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50 Pistons

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Jack

07-05-2001 13:04:18




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My 50 all-fuel is due for a rebuild; the block part # is B3087R. Can I convert to the higher compression gasoline pistons instead of the all-fuel pistons?




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Joan

07-07-2001 14:58:58




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 Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-05-2001 13:04:18  
I have a John Deere 50



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Chuck

07-06-2001 19:11:50




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 Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-05-2001 13:04:18  
have checked parts manual...the all fuel has the same head as the B and plugs are in the block. The gas model has the higher compression head and higher compression pistons. Like I posted earlier, you can change the block(you'll have the holes), change to Hi compression pistons and the gas head, plus intake/exhaust manifold, carburator and you'd be in business. I'm not giving you advise without checking it out...you can go away from the all fuel pistons without some type of plug problems...you can't mismatch parts and get them to work...good luck...trying to give straight advise.

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Mike Aylward

07-07-2001 06:59:51




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 Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Chuck, 07-06-2001 19:11:50  
I am not trying to be difficult here, but there will be no problems in putting in aluminum high compression pistons in a single induction 50. Granted, the dual induction head will have a tighter combustion chamber and would give even more power, but these pistons have been put in B's for years without trouble. We used to have a '51 B that had these pistons in them and it would crank out over 36 h.p. and pull a 3-14" plow in river bottom gumbo in third gear all day and go round for round with an A doing the same thing. Go ahead and put in the aluminum pistons. You'll wonder why you didn't do it sooner. Hope this helps. Mike

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Mike Aylward

07-06-2001 13:22:22




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 Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-05-2001 13:04:18  
Jack, there is no reason you can't put in high compression gas pistons in your 50. The aftermarket aluminum pistons will have more compression than the original cast gas pistons and really wake up your 50. This will be the case whether or not it has the Duplex carburetor. And don't bother putting on a 520 head. The 50's had their spark plugs in the block and the 20 series had them in the head. The 20 series actually has a deeper combustion chamber because the pistons in them came up farther in the block. You would be losing compression, not gaining it. A good set of aftermarket aluminum pistons should get your 50 up around 35 h.p. or so, and will seem like a completely different tractor, Duplex carb or not. Hope this helps. Mike

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G Taylor

07-06-2001 18:19:03




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 Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Mike Aylward, 07-06-2001 13:22:22  
I did miss specificaly mentioning that 520 piston need to be used with the 520 head. It does look a little odd with two plugs per cylinder. Just use a short iron that doesn't get hit by the piston on the way past to fill the block's holes. Maybe cheaper & easier just to trade for a 520 or 530 & get what you want without tinkering.



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ET

07-06-2001 07:13:10




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 Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-05-2001 13:04:18  
High compression pistons will improve hp when
burning gas no matter what carburator you have.
Only the very early all fuels used the single
barrel carb. the later ones used the duplex carb.
My 50 has the deere universal replacement carb.
for all 2 cylinders (I don't have the model no.
right here) and it is an all fuel carburator.
My 50 will handle 6 row cultivators quite well.

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Chuck

07-05-2001 14:34:14




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 Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-05-2001 13:04:18  
there's no reason you can't, but not sure of your carb, as I recall the all fuel uses a single throat carb and you'll not get the benefit of added horsepower unless you go to the duplex intake and carb...I'm not absolutely sure as to the head, you'd need to check the parts book and see if it is the same....would be quiet a bit of expense to change all this. May be better to trade tractors.....



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Jack

07-06-2001 05:17:29




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 Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Chuck, 07-05-2001 14:34:14  

I agree that there was a very large gain in horsepower when Deere went to the dual-throat carburetor but isn't this reflected in the difference in HP ratings between the 50 and the 520 as the Nebraska tests were done on the 50 with the single-throat carb in '53? The Dual-throad carb didn't come along until late in the 50 production run. This increase is over 10 drawbar HP with the high-compression gasoline tractor, according to the chart I'm referring to.

According to the same chart the 50 jumps from 23.2 DBHP in the distillate tractor to 27.5 in the gasoline version, and belt HP goes up to 31, from 25.8; this is due to the higher compression and more volatile fuel. I don't expect to realize the full amount of this gain, of course as I'm now burning gasoline in a distillate tractor but 2-3 more horsepower on the PTO at bush-hog time is significant.


As the spark plugs are in the block, I hadn't given any consideration to the head; is there a a potential problem there? Spending the money to change the head, manifold and carburetor is beyond consideration, I'd put it back together with new all-fuel pistons first.

This is not a parade tractor nor a pulling tractor; it's a "work everyday" tractor used for tillage, cultivating, mowing and brush-cutting, and PTO work at wood-splitting time, and little chores, mostly with a box blace and with the boom pole around my blacksmith shop. What I want is what horsepower I can get without sacrificing reliability. the LPG pistons with the resulting 8:1 ration are, IMO, overkill.

Your thoughts, anyone? Is someone out there making JD pistons that will fill this need?

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Shorty Dear

07-06-2001 18:11:33




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 Re: Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-06-2001 05:17:29  
I think I have a new set of alunimum pistons for your 50.



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Chuck

07-06-2001 12:13:58




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 Re: Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-06-2001 05:17:29  
better reference all your parts....before trying interchange...sounds like the head is like the old B head...has the one induction port...I believe the block needs to be cross referenced, the whole thing might be the same as B's..... I know the B pistons had the extended tops with the notches for the plugs....I believe the newer type pistons don't have these same notches...and this would interfere with you plugs....better check everything out....

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G Taylor

07-06-2001 11:18:18




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 Re: Re: Re: 50 Pistons in reply to Jack, 07-06-2001 05:17:29  
Does the tractor have duplex carburation or simplex? It would be reasonable to keep the allfuel head,intake & carb in a clean safe dry place. Then install a 50 duplex or better a 520/530 head intake and gasoline carb. The 520/530 head promoted better flame travel by lighting the mixture closer to the combustion chamber center.An all fuel carb running gasoline always provides too rich a mixture. For 1/2 the cost of a six pack, the fuel tank can be filled with 92 or 94 octane if the LP pistons happen to knock. The HP per gallon of fuel will be increases along with total HP. While converting oilbaths to dry filters for extra power & cleaner air is a contentious issue. At least remove the mesh from the canister & boil the oil mud out. You, your friends, family & neighbours will shocked at the amount of dirt plugging the aircleaner.

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