Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Attention Forum Users: On the 28th of December 2023 at 9:00am Central Time, we will be taking the forums down for maintenance while we prepare the new forums for your use. Please click here for more information.

Discussion Forum
:

Does octane level matter for power?

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
JON

04-05-2002 19:30:07




Report to Moderator

Can anyone tell me does it matter what octane level I use in a 48 D with high compression pistons and a seperate air intake tube.Will higher octane fuel increase the power any?I have been using reg. 87 octane. But would like to try something to increase hp a little more. thanks for any info. jon




[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
Tom P

04-08-2002 14:35:26




Report to Moderator
 Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to JON, 04-05-2002 19:30:07  
Octane rating has NO effect on how much power your engine will produce. It is only a measurement of its knock resistance. The number itself is a comparsion of the fuel's tendency to knock as it would compare to pure octane.(octane is actually a fuel itself) A fuel with an 87 rating means it will have 87 percent of the antiknock charteristics as pure Octane. Often the octane rating is referred to as the antiknock index.

There are two types of rating methods, the research and motor methods. The mehtods are quite different. The motor number is more important with regards to how a tractor endine runs; full throttle, low RPMs. This is the downside to Ethanol, sorry farmers, because Ethanol actually increased only the research number. When the two methods are added together and divided by two, you get the overall number.

As far as Exhaust gas temps, it's true that leaner will be hotter. Other things to keep in mind as well are that when spark timing is retarded, EGTs will increase; and when the engine is knocking, they will decrease.

The only reason a higher Octane rating may help is because the blend itself may have a higher BTU rating.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
rasputen

04-06-2002 06:06:27




Report to Moderator
 Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to JON, 04-05-2002 19:30:07  
To a degree, octane requirements can be tweaked by retarding timing if it pings. Naturally serveral limiting factors are limiting effects, but if it is relatively free of carbon deposits (glow plugs) it can be tweaked a bit. I would love to hear more on exaust gas temp and carb adjustment. I have been playing with that but have no knowledge, just making observations. I have mainly tried to see what the temp was at lean setting and then watching the effect of opening the fuel mix a bit.

bd

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Steve

04-07-2002 05:12:07




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to rasputen, 04-06-2002 06:06:27  
The basic theory is that lean is hot, rich is cool. When it's overly rich, there's a lot of un burned gas in the mix causing the exhaust gas to be cooler than normal. Burn all the gas that's there -- you get more power, more heat in the exhaust.

EGT gauges are generally made for aircraft engines. When you go from sea level to a couple of miles up, you need to be able to monitor and change your mixture. The sensors are short, round probes which go in a hole you've drilled in the header pipe and are fastened by hose clamp type devices. They're made for tube steel pipes -- so the idea of putting one on your cast iron tractor exhaust header may cool your interest in installing one.

Your engine may want to run somewhere between 1100 to 1400 degrees. It takes a little experimentation to establish a baseline for a particular motor. Remember -- if you run too rich you only waste gas or foul plugs. If you run too lean, you could waste some engine parts -- exhaust valves are usually the first to go.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mikey G

04-06-2002 04:54:59




Report to Moderator
 Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to JON, 04-05-2002 19:30:07  
Jon ,
I have to agree with Ol JohnT also. When I was a lot younger I can rember my grandad talking about distillate it burns real slow that is why the long stroke in Deere engines at low speed really worked. A long duration slow push from the fuel charge. Just my 2bits on the issue.

Mikey G



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Steve

04-06-2002 00:16:41




Report to Moderator
 Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to JON, 04-05-2002 19:30:07  
I agree with John T's thoughts. Your engine may well make more power with a lower octane gas. The popper engines started at around 6:1 compression ratio for the gas models, and 4.5:1 for the all fuel models. Maybe you went from 4.5 to 6:1? Higher compression, but I think the 87 octane is optimized for street cars running about 8:1 compression. Meaning you actually need a lower octane for the best combustion without pre ignition.

Does the octane make that much difference? No, it's down the list a ways...more of a sanitary factor than a real power booster. From my miss spent youth and too much time around a dyno with a Cosworth engine we figured that 104 octane was about optimum for a 10.5:1 engine... but it wasn't nearly as critical as other factors in making power. The way to make big power gains (short of turbo charging) was with better breathing (time on a flow bench shaping the head and manifolds to flow air better, accurate block honing, good rings, etc).

A reliably timed spark at high RPM's was very important -- and even with a popper running 975 RPM it's important. You might get a bigger gain by shimming up the distributor shaft and rotor so it fires at the right time, every time.

The right mixture will make much more significant gains than the octane - that is, setting the carb mixture for the day's factors in temp, humidity and air pressure. We used an Exhaust Gas Temp -EGT - gauge to set the carb jets -- two and three times a day at the track. The heat range and shape of the plugs - and the flame front they produced were also at least as important as octane in the category of things that are easily changed.

I'm also from Indiana, but from the part where we have a race track called Indy. Lots of race track rats running around here, I was once one of them. I used to think pulling 3 g's on a high bank corner with my hair on fire was heaven, but now -- having topped the 50 mark some years ago --putting along at 5 mph on a Johnny Popper is very satisfying. People change, but I don't think the physics of an engine have. Hope some of my long ago gained experience helps you.

Steve

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
John T

04-05-2002 19:42:55




Report to Moderator
 Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to JON, 04-05-2002 19:30:07  
Jon, Im not sure what compression your D has with the high compression pistons and all, but I doubt that it is anywhere near high enough that high octane fuel is either required or would gain much horsepower. The main reason high octane fuel is used is to prevent pre ignition in high compresion engines. Its actually harder to ignite. I have read and believe that higher octane fuel than necesary results in less efficient total combustion and leaves more carbon deposits than if say an 87 opctane was all the engines compression required. The ultra high compression pullers gain horsepower due to high compression and not so much due to higher octane fuels which are necessary to prevent horsepower and efficiency robbign pre igntion. This is not my field of expertise (electrical not a mechanical or chemical engineer) and it will be good to hear more knowledgeable opinions. Ol John T Nordhoff in Indiana

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
zane

04-06-2002 05:15:35




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Does octane level matter for power? in reply to John T, 04-05-2002 19:42:55  
John: You and Steve are right on the money. It is a common misconception that higher octane must be better; I guess because it's more expensive. As long as an engine's not pinging it makes no sense to go to a higher octane.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy