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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

Front end loader lifting uneven

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 08:50:01

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I recently bought a long model 610 tractor with an Allis Chalmers front end load. Both rams on the loader seem to be working but they start lifting at seperate times causing the bucket to lift cock eyed and stress the mounts where the loader is attached. I have very little experience with hydrolics. What should I check to correct this?

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msb

09-04-2005 20:13:31

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

It could be the hose to the slow lifting side has a loose lining (flap) inside the hose and is blocking the oil flow.I would replace that hose first.

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Will Weycker

09-05-2005 06:45:12

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to msb, 09-04-2005 20:13:31

Thanks, I'll check that

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RayP(MI)

09-04-2005 15:41:42

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

Possible obstruction in one of the lines? Possibly air in one of the cylinders? Two other things to look at.

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 15:50:00

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to RayP(MI), 09-04-2005 15:41:42

Thanks Ray, I'm also in Michigan if that is what the (MI) means in your handle. How do i check for air in the Cylinder? How do I correct that?

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RayP(MI)

09-05-2005 15:11:12

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 15:50:00

Yeah, Will, central Michigan - near Edmore.
Air in cylinders typically will cause jerkey operation when activated. Think of the one side with a soft foam rubber cylinder - the other solid. If they're double action cylinders, they will probably bleed themselves with use. Single action may be more tricky, but should probably bleed down with use too. If there is a port on the top of the cylinder, you can loosen it to allow the air out. If necessary you might take cylinder off machine and put it in a position so that the hydraulic fitting is topmost, and loosen the fitting, to allow air out. Typically air gets into a system when it is disassembled for repair, or assembled for new installation.

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Will Weycker

09-06-2005 05:44:33

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to RayP(MI), 09-05-2005 15:11:12

Thanks Ray

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RayP(MI)

09-04-2005 15:38:55

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

Possible obstruction in one of the lines? Possibly air in one of the cylinders? Two other things to look at.

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thejdman01

09-04-2005 15:14:44

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

some farmers including myself do some really stupid and goofy things in the heat of the moment cause they "just got to have it and it is a matter of life and death". I had a loader 148 on a 4020 once and i fiddle farted around with that thing quite a bit always lifting unequally. well turns out (was a long time ago dont remember exact demensions) but one cylinder was 3 inch and other other was 3 1/4 inch diameter (before everyone jumps on my back yes i know htey werent that big im jsut saying that as an example dont remember exact sizes or waht the right size was but they were 2 different sizes. they just looking at them appeared to be the same but when i broke the tape out they were different (the "3 1/4 inch took more oil to fill causing it to move slower. something happened to the old lift cylidner (guy i bought it from didnt quite remember) and farmer had one laying around same length(almost again was very close couldtn tell by looking but one was a tad longer then the other when i got out the tape measure. pin holes were right and used it. its not likely but it happened once to me.

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 15:18:14

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to thejdman01, 09-04-2005 15:14:44

Good tip i'll check that out

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Chris Brown

09-04-2005 14:42:25

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

The others keep saying that one of the cylinders must be leaking really bad internally, well if that were the case then your loader would leak down really fast. Does it? I have a case loader on a farmall and it is/was sprung really bad,as I believe yours is. I chained a chunk of telephone pole across the bucket,with about 10 feet extendine out past the edge of the bucket on the sprung high side ,the end of the pole was chained down to a tree stump. It took a couple times of lifting to get it straight. Got to be careful though, the oposite side comes up off the ground when you lift hard.

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will weycker

09-04-2005 14:55:00

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Chris Brown, 09-04-2005 14:42:25

Chris how did you figure out your loader was sprung?

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RickB

09-04-2005 13:42:59

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Probably not leakage in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

An internal leak won't cause your symptom unless they are single acting cylinders with inadequate vents on the rod side of the piston. Otherwise the pressure will immediately equalize creating equal lift on both cylinders. The cause is a sprung boom or bent rod.

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 14:53:10

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Re: Probably not leakage in reply to RickB, 09-04-2005 13:42:59

Thanks Rick, How can i check to see if i have a sprung boom? Things look straight?

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RickB

09-04-2005 16:37:02

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Re: Probably not leakage in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 14:53:10

Park on level concrete or other pavement. Measure from the center of each rear axle down to the ground; jack the low side to match the high side. Measure from the center of the pins attaching the bucket to the boom down to the ground. Also measure from the same pins to the center of the rear axle on each side or other FIXED reference point. Always measure from the rear axle, not the front. Always be sure the rear axle is level side to side.

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will weycker

09-05-2005 06:43:31

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Re: Probably not leakage in reply to RickB, 09-04-2005 16:37:02

Great, Thanks Rick, You and others have been a big help on this.

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Allan in NE

09-04-2005 12:53:54

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

Will,

Hate to say it, but it sounds as though your loader is sprung from misuse sometime in the past.

This is very common with loaders and about the only cure is to replace the darned loader or start spending money on replacing a lot of it's iron.

Really doubt if the problem lies in the hydraulics unless those cylinders are plumbed completely wrong (as being in series with one another).

Allan

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 13:00:16

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Allan in NE, 09-04-2005 12:53:54

Allan, I'm new to the hydrolics game but my understanding is that the loader should have a control valve between the control lever and the cylinder? Mine has just a T in the hydrolic line. Could this be the problem?

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Allan in NE

09-04-2005 13:16:15

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 13:00:16

Will,

If you have just a "T", then it is plumbed correctly and should lift even.

The only other explanation would be a cylinder that is not working. Try unhooking them one at a time to make sure both are functional; if they are, that loader is just plain sprung out of true.

Allan

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Allan in NE

09-04-2005 13:13:15

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 13:00:16

Will,

If you have just a "T", then it is plumbed correctly and should lift even.

The only other explanation would be a cylinder that is not working. Try unhooking them one at a time to make sure both are functional; if they are, that loader is just plain sprung out of true.

Allan

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will weycker

09-04-2005 13:19:19

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Allan in NE, 09-04-2005 13:13:15

Thanks we'll try unhooking them one at a time

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Joe (Wa)

09-04-2005 11:24:46

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

The hyd pressure on both cylinders has to be equal if the system is set-up right. The slow cylinder is either leaking past the piston seals, or the cylinder rod is bent.

If the rod is bent the cylinder will lag the other one both up & down. If the piston is leaking by, the cylinder will lag the other up but will most likely move close to the same down with weight in the bucket. I have a loader with a slightly bent rod that acts as you describe.

Joe

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 12:37:26

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Joe (Wa), 09-04-2005 11:24:46

Joe thanks for the reply. We checked our rod and it seems to be straight. How do we check for a leak? Nothing visibly or audably noticable. We also are confused on the control valve. Our set-up just has a T connector in the line after the control level to each cylinder. Is ther suppose to be a control valve regulating pressure to each side?

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Joe (Wa)

09-04-2005 15:11:38

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 12:37:26

The tee is correct. That will put equal press on both cylinders.

To check for leak-by in one of the cylinders:

1. Put wt in the bucket (fill with dirt, gravel, etc).

2. Lift until both cylinder rods are extended the exact same length. Measure it.

3. If the cylinder has leak-by, the length of the rod will shorten.

4. If the frame is sprung, the rod lengths will remain equal.

Joe

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will weycker

09-04-2005 15:15:20

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Joe (Wa), 09-04-2005 15:11:38

Thanks Joe I'll try that

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Don-Wi

09-04-2005 09:20:51

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

Sounds like one of the cylinders is leaking really bad internally. They should lift at the same time everytime, unless the frame is bent a little or you are lifting an uneven load that twists the frame some. Even with the leak, they should even out some, unless its a REALLY BIG leak.

We've got an Allis Chalmers loader mounted on our Massey 165, that thing lifts just fine.
Donovan from Wisconsin

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Will Weycker

09-04-2005 12:42:37

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Don-Wi, 09-04-2005 09:20:51

Don thanks for the reply, The frame and attaching points when we got the tractor were very loose. We though that was the problem and fixed and tightened everything; it corrected much of the problem but we still have some uneven lift.

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Don-Wi

09-04-2005 09:20:39

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

We've got an Allis Chalmers loader mounted on our Massey 165, that thing lifts just fine.
Donovan from Wisconsin

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Don-Wi

09-04-2005 09:20:16

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Re: Front end loader lifting uneven in reply to Will Weycker, 09-04-2005 08:50:01

We've got an Allis Chalmers loader mounted on our Massey 165, that thing lifts just fine.
Donovan from Wisconsin

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