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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

tedding after raking

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GS

03-25-2004 16:47:54




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Has anyone here raked 2 swaths together at higher moisture, say 40%, with a v rake then followed with a reel type tedder? Do you think this would get the hay down to 15% moisture for baling. Here's a scenario. Cut hay early as possible on day one, rake late on day two, ted morning of day three, bale afternoon of day three. I'm trying to improve my haying efficiency and have thought of rotary tedder followed by raking with v rake also. Any opinions?

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Bernie in MA

03-26-2004 08:16:13




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
We're lucky to get 3 good days at a time here too.I have a mower/conditioner, a pinwheel rake, and an old Grimm ground-driven tedder that straddles the windrow. I mow either the night before or as soon as the dew is off in the AM. In that afternoon I rake it, pulling the tedder behind the rake with a hitch I made on the back of the rake, leaving it in a fluffy wide windrow. I rake it again just before dark. As soon as the dew is off the next AM I flip the windrow with all but 2 wheels chained up on the rake, pulling the tedder behind again. In the afternoon it's ready to bale. If I have a lot down I get somebody to rake in front of the baler. My project this year is to make gathering wheel(s) on the baler to eliminate that last raking. My hay is mostly grass with some clover.

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Mark

03-26-2004 06:30:17




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
3rd response on this tedding topic.

This happened to me and is FYI for you.

Well, after what I said (below) about piles of uncured hay, I ordered and received ASC's Morra 9' 2 bay tedder. Got it home and assembled it (no instructions or operators manual provided) and took it out in the pasture, broke open some square bales and scatered them about. I attempted to tedd and was only able to work 3' of the 9' width (the rear tynes were 2' off the ground and they wouldn't go lower) and also bent my drive shaft on the cross member running across under the PTO shaft by trying to lift my tires off the ground for transporting. Yuck!

Wanting the tedder, and not wanting to ship it home to ASC, I got out my cutting torch and modified it. I took 6 " out of the landing gear height thus leveling out the arms (now about a 4" rise at the rear) and cut the cross brace off that goes right under the PTO shaft. Straightened out the PTO shaft and back out in the field. This time it tedds and the tilt angle (front to back) looks more like the picture of a 4 bay they have in their catalog. I only paid $1200 for it including shipping and I know if I would gone to my NH dealer and bought one of his $5000 ones, I probably wouldn't have had that problem..... well, I didn't have $5000.

Mark

Mark

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Jerry D in NC

03-26-2004 08:09:57




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Mark, 03-26-2004 06:30:17  
Something was wrong in this one. I live less than 20 miles from the original ASC (Agri-Supply) and have seen those tedders all over the place working great. Our tedder is the 4 basket Morra and other than a gear with a casting problem that they replaced for us, we have never had a problem. Did you call their customer service group?



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Mark

03-27-2004 06:39:55




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 Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Jerry D in NC, 03-26-2004 08:09:57  
This is the 2 "basket" 3 pt. The 4 basket appears not to have the problem according to their picture in their catalog. Additionally, the one that I saw working here (got me started with the tedding idea) was a 4 basket also and it was almost level with the ground (rear slightly higher) and hay was flying everywhere. Must have been working.

My freight was ~$116 and one way was about a week. Plus what could they do for the near term but refund my money. Didn't want the money wanted a tedder.

From the customer support side, parts were missing and the wheels had sat out in the rain so the wheel bearings (dustproof, not sealed) got full of water and were frozen. They shipped the necessary parts immediately with no questions asked at no charge. I did talk about the posture of the unit but no one there could offer any help as to what was wrong.

Mark

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Jared in VT

03-26-2004 05:36:53




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
Hey GS, The hayman is also the hay professor as you can read from his post. If you are like me, you don't really want to know what is going on with the hay, you just want it dry and in the barn. I'm sure the Hayman could sell his hay to Bistro-newvo for mixed salad greens. My hay is ugly and pathetic, but by golly it's dry (mostly) So, don't be stubborn and try to invent a new way to make hay; cut it, tedd it, rake it and bale it. 3 day's are plenty, but you need a tedder, any kind of tedder. There are no deep dark secrets here; cut the hay, when it "wilts" on top, ted it. When it wilts again, ted it again, and again depening to the drying rate and the weather. I tedded one crop 7 times last year to get it in on the one sunny day we had in June! Yes it beat the leaves up, but by golly it dried. You can rake your hay and tedd it out again to keep the dew from it overnight or if it is really thick and not tedding well, but that is not a labor or time saving technique. Tedd your hay and you will see the light! Have fun, be safe, Jared

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Bill B

03-28-2004 19:38:12




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Jared in VT, 03-26-2004 05:36:53  
Hi, I'll second this. Bill



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Bob in Western NY

03-26-2004 04:11:07




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
What are you using to cut your hay?

We use a haybine. It has 2 rubber rollers that squeeze and crimp the hay. We usually cut about 11AM and rake and bale the next afternoon for round baling. We wait to rake and bale 1 day more for square bales. This has worked well for us.(But weather conditions are the key.)
The more you toss the hay around, the more leaf matter your apt to loose.

Hope this helps.

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BobMo

03-25-2004 21:51:18




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
GS, Bryan & hayman are both correct and it seems apparent that you haven't put up much hay and need to review some of the inputs in regard to haying at this site. You should also check some University Ag. department web sites.



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bryan g in mo

03-25-2004 18:02:29




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
I agree with kyhayman ,I don't see the savings either, besides the way you want to do it your making four trips around the field, wait one more day and save a trip around the field and save fuel as well.



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kyhayman

03-25-2004 17:57:34




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 Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-25-2004 16:47:54  
I dont see where you are gaining much. The easy move is down to 30-40% moisture. It's that last 10-20% is more difficult. The only places that a cut plant can lose water rapidly is out of the cut stem (slow process) and out of the leaf stomates. Once the leaves wilt the stomates are closed. By tedding as the leaves are wilting the stems will bruise and fracture. That increases the number of points that stem moisture can evaporate. Tedding at this point will also open up piles of hay to to air flow and sunlight. It also lifts and aerfies the hay so it can dry more rapidly, maintaining color and speeding up baling.

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Mark

03-26-2004 06:17:30




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to kyhayman, 03-25-2004 17:57:34  
Appreciate your analysis of the drying process. I like to understand how things work. I then can fabricate a plan to deal with the elements of the problem and solve it. That's why in my responses, I try to do what you did; explain the elements of the problem. Some people aren't interested and some are. Just like some people work in a factory and others on a farm.

Mark



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Hay Dr

03-26-2004 05:48:47




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to kyhayman, 03-25-2004 17:57:34  
Preach it brother!!!



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GS

03-26-2004 04:53:57




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to kyhayman, 03-25-2004 17:57:34  
So what you are saying is it would be better to ted with rotary tedder at appropriate time? I've made plenty of hay, I'm just trying to avoid having to bale on the fourth day after cutting. I live in Wisconsin, and your lucky to get 3 days without a chance for showers. There's been many times when most of the hay was ready to bale, but the bottom of the swath was still too wet. I know a tedder should alieviate that problem. I'm a one man operation and if I have to wait to long into the day to rake, I run out of daylight to bale. My main objective is to be able to rake as soon in the day as possible so I have a longer period to bale, therefore allowing me to bale more acres per day. That's why I'm considering a twin rake. I need to save time. I currently cut with haybine, rake with rollabar rake and bale with vermeer 504F round baler. I've seen recommendations for raking at 40% to save leaves, but if I rake at 40% I don't feel the hay would be ready to bale the same day. No one around here rakes the day before baling, which I think you would have to do in order to have dry hay if raked at 40%.

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Hay Dr

03-26-2004 05:53:44




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 Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-26-2004 04:53:57  
Your Vermeer 504F needs some adjustments if you are having trouble baling once the dew falls or you can update to a newer Vermeer baler.



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Jerry D in NC

03-26-2004 05:51:29




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 Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to GS, 03-26-2004 04:53:57  
GS,
I was one of the references to raking at 40% in alfalfa to keep from shattering the leaves. I do that at night after the dew has fallen. The Dew moistens the leaves but doesn't add much moisture to the stems so it allows you to rake the night before you bale. I am assuming you are harvesting alfalfa or clover and not a grass hay. If you have a grass hay then tedd it anytime you want. We don't use a tedder in alfalfa anymore because it had to be tedded when the dew was on it and that lets dirt stirred up while tedding to stick to the crop. Same reason we stopped using a wheel rake because the dirt stirred up would stick to the plants and hurt the appearance. We do own a tedder and do use the fool out of it in Fescue and Orchard grass hays. It makes a world of difference with those crops but it proved to not be advantageous in the alfalfa.

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Mark

03-26-2004 06:11:34




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Jerry D in NC, 03-26-2004 05:51:29  
Ok Jerry,

I just bought a tedder for all the reasons posted here. I do grass hay and want it to look pretty and green plus dodge those pesky squirts of water from the sky. Since I work in town, this has to be done after hours so there are practical limits to my haying operation.

I have a swather (mower conditioner) and now a sickle mower. I use the swather on sudan but I want to use the sickle on grass. The stems don't need crimping like the sudan does, it's more convenient, and saves wear and tear on the swather.

My problem was(is) that to use the sickle, you have to tuck back the last 1' of cut material so that the wobble box has a place to run on the next round to keep from making a big tangled mess. This leaves a row of grass much thicker (higher) than the rest of it, especially when cutting a triangular field and making the 270 degree turn back.

The plan for the tedder was for a second tractor to follow the first and scatter all the grass so that the curing can start equally for all hay. Otherwise I have nice cured hay with a periodic lump of green grass which will spoil and could set my barn on fire.

Mark

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Jerry D in NC

03-26-2004 07:13:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Mark, 03-26-2004 06:11:34  
We will follow the MoCo with the tedder in grass hay to get as much exposure as possible. Tedding is a fast operation.



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Mark

03-26-2004 07:38:30




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to Jerry D in NC, 03-26-2004 07:13:44  
Funny, I've been out of the city for 25 years now and only last year did I see some high dollar custom guys doing something funny to their hay. I had never seen this before. Investigated and wow, this just what I've been needing.

Mark



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GS

03-26-2004 04:52:22




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 Re: Re: tedding after raking in reply to kyhayman, 03-25-2004 17:57:34  
So what you are saying is it would be better to ted with rotary tedder at appropriate time? I've made plenty of hay, I'm just trying to avoid having to bale on the fourth day after cutting. I live in Wisconsin, and your lucky to get 3 days without a chance for showers. There's been many times when most of the hay was ready to bale, but the bottom of the swath was still too wet. I know a tedder should alieviate that problem. I'm a one man operation and if I have to wait to long into the day to rake, I run out of daylight to bale. My main objective is to be able to rake as soon in the day as possible so I have a longer period to bale, therefore allowing me to bale more acres per day. I currently cut with haybine, rake with rollabar rake and bale with vermeer 504F round baler. I've seen recommendations for raking at 40% to save leaves, but if I rake at 40% I don't feel the hay would be ready to bale the same day. No one around here rakes the day before baling, which I think you would have to do in order to have dry hay if raked at 40%.

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