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John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
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Stuck 4440 PS

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John in Md.

10-08-2005 07:11:00




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I just found a 1980 4440 PS that has been sitting for a long time (they say 8-10 years), last batterirs were from 1989. It's been sitting long enough that the muffler has rotted off. The motor is seized and the paint is faded, will need tires, and the interior is dry rotted etc. Sheet metal is good and the clock shows 4500 hrs (looks honest looking at the wear on the interior). They say they parked it because the injection pump was fluttering (racing up from idle). How much should I offer? Is it worth fixing as a winter project or should I keep looking?

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Dingaling

10-08-2005 16:48:42




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to John in Md., 10-08-2005 07:11:00  
John...Where in Maryland are you from???? I am in Calvert....I just can"t imagine a 4440 PS sitting around for years in MD. and someone not doing anything about it. Guess I am just curious and not interested, Thanks



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John in Md.

10-09-2005 02:15:48




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Dingaling, 10-08-2005 16:48:42  
It's in Ohio.



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F-I-T

10-08-2005 14:00:42




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to John in Md., 10-08-2005 07:11:00  
John:

I rebuilt a 4440 in 1983 that had had a cab fire, and in 1983 dollars, I had $5,000 in the cab alone. I also had to have some P/S work done to be sure of what I had, and the engine had had some cavitation and the sleeves were on the brink of pitting through, so I installed a kit. Total then was probably $10K in parts, paint, minimal dealer work, and so, mostly my labor. I didn't lose any money on it, and it was a fun project, but if I were you, I would probably look for a running one that needs skin type repairs as opposed to one that you know probably has to be opened up to end up being dependable.

That was 20+ years ago, and you can probably extrapolate what it might cost you today.

HTH

Frank

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Ducknose Bob

10-08-2005 09:19:50




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to John in Md., 10-08-2005 07:11:00  
I was a JD tech, and I have often thought of buying and rebuilding 4020's, but as long as people think that the dead ones are worth as much as one in running condition, it is not possible to come out ahead on what you would have invested into it, even including your "free" labor.
At the time your 4440 was parked for injection pump problems the labor to overhaul it was about half what it is now, why wasn't it fixed then, what else is wrong with it? Offer them scrap value, or a little more, but if it needs transmission or rear end work, plus tires, plus this, and plus that, you will find that you will soon have $18-$20K in a $18-$20K tractor.
But you are correct, I have started noticing more and more 30 and 40 series parked dead, because the owner does not want to fix them.

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Ducknose Bob

10-08-2005 11:04:17




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Ducknose Bob, 10-08-2005 09:19:50  
I think GMan is WAY optimistic on a $10K price, what it boils down to is, that everything on it is an unknown. What does the rest of their equipment look like, is their farm a dump, all this tells you whether or not they take care of their machinery, did they farm themselves out of business, but the question remains as to why they parked a tractor over a relatively minor repair? Did it have a loader or a blade on it and was it used as a CaT?, Did they try to work it like a 200 horse tractor? 99 per cent of these people farming with junk wouldn't take care of their equipment if someone gave them all new machinery to start off with, or else they have no credit to make repairs because they are deadbeats. I forgot to mention rebuilding the AC, or replacing the brakes, no anti-freeze?. Personally, I would insult them to their face with a 1500-2000 offer.

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John in Md.

10-08-2005 13:26:48




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Ducknose Bob, 10-08-2005 11:04:17  
OK, the story is: the money got tight, leased out the ground, and it's been sitting since the husband passed away. Like I said its not hammered up, drawbar looks good hitch is tight, no evidence of any leaks. The oil is dark not cloudy,antifreeze is up to the top, trans is almost on the full mark and there's no evidence of a loader on the frame rails. If you guys are old enough you will remember there were some tough times in the eighties and money was tight. The man probably thought it would run forever and he had just finished paying it off and he got himself pinched up and this may be what finished him off.
Hard to tell because the son thinks it just needs the pump gone through and then it's worth $20,000 and I'm trying to steal it.

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Ducknose Bob

10-08-2005 14:07:30




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to John in Md., 10-08-2005 13:26:48  
So he is thinking a re-built injection pump is going to cure the stuck engine? Plus you are still looking at tires, a cab interior, new filters and fluids, and AC work, at a minimum. Maybe this brings the price down to an average 4430, which is right in line with G/Man's estimate.



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G/MAN

10-08-2005 11:17:36




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Ducknose Bob, 10-08-2005 11:04:17  
$1500-$2000 would be nice, but I don't think anyone in their right mind is going to go for that. All you have to do is pick up a copy of Fastline or an Abilen Machine catalog to see that it's worth more than that. The cab alone is worth a fair chunk of change, as the new replacement cabs are VERY expensive. If you want to get it bought, insulting the owner isn't much of a way to do it. $10,000 would the high-end of what I'd offer, knowing that I could do every bit of whatever repair it needs myself. Because it's a fact that good 4440s are bringing anywhere from $20,000 - $30,000, if selling at a profit were the idea. It sounds like a screwy deal all the way around to me, and if I were looking for a working tractor instead of a project to turn into a working tractor, I'd be looking for a running 4440.

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Ducknose Bob

10-08-2005 12:50:14




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to G/MAN, 10-08-2005 11:17:36  
I would be leery of the tractor as it has single 20.8's on it, lots of drawbar work, pulling a scraper maybe? It would be nice to find out what the old boy up at Beattie, KS. is paying for the dead New Generation, Generation II and on up that he is parting out. We know 2 things, A: He has a lot tied up in inventory, and B: Hopefully, he is making money.
Where I last worked the dealer had 2 8630's that were left when the owners found out they were too expensive to repair, the dealer in Hamilton had a 8440 that set out in the weeds after it was split for either a clutch or a two speed. These local, govt. subsidized dairy farmers would go up into Kansas and Oklahoma and pick up these 4WD's thinking they got a bargain, and I can just imagine the salesman laughing all the way to the bank, after selling them some wore out POS, that he never would have sold otherwise, waving saranara as the Holstien Herder went back south with his new found "bargain", and maybe a "free" cap.

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G/MAN

10-09-2005 14:32:10




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Ducknose Bob, 10-08-2005 12:50:14  
I don't know what Nolte pays for tractors. I imagine every case is different. I haven't done business with him personally, but I've only heard good things about the parts he sells and that the shop is clean enough to eat off the floor. There is a huge market for good used parts, so if a guy runs a good business, as it sounds like he does, I'm sure he's very successful. I'm from that general area, but the Nebraska side of the fence, and I'm not currently living in my hometown area. We run into those "good deals" occasionally around here. Guys buy "Southern Belles" on the internet, usually Deere 8000s, and think they're getting a good deal because they're dirt cheap. The last one required the hitch frame AND differential housing to be replacing because the drawbar mounting hardware had been pulled completely out of it, more than likely by pulling a scraper. Also has some tranny issues that required that to be pulled. I've got a good idea the owner is wishing he would have paid more for a good tractor from this area with a known service history.

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John in Md.

10-08-2005 10:42:12




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to Ducknose Bob, 10-08-2005 09:19:50  
What do you think scrap value would be?



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G/MAN

10-08-2005 07:28:00




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to John in Md., 10-08-2005 07:11:00  
Sounds like they were thinking - parked a tractor worth anywhere from $20,000-$25,000 in good running condition in today's market for want of a $2000 injection pump. 4440s are hot property. What it will take to get running depends on what's wrong. Figure sleeves and pistons and more than likely some cylinder-head work at the bare minimum. It won't take long to get $5000 in the engine, and possibly much more to get it 100% squared away. Interior pieces aren't bad. The upholstery comes in kits, and just requires some patience and elbow-grease to do it correctly. Does it have duals on it or anything? How many hydraulic outlets? What you want to offer depends on what you can do as far as repairs yourself and what you'll need to farm out. If I were going to buy it and get it back in good shape (I'm a JD technician with a lot of experience with 4440s), I'd probably be looking to get it for $10,000 or maybe a little less. My labor would be "free", so all it would "cost" would be parts to get it back in good shape, and up around that $20,000 value. But I'd keep it, lol. I like 4440s.

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John in Md.

10-08-2005 07:47:50




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 Re: Stuck 4440 PS in reply to G/MAN, 10-08-2005 07:28:00  
Single 20.8x38's. Three remotes. Weight bracket on front, nothing on back. I figure I can do everything but the head and the pump. Kit is about $1000, the head about $500, the pump about $6-700.
I was planning on changing the A/C over and using it before I got in any deeper, and see where to go on it next.



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