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Painting / Rebuild Order?

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Matt

10-05-2001 09:33:47

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Hello,

I have a question about painting and rebuilding a tractor. I have a '41 B. I have been disassembeling it so I can re-ring the pistions, and clean the insides of the engine out. My question is, before I go and reassemble the tractor, should I sandblast the individual parts, and paint them? Or would it be better to reassemble the tractor fully, then repaint the entire tractor fully reassembled.

Thanks for the advice. One other question is, I live in Southeast wisconsin, near milwuakee. Does anyone know of a club or is there anyone who lives here, that would be willing to work with me and offer some advice. This is my first tractor, and I am looking for some help in person. This board has been a great source of info, but sometimes you just need a person to see what you are working with.

Matt

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HMan

10-05-2001 20:20:29

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Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Matt, 10-05-2001 09:33:47

I don't have anything to add to sandblasting/painting, Clooney covered it well. Here's something I do. I replace all bolts.Bolts you get now are zinc plated and have grade marks. I grind the grade marks off the top then hit the heads with a sandblaster. The blasting etches them so the paint sticks. Then prime them good. I agree with Clooney, tractors painted in pieces, showing the gaskets, rubber etc. look best,but JD didn't do it that way. HMan

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Clooney

10-05-2001 13:31:55

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Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Matt, 10-05-2001 09:33:47

Matt, it depends on what you consider a restoration & if you think the part you are installing will come back off again. If you know it will stay installed then you should probably blast & prime & paint while it is removed. If you are just trying to get it running so you can play with it for a while before a total tear down & restoration then it probably doesn't matter either way. I usually get a tractor running & see how loud the gear & other noises are & how it works then tear it down to the last nut, bolt gear & bearing for a total restoration, about the only thing I don't remove is the oil filter can from the block & sometimes even that gets removed if it is bent on top. If you are just going to do a repaint after repairs, blast & paint as you go with primer & one coat of paint then when it is all back together scuff it up with a Scotch pad re-prime any bare spots & paint it.

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John K

10-05-2001 17:07:13

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Re: Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Clooney, 10-05-2001 13:31:55

Matt has asked a question that's been on my mind, too. The responses so far have been informative.
I'd like to explore the whole thing a little further.
In my case, I have an L that is completely torn down and just about ready for reassembly with new parts where needed. It seems the one clear rule is to not sandblast anything that's assembled, and I don't plan to. I already stripped the paint and goo off all the castings by boiling in TSP. Can I get good results by coating with POR15 (or equivalent) or am I forced to sandblast anyway? Should I assemble each object (tranny, final drive unit, etc.) then prime and paint? Or prime the bare castings before assembling? If it's already primed before assembling, I'd expect to get some oily residue on the primer. Won't that defeat the primer's ability to hold the topcoat?
Thanks for your time.

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Clooney

10-05-2001 18:29:17

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Re: Re: Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to John K, 10-05-2001 17:07:13

John, everybody seems to do the clean, prime & paint a little differently & most likely the way that works best for them with the equipment & tools they have. I can tell you what works best for me & the reason I do it. It will take about 3-4 complete restorations before you find the correct path for you..... I usually steam clean then solvent clean the complete tractor before doing anything, to help figure out what is broken, cracked & if the project is worth putting any money into. Then play with it for a while to find the noises, non-functioning items & loose parts. Then I tear it completely down & pile the parts in groups to keep the sub-systems together for inspection & wear analysis. When I say teardown I mean to the last nut & bolt. At that time I make a list of all the pieces that need to be replaced & then break that list onto parts that I can get from Deere or at least from a quality vendors & a list that I carry to tractor shows & swap meets that has the parts listed that I will need to find used or pick up in some other way. I am a stickler for originality so even the correct bolts, markings on the bolt heads & nut size & type are included. While I am shopping for parts & looking for "assembly originality" pictures I will systematically sand blast & rust kill all the cast & heavy metal parts (I don't sand blast the main case or rear axle case because of the impossibility of getting all the sand out of every pore & pocket) & wire wheel, rotary brush & de-scale the bare main case & rear axle housing. As I clean & complete each piece I spray it with a Phosphoric acid rust killer (I don't use rust converters as I have had very bad luck with those products) & in many cases I re-sandblast once the rust is killed (just sandblasting doesn't remove all the rust it just removes the rust you can see & leaves the rust down in the pores of the metal) then I prime the piece with DP-40 epoxy primer & hang it in a safe place. After all the major pieces are rust killed & primed I re-assemble & install the inner components, gears , bearings etc. I even prime most bolts before installing, then when I have the main part of the tractor re-assembled I will completely wipe it down with enamel reducer & re-prime with a light coat as a sealer. At that time I will paint the main frame, case & rear axle as an assembly then sandblast, rust kill, prime & paint each piece & install it as I complete it. The assembly bolts are primed before assembly & hand painted with a brush after installation. The hood is painted off the tractor & installed later as well as the wheels, radiator, seat, floor plate & other parts that are difficult to paint behind or under & most of those parts need an epoxy filler primer to remove the rust pits & wear deformations . All the carb, governor clutch & other linkage & rods are painted off the tractor & installed later. I realize Deere didn't paint behind or under many parts but I can't stand unpainted areas. I use lock-tite on ALL fasteners & quality gasket sealer on all gaskets & flanges making sure not to miss any areas as I don't want to have to re-do any installations after painting & I hate oil leaks. I don't paint any rubber parts (even though Deere painted most on the originals) because they look awful after a short while of use. I don't use clear coat on the sheetmetal because to me it doesn't look like the original paint..... ..... .Now I am not trying to tell anybody how to restore their tractor I am just stating how I do it on mine & if there is something that I do that will help others it is worth the typing time.

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John K

10-05-2001 18:56:26

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Clooney, 10-05-2001 18:29:17

Clooney,
Thanks for putting the time into your last post. That's exactly the level of detail I was hoping for. I realize there are lots of different ways to get to the end result, but without any experience with the whole painting thing, I'd be afraid to make it up as I went along. Now I've got something to work with, and hopefully you've helped a few other guys, too.

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BMEyer

10-05-2001 11:41:59

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Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Matt, 10-05-2001 09:33:47

If you're going through the whole tractor, I'd sandblast each part seperately. Sandblasting the tractor while assembled may give you problems later. Sand gets everywhere including inside places you wouldn't think. I'm getting close to finishing a 420 and as I went through each section I blasted each part away from the tractor and primed it prior to reassembly. When I was ready to paint green I left it stripped down to make it easier to get to the hard-to-get-to-places...ie, left off the starter, generator, steps, fenders, gas tank, radiator, 3 point, carb, linkages, etc. I hung those up seperately and painted those green then assembled them. It leaves a much nicer job when touching up the nuts and bolts if they are left primed when reassembling the peices and parts. I touched them up with an artist' brush later. Hope this helps you and good luck with your project.

I can't help you with the local club thing as I'm in Virginia.

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Don

10-05-2001 11:00:04

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Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Matt, 10-05-2001 09:33:47

Matt, I am restoring a 35 B and I have been wrestling with the same question (overhaul/paint order). I have just completed my rebuild (rings, valve job and etc.) and just got it back together and running. Now I am going to tear it back down and work on the painting and cosmetics. I too wish I had a local mentor to come over and give me some pointers, I've never been around one of these two cylinder tractors and sometimes I don't know how something is suposed to work, sound or feel. For example: the "snap" of a properly adjusted clutch, it's hard to understand what that is supposed to sound or feel like just reading about it. I don't think I would have even started this project, much less have gotten this far, without this board. So, good luck and I too will be reading the responses to your question from the board veterans.

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Nels

10-06-2001 04:25:47

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Re: Re: Painting / Rebuild Order? in reply to Don, 10-05-2001 11:00:04

Matt, I'm not a John Deere man, at least not yet, but I visit the local J.D. dealership occasionally. I live in WA and the local "2 Cylinder" club conducts their meetings at the John Deere dealership. You may want to check with the dealer near you. I'm sure that they can help steer you in the right direction.

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