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51B Engine Related Restoration Questions

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Greg F

12-21-1999 19:29:59




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So now I have both pistons and the block on the bench. It has automotive style rod bearings. Please comment on any of the following questions: 1) The rod cap nuts finger spin on. They have thin castellation type slots (not designed for cotterpins and no hole in bolt either). Are these wore out and supposed to be tight? 2) The rods and caps have prick punch marks just like I would do on a car motor for matching caps and location during an overhaul. Did JD ever do this from the factory or is this a definate sign someone has been here before. 3) The top ring groove is wore in both pistons and on one there is severe erosion in one area of the top ring groove. It appears the ring gap aligned with the thin wall section and blowby eroded the immediate area. Can I buy new pistons or is this a used part search from some of the suggested places? Also What are some of the favorite sealers you guys use on gaskets where the manual say shellac, say like Permatex Hi-Tack? Thanks, Greg

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Scott

12-23-1999 21:22:19




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 Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to Greg F, 12-21-1999 19:29:59  
Greg, As far as sealer for the gaskets, I used Ultra Copper made by permatex. Dont use the Blue silicone, its doesnt work very well and is not too good at high temps. The ultra copper is pretty good stuff, but you dont need a whole lot. A little dap will do ya. As far as pistons, Power seal pistons are your best bet. I used them in my 52 A and also put chrome rings in. I have no problems.Good luck. Scott

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Mike Aylward

12-23-1999 05:55:16




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 Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to Greg F, 12-21-1999 19:29:59  
Greg, it sounds like your B has been rebuilt sometime before you got it. The insert-type rods and the type of nut on the rod bolts are factory replacement parts. The nuts are what is known as "Marsden type" according to my factory service bulletins. They could be used with the old-style bolts with cotter pin holes or with the new type rods that did not have the holes. They were designed for the convenience of not having to mess with the cotter pins. They will spin on when loose but will tighten up to the bolt when torqued. DO NOT mash these as that will distort the torque reading and may actually make the nut hold to the bolt less, not more. Hope this helps. Mike

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DP

12-22-1999 04:32:51




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 Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to Greg F, 12-21-1999 19:29:59  
Hi Greg, The castiled end of the nut can be put in a vice and squeezed just a little. Squeeze just the end, and be sure to turn the nuts as to squeeze all sides in. The markings are factory. One should be marked with one mark on each, the rod and cap, the other, two on each. No. one being the flywheel side. Also with the marks to the top. The insert type bearings were used in the late model A, B, and G's. Many earlier models were switched over through the years.New pistons can be bought from JD in standard and .045 oversize. You also can get new pistons from Power Seal in Des Moines, Ia. in standard, .045, .090, or .125 oversize. Good luck, Don

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Greg F

12-22-1999 08:06:41




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 Re: Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to DP, 12-22-1999 04:32:51  
Don, I am borrowing telescoping gages to determine if I will need oversize pistons so I don't know yet. I did call a JD dealer for a price on a .045 set (to determine my budget)but he said none of the numbers I gave him are recognized (AB 3922 R - Piston, Two B2383R .045" Oversize, with rings (Gasoline)(Sub. for AB3723R)). Also I am having no luck finding a phone number for Power Seal in Des moines, IA. If you have their phone number or any other info, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks Greg F

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DP

12-22-1999 20:04:48




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 Re: Re: Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to Greg F, 12-22-1999 08:06:41  
Greg, try cleaning the face of the piston real good. Usally oversize pistons are stamped on the face. The phone number for Power Seal is 1-800-627-7171 Good Luck, Don



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Greg F

12-23-1999 05:44:49




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to DP, 12-22-1999 20:04:48  
Don, I haven't cleaned the face yet but last night I did borrow instruments and got solid confirmation the bore is .045" over with minimal wear. I'll give the number a try today. Thank you for your help. Merry Christmas, Greg



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Ron Dzat

12-21-1999 20:52:51




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 Re: 51B Engine Related Restoration Questions in reply to Greg F, 12-21-1999 19:29:59  
Greg The nuts on rod caps will spin on finger tight but there should be cotter pin holes in each stud,at least there is in my 47 b, If yours are castilated nuts and there are no holes in studs then the nuts are worn and should be replaced, they should spin easy the first few threads then get tight and hard to turn, maybe when they (JD) went to insert type bearings they also changed fasteners maybe somebody out there knows for sure.Caps are marked from the factory.There are several places to get new pistons they are still available in aluminum or steel. On my rebuild I used high temp silicone in some cases I used it instead of the gasket. I do not have one single leak on my tractor so far, on the head gasket the book says to soak it in oil, I did'nt instead I used copper coat spray, these sealers have always worked well for me on other rebuilds so I can't see why should'nt work on our tractors, of course there will be other opinions on this. Ron

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