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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

Novelist needs help

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bookwriter

03-14-2004 03:53:20




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Hey all. I'd be grateful if you farming experts could help me. I've written a novel about a 1971 family with a small farm in Southern Illinois, and I need a picture of the corn planter they've probably got. It's likely older, maybe 1960 or so. (They're sure not rich.) And I need also to see the actual disk unit on the thing. My NYC agent/publisher types are telling me that they've never seen a "planter" that isn't a box hanging under a window -- sheesh! --- and they want me to describe the darn thing better to them in my first scene, where the planter gets mudded up and stops running because the young farmer (our hero) is planting too deep. Can you please help? Many many thanks.

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led

03-14-2004 21:10:32




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 Re: Novelist needs help in reply to bookwriter, 03-14-2004 03:53:20  
What part of Southern Il. are you writeing about? Close to Ohio or Mississippi rivers? Bottom ground is pretty hard on plows.

Led



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Chris-se-ILL

03-15-2004 06:33:45




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 Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to led, 03-14-2004 21:10:32  
How about the "Wabash River bottoms" on the east side? Also, there is a lot of "timbersoil" {aka white clay} that is hard to farm too {the voice of experience}. Southern Illinois starts at the I-70 line.

I haven't used an early '60's planter {I do remember running alongside while Dad planted with one back in the 60's and early '70's} but I have messed up a few IH400 Cyclo planters {circa early-mid '70's}. We used dry starter fertilizer on corn, and one year the fertilizer supplier tried the "cheap" route and bought a load of off-brand starter fertilizer. It wasn't pelletized and was very powdered clay. The cross-auger that meters the fertilizer to the drop tubes caked up and eventually the cheap fertilizer built up in the cross tubes, to the point that it stopped the cross auger from turning.... thus, busting the cast iron drive sprocket. No way the dealer had one! I then had to resort to making my own. I used a chisel, hammer, and specially made long gouge to chip, chop and dig the caked up fertilizer out of the tube... all the time cussing the fertilizer dealer under my breath.

Note: for the bookwriter... planting too deep in wet conditions will not push up mud and cause the damage {breakage} that was described in the original post {IMHO}. I have planted too deep in wet conditions and what hurts the farmer is that it takes a while for the soil to warm up, thus slowing the germination of the seed. One year, because of the rain and damp soil it took nearly three and a half weeks for the corn to start poking through the ground.

A few descriptions of planting in wet ground....
*The ground just cut into ribbons as the disc sliced through the wet soil.
*The soil just formed a wet ball of mud in the palm of the farmer's hand as he squeezed the damp soil.
*There was a musty smell as the farmer dug a chunk of soil with the tip of his pocketknife {every farmer carried a Barlow pocketknife back then}. The ground had been damp for so long that it had started to grow moss on top, and the soil had taken on a greenish-blue color. The coloring and the strong smell reminded him of the slimmy mud found in the bottom of a pond. {the voice of experience here}.

Bookwriter... do you need pictures of flooded southern Illinois fields? I have plenty on my picture website. Email me if you want to view them.

Chris {southeastern Illinois}

===== ===== ===== ===== ===== ====
Here are a few pic links...

Link

Link

Link

http://photos.imageevent.com/jclb/waterwatereverywhere/May13_17.jpg

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Rob

03-14-2004 06:50:11




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 Re: Novelist needs help in reply to bookwriter, 03-14-2004 03:53:20  
I still use an early 60's planter (called a seed drill or simply drill up here). It's an end wheel unit but many are press wheel or hoe drills. Now a days, air drills/seeders are mostly used. My scanner's not available rite now but if you do a search of the Implement Photos under Galleries on this site look for John Deere Models B-A or FB-B. Others likely can help you out. We don't grow corn as we're too far north. HTH.

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thresherman

03-14-2004 06:40:20




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 Re: Novelist needs help in reply to bookwriter, 03-14-2004 03:53:20  
The size planter would depend on how big the farm is. If they have a couple hundred acre farm(as we did), we used a John Deere 290. Its an older 2 row planter. They might of had a 490(4 row). Or maybe an IH 56 model I think it was. Both were very common and popular. Alot would depend on what implement dealer was around and who they liked to deal with. Farmers were very brand loyal(as are many tractor guys)so alot of equipment was the same brand. What kind of tractors do they own? The planter would most likely be the same brand. This wasn't true with us, we had IH and Ford tractors, but dad said the John Deere planter was the best around. I put a link to a john deere planter from the implement photoshttp://www.tractorshed.com/cgi-bin/gallery/iphoto_pic.cgi?pic=http;//www.tractorshed.com/gallery/iphotos/i882.jpg&firstrec=1&lastrec=15&Parameter=290&mode=All&what=iphotos

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Nancy E. Lasater

03-14-2004 07:27:50




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 Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to thresherman, 03-14-2004 06:40:20  
Here's another one for you all, and thanks again for being such experts on all this. My hero, the young farmer, has just planted too deep in wet ground, which has crippled his planter and turned it into a mountain of immoveable mud. I'm guessing that with that amount of sludge and that much hauling before the 18 year-old realizes what he's got, alot of parts have gotten broken and will need to be re-ordered. Can you maybe give me a couple of parts that for sure would have been messed up -- hopefully some really expensive items that will also take about a week to get ordered, so that our young hero has maybe messed up the planting schedule pretty badly. I'm clueless. Many thanks! Nancy Lasater

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Larry NE IL

03-14-2004 20:29:43




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 Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to Nancy E. Lasater, 03-14-2004 07:27:50  
When I was a young lad, a city type guy stopped by the neighbors farm while I was there. He wanted to buy another 100 baby chicks. The neighbor said,"things must be goin' good, I just sold you 100 two weeks ago". The man replied, "nope! they are not so good...I must have planted them too deep or too far apart! :)Larry NE IL



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Nancy E. Lasater

03-15-2004 04:36:47




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to Larry NE IL, 03-14-2004 20:29:43  
You guys are indeed the experts, and I appreciate the help very much. FYI, I'm not the one from NYC. The publishing folks are. They're also telling me -- I'm sure not saying it -- that nobody lives on farms anymore, that farmers don't read, that rural people don't buy books, that no one will ever care about a young man who loves the land, etc etc. I believe they are dead wrong, and with your kind help, I'm putting the last touches a book I'm told is the first farm story about love of the land since WWII. Now, about that gummed-up muddy planter. I get the need for rocks, to break the cast iron mount (and thanks a lot for that), but wouldn't a mountain of mud, hauled along by an inexperienced young farmer, bend the seed tubes too and break them? As well as the springs, bearings, etc? For a poor family in 1971, couldn't this be alot of money, and more important, a lot of lost planting time?

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Chris-se-ILL

03-15-2004 07:00:20




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to Nancy E. Lasater, 03-15-2004 04:36:47  
(quote from N.Lancaster)"They're also telling me -- I'm sure not saying it -- that nobody lives on farms anymore, that farmers don't read, that rural people don't buy books, that no one will ever care about a young man who loves the land, etc etc. I believe they are dead wrong"(unquote)

If they (the publishers) believe that farmers are not readers... they should visit another farm website (Agforum.net) where I am a moderator of the "book review forum." There are very well read {and highly educated} farmers and ranchers all across this nation.

{quote}"Now, about that gummed-up muddy planter. I get the need for rocks, to break the cast iron mount (and thanks a lot for that), but wouldn't a mountain of mud, hauled along by an inexperienced young farmer, bend the seed tubes too and break them"{unquote}

In my experience and opinion... no! A planter by design will seldom push up a "mountain of mud" because the row units will slice and move the mud to the sides of the units, where it will then pass by the furrowing units (20 years of planting experience here). The only way that mud could build up is if "trash" {aka old stalks and untilled weedstems} builds up, or is caught by the row units and then pushes the soil ahead of the opener discs. Most tractors will stall or bogdown before there is damage to the planter. Also, if the soil is pushed up in front of the planter, the seed that is dropped behind the units will not be covered and will be laying "ON TOP" of the ground (more voice of experience). There is "NO WAY" to plant "too deep" if you are pushing the soil in front of the units!

My family was one of those "poor southern Illinois farm families" that you are describing.

Actually the very worst thing to happen at that time... was the "southern corn blight"... nearly wiped out a lot of farmers! I well remember the impact of that catastrophy!

Chris (southeastern Illinois)

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thresherman

03-14-2004 06:41:36




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 Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to thresherman, 03-14-2004 06:40:20  



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thresherman

03-14-2004 06:44:08




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 Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to thresherman, 03-14-2004 06:41:36  
I guess I don't know how to add a link!
Just go to the implement photos at the left under galleries and do a search for 290



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Nancy Lasater

03-14-2004 07:22:19




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to thresherman, 03-14-2004 06:44:08  
Many thanks! I've spent the day finding photos of old planters, closing wheels, gauge wheel assemblies and what the heck is that front wheel thing, with the sharp edge called? Is that the scraper? And do the seed tubes mount behind the first wheel there? You know, between the first blade-type one and the gauge wheels?



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Mguy

03-14-2004 13:54:21




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to Nancy Lasater, 03-14-2004 07:22:19  
Nancy, I'm glad someone else did it. My HS lit. teacher always told us " write what you know about" and that seems to apply here. Sorry if thats too harsh; I'm trying to criticize constructively . Good Luck! Mguy.



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JMS/MN

03-14-2004 13:25:22




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to Nancy Lasater, 03-14-2004 07:22:19  
That front wheel thing is called a double disc opener. It cuts the seed trench for the seed to fall in to out of the seed tube. The gauge wheels set the cutting depth of the opener discs, and thus the planting depth of the seed. Your story line is unrealistic to an experienced farmer. Simply planting too deep in a wet field is not going to ruin major parts on the planter. I know city slickers won't know the difference, but it bothers me when I see misinformation fed to them. A recent movie, called "A Thousand Acres", emphasized a farmer's drainage tile system, supposedly contaminating an aquifer, because the 'well' pictured drained all of the collected water into the ground. Erroneous, since that is not how tile systems work. But city folks think farmers did the wrong thing by draining wetlands. Movie contained other similar mistakes. If you want to maintain the theme of a major planting time delay because of his mistake- you could consider this: Farmer planted a field that was too wet. Got equipment stuck. (College professors say 'mired'- we say stuck). Farmer drove machine back and forth trying to get out. Got stuck deeper, hit rock buried in ground. Rock broke cast iron standard that openers mount on. Major repair! Dealer does not stock item because of infrequent call for it. Local welding shop busy with other breakdowns. Farmer's girlfriend is kindergarten teacher, who reminds him of the importance of learning how to stand in line, wait your turn! Farmer regrets passing up welding course during high school. Woe is me, if only I'd..... .

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Nancy Lasater

03-14-2004 15:29:16




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to JMS/MN, 03-14-2004 13:25:22  
JMS -- Many thanks for making my book better. When my farmer cousin told me this very story, about how he'd gummed up the planter and nearly cost himself a planting season, he told me he'd broken some parts in the process, but I never heard specifically what they were. Thanks for providing me some wonderful specific detail about what precisely he might have broken. Now, hopefully, when experts like yourself read my book, you'll feel that it's accurate. I'll make the changes you suggest right away. All best, Nancy

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JMS/MN

03-14-2004 14:11:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to JMS/MN, 03-14-2004 13:25:22  
New thread....just reread earlier post and find out that farmer is only eighteen. K teacher could be his older sister, otherwise teacher is in Peyton Place trouble because she's 23, he's really underage because the birth records were lost in that fire, remember? OT- planter is a JD 494. City slickers know only two farm words JD and Ford tractors, ala "Green Acres" and Hooterville, Sam Jones.



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thresherman

03-14-2004 16:07:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs help in reply to JMS/MN, 03-14-2004 14:11:53  
Slow down on the bad words. Give her credit for asking the so called "experts" here.



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Nancy Lasater

03-15-2004 04:39:23




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Novelist needs hel in reply to thresherman, 03-14-2004 16:07:44  
Thresherman -- thanks. I've just posted a reply to Larry's great story right above this. I'd be grateful if you'd take a look at the question too, if you have a moment.



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