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JD history question.

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Curious

01-07-2001 10:50:25

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How many "first's" did JD have from 1920 to 1970. Please give a desciption,year,and model of tractor for each inovation. Thanks.

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HMan

01-09-2001 14:15:43

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

Here's a biggie if true. I read that JD was the first to oil the rod bearings through the crank shaft, (same way it's done today). Anyone know this for sure? HMan

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Stan

01-09-2001 03:47:47

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

I can't verfiy this one at all, but 40 or so years ago I "heard a rumor" that Deere had invented/designed the "spin out" rear wheels that A-C used on the WD?/WD-45 tractors. Deere supposedly did not feel it was a robust enough design to use on their tractors at the time, so sold the rights to A-C. Of course, Deere did use that design (or a similar one) in the late '50s.

Can anyone verify that story?

Stan

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Dan D.

01-09-2001 15:54:37

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Stan, 01-09-2001 03:47:47

That is an untrue story. AC invented the spin out wheels. If you read the book, AC Farm Equipment by Norm Swinford, you'll see pictures of the drawings sent to the patent office by the AC engineer who developed them ( I can't remember his name at the moment.) I'm sure that if John Deere had developed them, they could have some how managed to make them robust enough to work.

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Stan

01-11-2001 12:56:58

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Dan D., 01-09-2001 15:54:37

Well, so much for rumors - and so much for trying to remember something I heard 45 or 50 years ago.

Thanks for the reply.

Stan

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lonn

01-09-2001 17:22:26

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Dan D., 01-09-2001 15:54:37

Walter Strehlow was the one who was issued patent no. 2,417,139 on March 11, 1947. He was the chief engineer for the Allis tractor division. Several WD features were years ahead of the JD A. Like : live pto, power shift wheels, oil cushioned clutch, Traction Booster, single point hitch for better draft of mounted equipment, helical gear transmission in 1952, variable delivery piston hydraulic pump. Did I miss any? In 1943 Allis was issued a patent for a full power shift transmission with 5 speeds. Not putting that into production WD's shows some of Allis's poor management decisions.

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Larry E

01-14-2001 10:23:54

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-09-2001 17:22:26

where is Allis now if they are so good

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pdxGREEN

01-08-2001 18:33:51

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

Deere was the first with ROPS

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YOU ASKED FOR IT

01-07-2001 18:34:53

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

First to be John Deere green!
First to have yellow steel wheels with JD green!
First to have yellow wheels with rubber tires with JD Green!
First to have a John Deere green two cylinder with cast wheels and rubber tires!
First to have the hood cut out to have the muffler changed!
and on and on and on and on and on!

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your turn

01-07-2001 19:14:52

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to YOU ASKED FOR IT, 01-07-2001 18:34:53

Ask a good question and get an inappropriate answer.
Answer with a dumb question get a dumb reply to dumb answer.

I suppose you are the first to graduate from 6th grade!

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YOUR TURN?

01-08-2001 08:18:42

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to your turn, 01-07-2001 19:14:52

Lets see your answer! Name "ALL" the first that JD had from 1920 to 1970 Mr. Know it all!!!

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Ditto

01-08-2001 12:43:00

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to YOUR TURN?, 01-08-2001 08:18:42

I wasn't the one who tried to offer an answer to an excellent question. I never said I knew it all. I am only offering to point out that your reply was not appropriate to the question. Apparently you can dish it out but can not take it. I do not know all of the firsts and that it why I think it is an good post.

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YOUR TURN?

01-08-2001 08:18:04

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to your turn, 01-07-2001 19:14:52

Lets see your answer! Name all the first that JD had from 1920 to 1970 Mr. Know it all!!!

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Bill E.

01-07-2001 18:29:26

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

Curious,

Here are some first's that are related to Jd's between '20 and '70.

Waterloo Boy model "N" 1920 1st nebraska Test tractor. ?GP had Four forms of power. power lift,pto, belt, drawbar. (somebody help me on this one!).

1959 Nebraska test#716 JD 435 was first tractor to be tested using PTO standards.

1970 4620/7020. First AG tractor with turbo + intercooler.

Was 5010 first ag wheel tractor over 100hp?

These are some ideas. Maybe others can post and help on the ones with ???'s. I need to check some other books. I saw a list of notable ag tractor firsts somewheres, and JD's weren't mention much.
Sounds like your writing a report, hope this helps.
Bill

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Bill E ....corrections and additions

01-08-2001 02:43:39

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Bill E., 01-07-2001 18:29:26

The fordson dextra diesel, test #684 ,1959, was the first pto test, not the JD435.

The JD A was mentioned as being the first tractor the have a Hydraulic Lift.

1953, the 800 hitch, available on the 50,60,70 was the first North American category 2 stlye 3pt and helped influence the ASAE standard.

My info was based on references from Wendel's Nebraska Test book and from Macmillan's JD Tractors and Equipment. Other source of good info can be found in Back issues of Green Mag and 2cyl.
Note: not everything you read is true. Just my 2cents.
Bill

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Chances R

01-07-2001 17:33:11

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

As far as the first diesel powered tractor go, I believe there were tractors in the 30's with diesels. The McCormick Deering WD-40 had a diesel in it and looked like a WK-40. Some of the Case L's had diesels in them. Sorry I cant help much with Deeres first.

my web page

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dave

01-07-2001 15:11:02

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

Actually, as good as John Deere tractors were and are, most of the big "firsts" in tractors went to other makes i.e.
First tractor to use the name "tractor" -Hart-Parr, which became Oliver and then White.
First multi-purpose row-crop cultivator type tractor-International harvestor Farmall, circa 1924.
First integral engine-transmission-final drive as frame for tractor Fordson, circa 1918.
First three-point draft control hitch-Ford-ferguson, 1939.
First live PTO-Oliver, 1946..
First turbocharger Allis Chalmers D-19, 1964.

But to its credit, John Deere is the only tractor company left still in business with its original identity. All the others have been bought and sold and some have faded away, like Ford, International, etc.

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lonn

01-07-2001 18:47:00

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to dave, 01-07-2001 15:11:02

Also Allis had laid claim to the first unit frame construction in 1918 with the model 18-30 and it also had removeable wet cylinder sleeves. Then in the 20's the 18-30 was first to use fuel,oil, and air filters. I know this is not supposed to be about Allis, but I'm an Allis fan. Could fill a page with Allis first's.

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Mike

01-08-2001 18:19:16

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-07-2001 18:47:00

If you read a lot of the original books about
John Deere he was kind of a crook who stole
or bought ideas from other people then put his
name on them.There are even some valid arguments
about wheather John Deere invented the first
plow as they like to claim.I have seen articles
that claim a friend of JD actually produced a steel plow months before JD did,off the same
load of steel that was delivered to JD from the east.

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dave

01-12-2001 19:58:07

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Mike, 01-08-2001 18:19:16

Oliver was supposed to be a pioneer with low-draft chilled iron plows. ANd as for taking other companies ideas, it seems that most agricultural machinery companies bought up others and added their equipment to their lines. International Harvestor certainly did that, as did Deere, Oliver, etc., even Ford bought some implement companies. This happens to this day, just look at AGCO (Massey, White, Allis, etc.) and New Holland, which I think merged with Case nott too long ago

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lonn

01-07-2001 15:49:05

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to dave, 01-07-2001 15:11:02

About the D-19. It was also the first with dry aircleaner. The year was 1961.

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JLCOOK

01-07-2001 14:01:51

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

How about hydraulic powertrol and the remote cylinder. Or the powerlift?

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lonn

01-07-2001 15:44:31

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to JLCOOK, 01-07-2001 14:01:51

I believe the Allis B had remote hydraulics in 1937. I own a 1939 B with this option. Also have a 1931 ad of IU allis with hydraulic loader. MM had a cab before the R. I think it was called the UDLX or something. The first diesel tractor, I think, was either Cat or IH, anyway wasn't Deere.

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JLCOOK

01-07-2001 19:37:16

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-07-2001 15:44:31

Lonn, was your 1937 AC "B" made before 1929 like the JD "GP" introduced that year? The 1929 GP had power lift. By the way, does that B have single or double acting hydraulic capability like the JD hydraulic powertrol introduced in 1947? Or are we talking about a rockshaft which is really what power lifts are? JLC

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lonn

01-08-2001 01:05:40

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to JLCOOK, 01-07-2001 19:37:16

The B Allis had single acting remote hydraulics in 37' and the Allis All Crop tractor, later renamed the UC, had a power lift in 1929 also. The UC introduced a five minute Quick Attach cultivator in 1929, which lead to the Quick Attach mounted corn picker in 1941. The corn picker had many first's such as a low profile unmatched by any picker ever built and stipper plates, unheard of in 41', which were adjustable on the go like modern corn heads of today. If you need to hear more Allis first's I will gladly provide.

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G Taylor A in 34........ sort of

01-07-2001 17:12:24

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-07-2001 15:44:31

The model "A" in April 34 could be equiped with a hydraulic lift.

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dar

01-07-2001 11:42:03

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

I think the model 70 in 1953 came with power steering.

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G Taylor

01-07-2001 11:45:22

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to dar, 01-07-2001 11:42:03

Factory power steering was officaly avalable for the 1955 model year.

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Dan

01-07-2001 13:46:16

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to G Taylor , 01-07-2001 11:45:22

My 1954 JD gas std 70 which is a 1954 according to the serial # has factory power steering.

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JLCOOK

01-07-2001 13:59:33

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Dan, 01-07-2001 13:46:16

Power steering became availiable in April 1954 for
the 50, 60, and 70. My 70 gas has power steering,
and was made around the end of May, 1954.

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G Taylor late 54 or 55 model year? was late 54 after all

01-07-2001 17:09:52

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to JLCOOK, 01-07-2001 13:59:33

Power steering was introduced in April 54 at the tail end of the 54 production year. Was thinking of the 70D's 1st production year & ours having power steering in 55.

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Dan in CA

01-07-2001 11:37:01

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Re: JD history question. in reply to Curious, 01-07-2001 10:50:25

Deere's first diesel, the "R" was introed to dealers in 1948 and became available for the 1949 season.

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Gord

01-07-2001 13:10:19

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Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Dan in CA , 01-07-2001 11:37:01

The R was also the first to come with a factory cab.

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klyde

01-07-2001 15:46:58

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Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Gord, 01-07-2001 13:10:19

WRONG---- JI CASE had a factory cab for 1929 L and C its in the parts book!!!!

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HiK

01-08-2001 07:59:16

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to klyde, 01-07-2001 15:46:58

Deere was the first company to have a GOOD cab, lest we forget the Sound-Gard body.....I think it was a pretty big step, without it, I'd be alot deafer than I am now, and I need all the hearing I can get!!!!

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lonn

01-08-2001 11:37:42

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to HiK, 01-08-2001 07:59:16

What was the first cab to break the 80dba sound barrier? The 7000 series Allis in 1973 with 78dba. Then broke that record again in 1977 with 77dba on the Black Belly 7000's. Now the 8000 series cab in 1981 was a real cab, largest in the industry for a long time.

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HiK

01-08-2001 23:06:26

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-08-2001 11:37:42

I had to drive an Allis for a day, and the best part of it was not having to get in and out much. Could they have made it much more difficult? :)

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G Taylor where is Alis now?

01-08-2001 11:57:18

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-08-2001 11:37:42

Where is Alis now?

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lonn

01-08-2001 16:24:14

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to G Taylor where is Alis now?, 01-08-2001 11:57:18

Called Allis Gleaner Company, American owned and much larger world wide than Deere could ever hope. Not that bigger is better. Allis-Chalmers had poor marketing and even worse management during the 70,s & 80's. Used money made by Ag line to support lines that were losing money for many years such as Electrical transformers, hydro turbines, large scale generators and ship engines to name a few. Now all the old Allis-Chalmers has left is a hydro electric repair business in Texas.

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BOZO

01-08-2001 18:25:23

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-08-2001 16:24:14

Not larger! If you take AGCo (which includes Agco Allis Massey Ferguson, Hesston, White, Gleaner, New Idea, Agcostar, Landini (North America), Tye, Farmhand, Glencoe, Deutz (South America), Fendt, Spra-Coupe and Willmar) with revenues of 1.68 bill (loss of 4.2 mill) PLUS CNH (Case, McCormick, Ford, New Holland, Verstile ..) 7.77 bill (loss of 247 mill) plus what they sold to Buhler (some of NH), the total is smaller than DEERE with sales of 13.13 billion.

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Hey BOZO

01-11-2001 16:00:52

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to BOZO, 01-08-2001 18:25:23

I think your figures include industial equipment sales for JD. If your talking gross sales of ag. equipment I think AGCO & FIAT are each bigger than JD by a long ways. Massey tractors sell more units world wide than any other brand period. Without Allis buying Massey the name Massey would be just history. Either Fiat or AGCO are the king of ag not JD.

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Bozo

01-12-2001 01:01:22

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Hey BOZO, 01-11-2001 16:00:52

Go to,>Link
I recall (possibly incorectly) that it was not Allis that bought Massey, but rather another entity that bought up the the companies that comprise AGCO today.

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lonn

01-12-2001 15:45:45

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Bozo, 01-12-2001 01:01:22

Allis Gleaner Co. was formed in 1990 by old company men from Allis-Chalmers & Duetz-Allis. After the company was formed one of the first things they did was change back to corp. orange then they proceeded to buy other companies such as White, Massey, and many others. No, I don't think Allis has made industial equipment for a long time and I believe if you're talking strictly ag equipment AGCO is the largest in the world.

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Bozo

01-13-2001 12:48:54

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to lonn, 01-12-2001 15:45:45

Lonn,
It doesn't matter what you or I believe, or what a company puts in their advertisements. What counts is what is in the Financial Report. If that is untrue, someone loses their job or goes to jail. You apparently have access to the Internet. Type>Link
Along with the other information, under Market Capitalization, you can see what the investment world thinks each company is worth. Opinion - "By the way if you want a better tractor than the D-17, consider the 30X0 or 40X0, the items in the line that were primarily responsibile for dragging every major Ag manufacturer in this country to or over the brink of bankruptcy."

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Not Deere

01-09-2001 17:29:01

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to BOZO, 01-08-2001 18:25:23

Don't here JD claiming the title. Because THEY CAN'T!

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BOZO

01-10-2001 08:10:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to Not Deere, 01-09-2001 17:29:01

I made no claim about the title. I merely refuted the nonsense that Allis is larger than Deere. Deere is larger than the residue of Allis, Case, IH, Ford, NH, et. al.. A simple statement of fact.

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BOZO

01-08-2001 19:37:24

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: JD history question. in reply to BOZO, 01-08-2001 18:25:23

Oops, I only had figures for three quarters for Agco and CNH. Mp. by 4/3 would raise the total to about 12. billion.

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