time I was getting orange fire to the plugs and you told me to change from automotive type wires which I did.(getting good blue spark now). The mag has been rebuilt. The air intake is clear.

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Clooney

05-09-2002 13:15:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to farmuse, 05-09-2002 12:05:56  
Farmuse, after re-reading your post I may have misunderstood the wording.
~"I am also getting two sparks during the full four stroke cycle"--Are you saying that you only get 2 sparks per full cycle on both cylinders or are you saying you are getting 2 sparks per [side] for each four stroke cycle? ~If you are saying you are getting a spark at TDC on both compression & exhaust on the SAME cylinder, that is normal for a Wico C or X mag & if that is the case I misunderstood your post. The Wico C & X both spark on each side on each TDC of the piston.
~"When I crank it only one cylinder will fire"---- are you saying you are only getting a spark on one cylinder while cranking? If so, do you get a spark out of each side with it running? Does the mag click on each revolution of the flywheel?
~Sorry for the questions but I need to understand what we have so I don't mislead you..... ..

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farmuse

05-09-2002 18:24:20




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Clooney, 05-09-2002 13:15:53  
Clooney, the mag numbers are as follows:\\

XH 1042
Serial: Xc 225985

I am getting a spark at TDC on both compression & exhaust on the SAME cylinder. Spark out of both sides but only runs (fires) on one cylinder. New Plugs, both firing good but will "fire" only on one cylinder. I am wondering if the mag is timed correctly to TDC. When I prolong choking raw gas only runs from right petcock. Is the left cylinder plug wire supposed to go in the top outlet of the mag cap?

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Clooney

05-09-2002 19:18:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to farmuse, 05-09-2002 18:24:20  
Farmuse, the L/H plug wire goes in the top tower if the mag is installed correctly, if the mag is installed 180* out of time the L/H plug wire would go in the bottom tower. ~It wouldn't run at all if the wires weren't installed correctly.
~The XH mag is basically a Wico X mag that sparks each cylinder on every revolution so sparking on the exhaust stroke would be normal.
~Are you checking for running on both cylinders at idle or no load, if so, running on one cylinder is pretty normal for a single barrel carb equipped Deere 2 cylinder. They should both fire & pull when working though. It is probably acting like it is only running on the L/H cylinder. ~Worn valve guides will also effect the idle running & cylinder richness at idle & no load.
~I don't know why raw gas is only running from the petcocks on the R/H cylinder [is the compression the same on both sides?]. Again, worn valve guides, burnt valves or tight valve lash can effect the low speed & cranking richness & intake vacuum on the effected cylinder. ~The ignition timing will effect both sides the same so that shouldn't make a big difference but to make sure it is correct, slowly turn the flywheel in the starting direction & the mag should snap when the "L/H impulse" mark on the flywheel lines up with the case mark [ at crank center line height, at 3 o'clock behind flywheel]..... .

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farmuse

05-10-2002 05:03:52




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Clooney, 05-09-2002 19:18:06  
So I will have to take the flywheel cover off to check for impulse mark behind flywheel? There are marks on fly wheel that you can see from the handcrank opening on the flywheel cover. There is a dot on the flywheel and an arrow on the cover at the bottom of the opening that line up when left cylinder is at top dead center.



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Clooney

05-10-2002 14:18:49




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to farmuse, 05-10-2002 05:03:52  
Farmuse, no you don't have to take the cover off. You can use the dot & mark on the flywheel cover (that is TDC).
~I personally don't like to use the cover & flywheel mark as there are too many variables with the cover stamping & bolt up slop, but the cover marks will be close enough for rough timing & any error in mark placement won't be far enough to really effect running or starting timing.

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ChuckW

05-09-2002 06:51:09




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 Re: Ignition timiing late B in reply to Farmuse, 05-09-2002 05:22:38  
there is a dimple on the flywheel cover that lines up with the flywheel puller hole. IT manual shows this. All those tractors fire on both compression and exhaust, what causes a lot of the popping sounds. Timing doesn't have anything to do with you mag output. You probably need to renew some internal parts. Timing is TDC on cranking and 20 degree advance on operation. The impulse takes care of this. Normally the driven shaft for the mag shows a horizontal position for the driven groves when it at TDC. Good luck.

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