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John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
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JD A piston clearance?

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Andy In IL

02-11-2007 19:58:18




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I have a 1937 JD A,I got the block bored to 125 over and ordered new pistons after I found out that the 90 over I had for the machine shop to use would not clear some of the pits so I told them to go 125. I got alium. pistons and I wonder what the piston clearance is for alium. The old I T manual I have don't say on alium only 5-8 thousandths on cast iron. I beleive it is more on alium since it expands more than cast. Thanks.

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Earl-IL

02-12-2007 08:08:22




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 19:58:18  
Andy, No machine shop should bore & finish a block without the pistons to check & protect their work. If your pistons don't have the clearance built into them ,then get some that does. Call Jerry at Hinrichs 815-778-1900 In Illinois. He double checks his before they go out the door.If you go boring & honing the bores bigger to get the clearance ,that makes your ring end gap too large. Ring sizes are based on std. bore plus oversize. (Example 5.500 + .125 = 5.625) Stop right now & get it right.In 30 years I have found 3-5 piston that wasn't right. I have used all manufactures of pistons except for some of the imports that I see out there now. Good luck with your project. Earl In Illinois

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Sam in MN.

02-12-2007 04:59:19




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 19:58:18  
For what it's worth, I just installed 0.090" aluminum pistons in my 48-A. The pistons did not come undersized, so we had to take the bore out larger to get the 0.010 to 0.012" piston skirt clearance that was needed for aluminum.

IMPORTANT: Take some measurements of the Piston Skirt diameters first thing, to make sure! The bore could end up too small or even worse, too large.

Sam

Measure twice, cut once as they say.....

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Andy In IL

02-11-2007 20:12:12




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 19:58:18  
Mike n mo, What you are saying is the block should be bore and honed at5.675 if the pistons are built to fit? If this is what I understand. Right now I put the piston in and measure the bottom skirt with a feeler gauge with some drag at 6 thousandths which I feel should be more.



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F-I-T

02-12-2007 07:00:47




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 20:12:12  
third party image

Andy:

In my opinion, that is not the right way to measure the piston clearance, and you'll probably point yourself toward too much overboring if you do. Since you are at the last overbore (.125") before sleeving back, I would be really careful about going too large.

You need to measure that piston top to bottom, in three sections, left to right and fore and aft, so you get the dimensions of the "cylinder" that the piston fills. Many times pistons are no longer the correct form. Remember, because of some piston design, pistons are not always round. Many have an eccentric form established by a master cam on a rotary mill. Get the correct measurements from a book, then compare those to your piston. If the piston is squished in one direction and fat in another, you can re-form them with a deadblow, soft-faced hammer. The JD official service book even shows that procedure for tractors like my 70D, when Deere began to install aluminum pistons from the factory. Check your pistons carefully, 6 places, using a proper micrometer, not with a feeler gauge.

Also, have you checked the ring end gap by sliding each ring squarely using the top of a piston, and measuring the remaining gap? If the ring gap is good, and then you over bore to "fit" the piston, you'll have an excess ring gap, and risk some permanent blow-by.

Before I would give up any of that bore which you can never get pack, I would get a good, known, quality, 5-6" mike, not a caliper, and measure until I was certain that I knew the true shape and form of those pistons.

Frank

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Mike n Mo

02-12-2007 05:03:01




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 20:12:12  
6 thousandths would be tight for aluminum pistons. If you're not too far from the shop where you had it bored, you might consider taking both the pistons and block in and have them measure the piston with a micrometer and the bore with a bore gauge and see how they compare. The block may need to be honed out a few thou for the correct fit. In theory, If the block were bored/honed to 5.625 the pistons should fit correctly, but most shops like to have the pistons in hand so they can fit them correctly due to manufacturing variations/tolorances. Mike

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Mike n Mo

02-11-2007 20:04:11




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Andy In IL, 02-11-2007 19:58:18  
Aluminum pistons for an A should have around 12 thousands clearance. The extra clearance should be "built in" to the piston by the manufacturer. Mike



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Andy In IL

02-12-2007 15:22:44




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 Re: JD A piston clearance? in reply to Mike n Mo, 02-11-2007 20:04:11  
Thanks guys I understand everything now. I'm a type of guy that I have to see it drawing out to see or explain in 2nd grade level maybe 8th grade. Ha! Thanks again. Andy



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