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Having Problems deciding can you help???

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Cummins trouble

03-09-2003 18:51:33




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Hi I have a 96 dodge diesel with a cummins in it and i was wondering what kind of a super charger to put in it? Can someone help plz...!!!!!




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Keith

03-12-2003 11:52:48




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
Cummins girl, if you are looking for information on upgrades to you CTD go to www.turbodieselregister.com The site is entirely dedicated to the cummins turbo diesel. By far the best web site I have found for information and links regarding the cummins. You can read through the discussion forums for free, but if you want to search past forums you will have to join the club. There is info on the websit about joining if you are interested. They are to cummins diesels what "Yesterdays Tractor" is to ageless iron. Good luck.

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Jason Check picture Dodge does have torque

03-10-2003 20:15:46




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
Check this out


http://www.dodge-diesel.org/yabbse/gallery/displayimage.php?album=topn&pid=8



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Jeff

03-10-2003 18:03:08




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
Ok all the bshing and arguing of which is better aside, What are you wanting out of your Dodge? You wanting useable pulling power for trailer hauling, better milage,or building a pulling truck that sounds and looks like a Pro Stock tractor? As for a supercharger I am not even sure if they make a kit for one since they have turbo's intsead. When you figure out what kind of power you are wanting the easilest thing I could say id to do a search on the Web for companies who do that and see what is out there. There are also several good Web pages devoted to any of the 3 major truck builders with diesels that you can get a wealth of info from.

NOw We do have a 96 Dodge 1 ton that we haul tractors with. It had never hauled 20,000 # at 110 mph and since it has 4:10 gears I am not even sure it will run that fast. But who cares , If I want to run that fast I'll buy a gas truck. We had a 96 ford PSD before this one with the same gears in it both 5 speeds. Personally I like the way a Dodge hauls a trailer better but I have friends who like the PSD better. As for modifying them, there is as much stuff out there for one as there is the other.

On another note, someon on here posted tha Dodge wil use a Mercedes Diesel in the future. Any idea or honest knowlege how it will compare to the Cummins? Mercedes has been building them for a long time so who knows?

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John

03-10-2003 05:53:45




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
What type of transmission do you have? If you tow a lot, and have a 5/6 speed, I'd install a HX 40 turbo and have a #5 or 3 fuel plate. You'd really run then. If that wasn't enough, installa a set of diamond B 370 marine injectors. You can get horsepower out of these easily and somewhat cheap compared to powerchokes. They're not too bad of an engine either but if towing all the time, they don't have the torque and don't get the mileage.

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Rodney A Johnson

03-10-2003 06:29:41




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to John, 03-10-2003 05:53:45  
No torque? Won't last on long pulls? Let see...how many v diesel engines do you see in farm tractors? Or any v engines at all? How many v engines do you see in the big rigs (my uncle put over 1 millions miles on a rebuild he did on a Cummins 400 in his Freightliner)?

Do you know why Ford has 51% invested in Cummins? They wanted exclusive rights to put the Cummins 5.9 in their 2 ton trucks. Yes the same engine as in the Dodge 1 ton pickups...just a different turbo and fuel injection setup.

I asked a Ford pickup salesman when they were going to put the Cummins 5.9 in their 1 tons. His reply was that the NaviStar was "too successful" and there was no need to switch. Yet what was the engine that brought Dodge back into the running has a pulling truck? Yep the Cummins 5.9. The reason why Ford won't put the Cummins 5.9 into their 1 tons is the economics. Cheaper to put in the NaviStar. Oh and the other reason...bad press...would make Ford look like it made a mistake with the NaviStar if they put in the Cummins.

I'm Ford almost all the way, but if I had to make a choice on just engine, Ford wouldn't be a winner. Far as I'm concerned the only thing good about the Dodge was/is the Cummins 5.9.

Keep in mind, the main reason why the Cummins will outlast the NaviStar has to do with 7 main bearings vs. 5.

I have a 4.9 inline 6 in an F150 with 160,000+ miles and it is just like new...just wish the rest of the truck was "like new".

One last tidbit...I heard a number of years ago (don't know if there is truth to this) that Cummins approached Ford first. Ford was ready to go with the Cummins, but refused when Cummins told Ford they had to get a better drive train, as the current one would not handle the torque of the Cummins. That is supposedly how Dodge got the opportunity to go with Cummins.

Just my thoughts and observations.

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Robert in W. Mi

03-10-2003 09:08:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Rodney A Johnson, 03-10-2003 06:29:41  
I won't pick all of your post apart, but i can tell you ford does NOT own any part of Cummins, and it NEVER has had a controling interest of Cummins in any way! This BS keeps getting repeated over and over, and has never been true. BTW, D10 and D11 CATS have V diesels in them, and the reason the 6 cyclinder Cummins has more main berrings is, it's a "longer engine", and NEEDS more. Yes, i like my Cummins, but i hate seeing the rumors continueing to be repeated. Robert

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Rodney A Johnson

03-11-2003 06:41:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Robert in W. Mi, 03-10-2003 09:08:35  
Thanks for correcting me...I foolishly believed the post regarding the ownership along with other (apparently unreliable) information regarding Cummins and Ford.

I still stand behind the 7 vs. 5 main bearings...sure the crank is longer. But the fact still remains (and it is fact) the inlines last longer under stress than the v engines because of the extra bearings.

Another factor for v vs. inline is the engine cooling aspects. Inline engines tend to run cooler, because there is more metal to air ration per cylinder. That is the block makes a better heat sink on an inline resulting in cooler operating temperatures. This will also extend the life of an engine.

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Preacher John

03-10-2003 06:07:09




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to John, 03-10-2003 05:53:45  
Cummins doesn't have the torque? I have driven both. The cummins has tons of low end torque for easy towing. The ford powerstroke you must floor the throttle and wait a few seconds for anything to happen. Thats my experience. Preacher John



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John

03-10-2003 07:54:25




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 Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Preacher John, 03-10-2003 06:07:09  
Boys:

I was meaning that the V-8 diesels don't have the torque compared to an inline engine. The V-8's fall off of their torque curve quite easily loaded and to the floor. I like cummins. Don't get to harsh on me, I was telling the advantages of the cummins compared to the two disadvantages of the powerchoke.

John



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Lee

03-09-2003 23:39:54




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
You can re-scroll your current turbo charger pretty economicaly or re-size it entirely if the funds are there. None of which will really do any good until you put in some injectors that squirt more fuel, and that equals more $$$ too. Try this site for more info on the subject in general and follow the links for some Pickup truck kits for your Dodge.

Psst...Ford man, the Dodge already has an air to air intercooler on it. nuff said?

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Preacher John

03-09-2003 19:37:16




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
Cummins girl, I think your dodge already has a turbo charger. The turbo is better suited for a diesel motor than a supercharger as the supercharger doesn't begin to produce boost until higher rpms. I would stick with your turbo. If it's performance your looking for you could look into a 4 inch exhaust upgrade, a fuel timing plate or fueling box (depending if your engine uses a computer or not), and maybe some high performance injectors. You can get hopped turbos too. Try this link.

Link


There are tons of aftermarket parts for the dodge cummins. If high performance is what you want I can give you a whole list of websites that will help you satisfy your power cravings. Best of luck. Preacher John

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bob

03-10-2003 06:41:33




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Preacher John, 03-09-2003 19:37:16  
Preacher, you got it backwards. A supercharger is ALWAYS pumping air, as they are driven by the crankshaft through a variety of drives (belts, gears) depending on the engine manufacturer. A turbocharger only builds boost when there is adequate exhaust pressure to spool up the turbo, and trust me, this isn't happening at idle. It's the turbo'ed motors that have the lag time....



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Preacher John

03-10-2003 11:55:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to bob, 03-10-2003 06:41:33  
Hey bob your right superchargers do make boost when the engine is turning (well in theory).
And I didn't ever say that a turbo made boost at idle. I guess I didn't give a thorough explanation in the previous post. The problem with putting a supercharger on a diesel is that diesels don't turn very many rpms and the supercharger isn't going to be able to produce enough boost to be able to take advantage of the diesel's full potential. The superchargers we have just aren't capable of making the same boost as a turbo will. The turbo on the other hand spools up on the exhaust gases and will do this at low rpms. and diesels typically run at low rpms. This is why we see turbos NOT superchargers on diesels. I know, I know the old 2 cycle detroits used blowers but thats totally different. Take for instance my fathers Dodge cummins that I recently souped up. At full throttle it will make forty pounds of boost. And it will make this kind of boost very low on the rpm band. My father's previous truck was a ford gas motor with a supercharger on it. That POS barely made 5 lbs with the engine flat buzzing. I mean you would think the motor was about to fly apart. Why would you want to attempt turning a diesel 6000 rpms just to build a measily 5 or ten or even 15 lbs boost with a supercharger when you could have a turbo make more boost than you can use, at 1500 rpm or more? You are right the supercharger always pumps air, it just won't pump enough of it to realize the full power that a diesel engine can give. A supercharger turns only as fast as the engine can turn it where as a turbo can easily spin up to 150,000 rpm when the engine is turning considerably slower. Well to compensate, I guess you could bolt a huge 3 foot pulley onto the crankshaft of a supercharged engine. I think I will stick with my turbo for now.

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Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!

03-09-2003 19:25:29




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 Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Cummins trouble Girl, 03-09-2003 18:51:33  
Don't fool with supin' up that dodge. Buy a Powerstroke Diesel! Ford owns 51% of Cummins stock and they still use their own motor....I wonder why???? Besides, supercharging a 6cyl diesel wouldn't be worth the trouble.(It's already got a turbo) If you want performance get a 7.3 and add an intercooler and power chip! But do whatever makes you happy....I know what I would choose!



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Ray

03-10-2003 19:26:53




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
I've had a couple of both the Powerstroke and
the cummins,and my new Duramax will out run
either stock.The last cummins I had fell apart
at 30000 miles when a dowell pin vibrated out
of the block,and went into the timing gears.A friend of mine who owns a trucking company has
been having trouble with Cummins engines cracking
sleeves about 2 inches down in the bore.The last
20 trucks he ordered have Detroit engines and
auto tranny's.

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Robert in W. Mi

03-10-2003 09:13:19




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
Keep dreaming!!! Robert



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Walt

03-10-2003 07:05:33




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
I have to agree the Ford has a fair bit of power but the Cummins has better fuel economy. I drive a Ford PSD,I have a cummins in my Kenworth. For your info Ford has sold their shares in Cummins.



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Steve D.

03-10-2003 06:28:00




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
I love my Cummins powered 01 Dodge Quad cab! I consistantly get 20 to 22 mpg at 70+ mph. What does the Ford get?



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John T (Vote for Cummins)

03-09-2003 20:00:14




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
Hey Ford Man, This is outa my area, but in good taste and in a friendly respectable fashion, I will stick my neck out lol and defend the Cummins a bit. As you know, the Ford oughta put out more, cuz for one its 7.3 versus I beleive 5.9 litres for the Cummins. However, Cummins has had tonsssss ss of experience in building in line 6 cylinder diesels and I once had an instructor who worked at Cummins who gave me some info on them time to time. If I recall, he said the N Series in line 6 cylinder was originally designed for oil field power unit use where it endured dirty condition full loads non stop except for maintanance. I have seen them at auctions in trucks with like 300,000 miles and they werent smoking or belching out oil or blue smoke while I heard of them Fords cracking blocks or heads. Anyway, Im sure the Fords bigger cubes puts out more hP and I have no idea if those other things I heard are true (true though the ones Ive sen at auctions), but I think I would go with the Cummins if I ever bought a truck. One mans opinion anyway. Good topic and discussion. God Bless the USA Ol John T

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Willie

03-10-2003 06:50:41




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 Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to John T (Vote for Cummins), 03-09-2003 20:00:14  
John T
Just to add a bit more info to the debate. The Cummins N is a 14 liter(855 cu in) used in most of the long haul rigs, although Cat & Detroit are catching up.
The B series that is used by Dodge was developed by Onan in the late 1970's for portable generators.
Ford wanted to buy the Onan engine to compete with the GM , but wanted a better engine.
Cummins caught wind of Ford's intentions & bought out the whole Onan company. Look at the sign at Cummins shops, they also service Onan generators.
The sign at Onan's home plant in Fridley Mn has been changes to "Cummins Power Generation"
This left Ford without a deisel, so they went to International & contracted to buy engines, but IHC would do the actual building.
In the near future, not sure of the date, Dodge will start using Mercedes deisels,through their corporate parentage-Chrysler-Daimler-Benz-Mercedes. This when their supply contract with Cummins runs out. Then Ford will be free to use Cummins.
By nature of the beast, an in-line 6 has more torque, but a V-8 is quicker off the line. Thoroughly confusing, clear as mud, but it covers the ground.
Willie

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G-MAN

03-10-2003 07:44:03




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Willie, 03-10-2003 06:50:41  
Cummins engines definitely produce more torque, but I'm not sure V-8s are quicker off the line. The case in point was my 1992 Dodge heavy-duty 3/4 ton 4X4 with a Cummins, auto and 3.54 gears. At the time I bought it, my uncle was driving a '93 GMC 1-ton 4X4 with a 6.5 turbo, 5-speed and 4.10s with a limited slip. Guys being what we are, we couldn't resist lining them up one night. I could have sworn he would have left me at the line, what with lower gears and stick, but we raced three times and it was basically a dead heat every time. The weights of the two trucks were very similar. That extra low-end torque is what allowed me to stay with him while his V-8 was getting wound up into it's higher-rpm powerband. He currently owns a '02 Dodge 3/4 ton 4X4 Quad-Cab shortbox with the high-output Cummins and the six-speed, and that truck is plain scary. First and second gear aren't even needed for normal driving, and punching it at 45 mph in 5th on gravel will put you in the ditch if you're not careful. It definitely wasn't safe, but we've hauled 14,000 lbs of round bales on a 6000 lb trailer and pulled it 110 mph with no problems. I've never seen any truck pull like that, and I've been around a couple Powerstrokes. I've done a lot of work on B-series Cummins, and they're simply unbeatable.

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Dr.Evil

03-10-2003 14:28:05




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to G-MAN, 03-10-2003 07:44:03  
Your kidding about pulling 20,000# of big hay bales 110 MPH right? That's what I LOVE about these truck debates.... Those little 5.9's ought to be under the hood of EVERY Freightliner, Pete & KW on the road.....Their Legendary power just keeps growing & growing & growing..... Heck.... Why does Cummins even make an engine over 6 liters? The 5.9 seems to be able to do anything.... Signed "Ex-TRD Member" Want to see the Pictures of the Family Connecting Rods?

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G-MAN

03-11-2003 05:11:03




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Dr.Evil, 03-10-2003 14:28:05  
I kid you not, that thing is an animal. That close-ratio six-speed and 4.10 rear really make it scream. The first time I drove it (without a trailer) I opened it up to see what it would do, and was running 120 mph before I knew what was going on, and it was still pulling hard. A friend of ours has a truck almost identical to my uncle's, and he put one of those power chips or whatever in it, and it's even scarier yet. He asked my uncle if he was going to put one in his, and he said "what the heck for? I already got more power than I need". I've never seen a Powerstroke (stock at least) that would come close to running with that Dodge. I might have to buy it when he trades again, lol.

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Robert in W. Mi

03-11-2003 07:35:13




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to G-MAN, 03-11-2003 05:11:03  
G-MAN you tell some tall tales!!! I think you better go out and see if someone didn't sneak some cal. into your radial tires last night while you were sleeping!! Maybe that will keep you out of trouble! :>) Robert



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G-MAN

03-11-2003 07:50:42




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Robert in W. Mi, 03-11-2003 07:35:13  
Come on down here to Nebraska and bring however much money you want to lose, and we'll see who's telling the tall tales. I've seen the truck run and saw it do everything I said it did. Do you want to make a little wager on it? I could use some more money for my project tractors....



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Dr.Evil

03-11-2003 08:52:49




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to G-MAN, 03-11-2003 07:50:42  
Point I was trying to make was I hope You weren't on public roads pulling a 20,000 trailer with big round bales 110 mph. What you do in Your hay field doesn't bother Me as long as You stay INSIDE the fences. Innocent people also have the priviledge of driving the same roads You do.... and they're not expecting an over-width over-loaded truck flying by at 110 mph. You DO realize how many times the stock HO's 245 HP rating it takes to pull a load like that don't You? Aerodynamic drag increases at the SQUARE of the increase of speed.

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Robert in W. Mi

03-11-2003 11:13:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Dr.Evil, 03-11-2003 08:52:49  
Not to mention that a Cummins Dodge with stock red line and 4:10 gears won't go 110mph enpty, let alone loaded!! Power has nothing to do with it!!!!! !!!!! I have one with 3:55's and it isn't geared high enough to go an honest 110mph!!! It just won't rev that high NO MATTER if it's loaded or enpty!!!
----- ----> Get your spedo caliberated!!!!! <----- ----- --- Yes, mine has a stick, oversize tires and overdrive!!! Robert

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G-MAN

03-11-2003 13:43:47




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Robert in W. Mi, 03-11-2003 11:13:44  
Like I said, how much do you want to lose? Give me the specs on your truck. My '92 (with a tach) would run right at 92 mph at 2500 rpm (governed out) with 3.54 gears and the overdrive automatic (A518 transmission). The newer Cummins trucks will run 3400 rpm or a little more (factory stock), and the overdrive in the six-speed (NV5600) is higher than the overdrive in the automatics. Do you still want to talk Dodge Cummins trucks with me? Between myself and my family, we own six of them - a '90, 2 - '92s, a '98, an '01, and an '02 - all 3/4 ton 4x4s, covering the entire range of engines - from the non-intercooled 12-valve to the H.O. 24-valve, and all the trannies, from the original three-speed/non-overdrive auto to the four-speed auto, to the NV4500 to the NV5600. I've probably been around a few more of them than you have, and I'd about guarantee I've worked on more of them than you have, so once again, how much cash do you want to lose? Also, considering the truck was brand-new at the time with the factory tires on it, I doubt the speedometer needs recalibrated. I'd be more than happy to give you my address and arrange a time to meet. Bring $500 and we'll see who's right - or you could continue to talk out of your posterior, like you've done so far. Or, I could give you my uncle's phone number and you could hear it straight from him. He has no reason to lie about it, and I don't either. I ain't afraid to put my money where my mouth is. Are you?

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G-MAN

03-11-2003 10:02:31




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Dr.Evil, 03-11-2003 08:52:49  
We were on a highway that was completely deserted - it sees very little traffic at any time, and you can see cars coming for miles. Like I said, it really doesn't matter to me whether anybody believes me or not. I was in the truck and I saw the speedometer. I'm not saying every similar truck will run like that, but that one does, and I'd be happy to prove it to anyone that wants to come here and bring some money. It won't take any time at all to throw 10 or 12 round bales of prairie hay on the 30 foot tandem dual flatbed and prove what it will do. There are also several elevators around to weigh the whole truck on. You mentioned 20,000 lbs. You forgot to figure in the approximately 7300 lbs the truck weighs. Like I said, I'd be more than happy to prove it to anyone that doubts it. That would keep us in beer money for a while, at least.

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Dr.Evil

03-12-2003 07:07:54




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to G-MAN, 03-11-2003 10:02:31  
Sounds like a good combination..... Beer, 30,000# gross truck/trailer, 15,000# tied on a trailer with a nylon strap.... and 110 mph. I think I'll pass. But thanks for the invite.



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Will P.

03-09-2003 19:51:21




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 Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Buy a FORD with a Powerstroke!, 03-09-2003 19:25:29  
Sorry, Ford uses an International Diesel. Not there own. So don't hype up Ford.

Will P.



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Diesel mechanic

03-10-2003 05:09:15




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 Re: Re: Re: Having Problems deciding can you help??? in reply to Will P., 03-09-2003 19:51:21  
I work on diesels for a living, I can tell you from experience there are pro's and cons to both. And in my opinion, As far as servicability there is no other choice than Cummins. International has a quality product, no doubt but I believe you will be seeing a Cummins offered up in the Fords before long. Just got a peak at the new 6.0 liter Powerstroke and I thought the old ones were a hood full, Less displacement and less room under the hood. Go figure? If I were buying I would go with the Cummins, just my opinion though.

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