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DEALER ETHICS?

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MICHAEL

02-25-2003 19:58:52




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I'm not sure how to proceed with this so I"m asking for some advice from you all. A little over a year ago I bought a used 3020 from my local dealer. It was in good shape and they took my old Farmall 340 in trade. They corrected a few minor problems after I used the tractor a week. I am now trying to convert it over to an alternator and in doing so I looked closely at the serial number tag on the rear of the tractor. It says 3010 and then the number. The removable trim shields on the tractor say 3020. I'm wondering if the dealer and I failed to check the serial number before he took it in as trade and then sold it to me. If it is a 3010 instead of a 3020 what does that mean to me? Do I have a complaint against this dealer. Is the difference between a 3010 and a 3020 something to bring up to him? I really like this tractor. I paid the going rate to buy a loader from this dealer when I got the tractor. It does everything I ask and more. What are your suggestions on how to go foreward with this?

Thanks in advance

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John2510-3020

02-26-2003 19:33:04




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
One quick way to find out is, where is the PTO lever? THe 3010 had it on the left side of the dash and the 3020 had it on the right side of the dash. Do your breaks have latch to lock them both togeahter? Also on your dash under the steering wheel, do you have a little removable cover, kinda looks like and ash tray type deal, or does the whole panel come off, by taking out one bolt, the panel will have the light swithch come off with it too. Hope this helps.
John

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michael

02-26-2003 21:23:13




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 Re: Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to John2510-3020, 02-26-2003 19:33:04  
Thanks John, From your last post I'm sure it is a 3010. Do you know of a site that will tell me the differences between a 3010 and 3020? What's the horsepower of my tractor? Plug gap and type to use.

Thanks again
Michael



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John2510-3020

02-27-2003 18:35:21




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 Re: Re: Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to michael, 02-26-2003 21:23:13  
No sorry I dont have a site but I have the plug and point gap as well as hp and anything else you need.
Plugs:0.025 Gas lp:0.015
points:0.022 with dist. cap retained by screws
points:0.022 with dist. cap ratained by spring clips. The only difference between the 2 is cam dwell. Your hp is around 55 for gas and LP gas and 59 for diesel.
I hope I was of some help just holler if you need anything else.
John

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John2510-3020

02-26-2003 19:34:39




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 Re: Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to John2510-3020, 02-26-2003 19:33:04  
I meant to say this is from looking from the seat to front of tractor sorry.
John



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ET

02-26-2003 05:22:48




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
You might have a cross breed tractor. I worked for a john deere dealer years ago and had a fellow bring in a 4020 for me to work on. I got the serial number and found it to be a 4010. This tractor had a late model 4020 engine in an early 4010 rear end, not only that the console had been changed from the 10 series with mounting handles bolted to the console suport to the later kind on the dash cover. The rear end was an early 10 series that didn't have a latch between the brake pedals and had the old single rivet flywheel timing hole cover. The point is it is not uncomon to find tractors this old that are put togeather out of a couple of tractors. As long as the tractor peforms properly, does the work you want and you didn't pay stupid money for it you are ok. The only problem is knowing what to order when it comes to parts.

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G-MAN

02-26-2003 05:17:44




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
As was previously mentioned, the first thing I'd do is pull out your copy of the sales contract and look at the serial # - it should be on there. If not, it could be an honest mistake. I've seen more than one salesman that would sell a 4020 as a 4560 if it had a 4560 sticker on it. Also as was mentioned, if you're happy with the tractor and don't feel you got shafted by buying a 3010 rather than a 3020, keep it and be happy. You might bring it to the dealer's attention, so they can correct any errors in their sales department and paperwork. You might also be able to use the slip-up for a little bargaining power on a future purchase.

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leon

02-26-2003 04:36:52




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
You say that you really like the tractor and that it does everything you want. Why not cut your losses and be happy with what you have? After all, what would you want in a settlement? The dealer just might trade you a 3020 that you wished you didn't own for the 3010 that you're happy with.



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ChuckW

02-26-2003 04:09:06




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
I would say that the dealer had the exact serial # of the tractor on his inventory list. In the pricing of the deal did you get a fair value(say that it was as 3010). When you approach the dealer you are embarking on uncharted waters as if you don't approach it correctly you will be initially accusing him of fraud. My approach would be to check on parts with him, taking the serial # in to the sales department and say that you thought you had purchased a 3020. The wrong approach would be to accuse them up front as it may be an overlooked issue. The first way gives them response room. It could be that they overlooked this from the seller....who knows...but fairness in approach is the best issue...

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motrack

02-25-2003 20:50:25




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
does your bill of sale have the tractor serial # on it?



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John T

02-25-2003 20:21:39




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 Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to MICHAEL, 02-25-2003 19:58:52  
Hey Michael, Looks like I gotta switch hats and take off my JD and Engineers hat and put on my Attorney hat for this one lol.

Anyway, laws vary state to state, of course, but I can lay some common law and statutes on you which is generally true in most of our jurisdictions. You asked if you have a "complaint" against the dealer: Well, there are legally recognized causes of action for Fraud/Misrepresentation, but to prevail in such, the Plaintiff has to prove by a preponderance of evidence the dealer with "knowledge" purposely intended to and committed fraud against you. HOWEVER, that "knowledge" element is a toughie to prove. Even, if he made a mistake to your disatvantage, thats still not actionable FRAUD, and consider how hard it may be to obtain court admissible evidence or testimony to prove that????? Besides, theres the age old common law of "Caveat Emptor" or Let the Buyer Beware that is still a viable legally recognized defense.

I do a lot of work in negotiations (dont like to and litigate as little as possible) and in these situations if you consider the cost of litigation etc, this is somethgin you need to try and settle on your own, cuz the more you can keep money grubbing lawywers out of the picture, the better off you are. I would first gather my knowledge and evidence and what you actually know (not guesses) and arrange a nice face to face meetign with the dealer where you calmly and rationally air your complaint and hope hes a good businessman and honest gentleman and he may help you. THATS THE BEST WAY, MAN TO MAN, FACE TO FACE. If that dont work, the next place I would complain is to the local Better Business Bureau and maybe they can assit you. If that dont work, I would file a complaint with the States Atttorney Generals Office and maybe they can help. If that dont work, take 2 aspirins and call me in the mornign at the office lol.

Seriously, try to be decent and reasonable at first and avoid confrontation, cuz that will only get his defenses and hackles up, especially if you even mention lawyers or legal action.

Best Wishes, Good Luck n God Bless ya

Ol John T Nordhoff in Indiana

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02-26-2003 00:14:56




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 Re: Re: DEALER ETHICS? in reply to John T, 02-25-2003 20:21:39  
Well said/written Ol John T Nordoff from Indiana...the more lawyers are kept out, the better for everyone...

tom



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