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Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :)

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ShepFL

09-26-2002 13:43:04




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I have tried several times to properly setup my �rednecked� plow. I am by no means an expert, but by golly I have had some success plowing with the one I borrowed from my neighbor.

Unfortunately not the same can be said with my creation. I am seeking divine intervention from the TRACTOR GODS on my efforts to reclaim nearly 100 acres of 10 yrs. overgrowth. Below I have attempted to outline what I have done so far.

I start by parking the tractor on a level surface (dirt road) with the left wheel up on about 5-6" of blocking. I use this to simulate an "in furrow" condition. The general idea is to set the plow level when the tractor is in the furrow.
I then center the plow on the 3pth behind the tractor before making further adjustments. To center it I have fashioned anti-sway chains from 5/16� chain hooked to frame mounts and lower lift arms (Thx Bro Burr!). I then check the plow�s position relative to the right side wheel position. Since my rears are not adjustable I try to position the plow using various anti-sway chain lengths so that the front disk of the plow will run just inside the path of the wheel. I am considering moving my right front wheel further outward so it will fall on the outermost wall of the furrow while rear rides atop the landside.

Now I adjust the angle of attack on the plow. Using my top mounted turnbuckle above the beams, I adjust the angle to slightly off level (tilting fwd ~2�) so the front disk is being more aggressive than the rear. Since this is a disk plow it has no heel plate for adjustment, as such I pay less attention to how the bottom surface of the plow contacts the ground. I am in constant full contact with the ground except at the headlands. I set the depth with my 3pth lever and use the tail wheel to penetrate and maintain an estimated depth of 6�. In this newly reclaimed ground I increase the depth a bit more (7-8�) to enable the plow to plow deeper and break up any roots. Of course, I have no wheel weights, which would be very helpful for traction. I do have some water in there but nowhere near full.

With all these adjustments made I was expecting to be able to turn nice furrows. I also realize that the above adjustments were made with the plow under no load. Once the plow gets into the furrow it is under tension, so the angles change somewhat. I am experiencing heavy draft, incomplete trash coverage (sway) and at time wild furrows as the front of the tractor is frequently pitched hard to the right when traveling EAST. I am attributing this to different soil conditions within the same field (heavy clay??).

These basic settings and my limited experience are all that I have as a guide. I have been considering plowing solely in one direction just to get the ground broken. Bring it on TRACTOR GODS instill me with some knowledge and wisdom and other items you may have to offer!

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paul

09-27-2002 06:02:32




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
I have never used a 3-point plow, only hitch plows years ago & semi-mount (hook onto the lower arms of the 3-point, but no upper link, run on 1 rear wheel) plows now.

I have never used a disk plow, only molboard plows. So, my observations probably don't mean much.

I've always felt your 3-point pins are quite high. In my plowing, things always work when the plow is being pulled from as low as possible. I notice the original set-up of that plow had some very low pulling brackets. Pulling high loses you a lot of traction, and will cause the plow to want to tip out of the ground, giving you poor draft (will want to buck up & down like a bronco). My semi-mount plow, the bottom of my tractor arms are shiny & smooth from basically dragging on the ground. (It would help to see a pic of the action - how it looks when the plow is in the ground.)

Also, I've never used sway stablizers on a plow. For the molboard, it works much better to allow it to find it's own path, it will trail in 1 place most of the time. You need to either move the wheels of your tractor, or the frame of the plow, to line the furrow up. It sounds like your tractor does not have movable wheels, and you may have made a solid frame? Many plows have a clamped-on drawbar that can shift left or right. Trying to adjust the lower arms off-center can mess things up, make it want to pull to one side pretty badly. You are actually changing the angle of the plow left-right, as you pull the lower arms to one side. This will make things want to slap left-to-right & right-left as you plow. Seems like a tiny angle when you shift the arms, but it does matter.

If any of my observations apply to a 3-point, disk-plow - I have no idea! Good luck, and keep us informed. :)

--->Paul

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Captain.n/e,Mo.

09-27-2002 04:39:59




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
We used to have an old ferguson plow that was similar and on it one lift pin was offset up or down about 3 inches,seems like it was the left one looking back from the tractor.
sorry that's all I can help
seems like it was down.



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paul

09-27-2002 06:07:00




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 Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to Captain.n/e,Mo., 09-27-2002 04:39:59  
I tend to look foreward with the implement, and say the right side of it would have the pin about 3" lower on most plows, yes.

This can be done by raising the tractor arm on that side with the crank adjust. Which I think Shep is doing.

--->Paul



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Captain.n/e,Mo.

09-27-2002 04:37:18




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
We used to have an old ferguson plow that was similar and on it one lift pin was offset up or down about 3 inches,seems like it was the left one looking back from the tractor.
sorry that's all I can help
seems like it was down.



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chaney creek

09-26-2002 16:55:04




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
I remember seeing your picture a while back but think it is past the 5th page. Please resend the old plow and the new plow picture.



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ShepFL

09-26-2002 17:46:45




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 Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to chaney creek, 09-26-2002 16:55:04  
third party image

Pic of redneckin' efforts and below is link to original as purchased.

Also link to other pics of redneckin' plow but you have to copy and paste in browser.
Link



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Bret

10-11-2002 04:41:39




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 Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 17:46:45  
Just so you know, you won't get a smooth job on sod with a disc plow. My mentor described a disc plowing job as looking like hog pasture done in oversize. I have a couple older books that talk about disc plows and they say if it tends to pop out of the ground or pulls hard to set it deeper or put a bit more angle onto the discs. Seems they mean to adjust the verticle angle of the discs, not the angle which is at right angle to the line of draft, if that makes any sense. They repeatedly mention that a disc plow needs friction to stay in the furrow and roll, as the natural tendency is for the discs to roll out of the ground.

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chaney creek

09-26-2002 20:16:10




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 Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 17:46:45  
If it were me -- I would sharpen the blades some (if you havent already) to get a clean cut. Don't those blades roll along?

Do you have turnbuckles on your sway chains and if so, is the chain tight on each side. The disk has to be stablizied to keep it going in the same direction as the tractor. Your tractor, if it is the same one you got stuck should pull this implement with no problem. I would get some stabilizer bars to use.

What position is the draft control in -- heavy -light or in-between. Try using it in various positions and see what happens.

I can't figure out from your description if you used the lift arm gear to get the angle of the plow right. From the picture the plow needs to dip down on the left side when you use it. I would leave the wheel alone right now as it is in the picture.
Once the plow "bottoms out and takes hold", the depth you have the lift arms set at along with the draft control should keep the plow at the same depth. Remember the two blades cut two swaths of dirt and I would think angled-in may not be the best way - level might be best way to plow with it.


Sometimes it is just trial and error. Good luck. Let us know what happens.

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Tim(nj)

09-26-2002 16:43:16




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
Shep-
I'm looking at a picture of an A-C disk plow. A-C ran their tail wheel in the furrow at a 45 degree angle so that the rib on the wheel dug in at the point where the furrow wall and the bottom of the furrow met. Seems like it would give a lot more stability that way than trying to press the rib straight into the bottom of the furrow, which, from your picture, looks like how your tail wheel is set. Maybe re-engineering the wheel angle is worth a try, if everything else fails?

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murn,ga

09-26-2002 16:37:36




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
do you not need to raise the RH wheel to simulate field cond? you might have a left handed plow,tho.



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thurlow

09-26-2002 14:27:59




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 Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 13:43:04  
Been a long time since I used something similar, but my recollection is you don't need/use any type of anti-sway device when the plow is down (three-point hitch model). Small changes of direction with front wheels will then not effect "tracking" of plow. When properly set up, plow will center between available slack (side-to-side) in lift arms. Usta could set 5 and 6 bottom semi-mounted plows in shop and they would plow perfectly. Never used a three-point hitch that I didn't have to fine-tune in the field.

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ShepFL

09-26-2002 18:53:43




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 Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to thurlow, 09-26-2002 14:27:59  
third party image

Thurlow -
I think your right on the money! Here is pic of my buddy's plow behind my rig. At that time I had no anti-sway devices and plowing was fine. I will disconnect and see what happens.

Also Burr - your right on that plow I had it lower in the rear as you mentioned. I will readjust and post results for above corrective actions.
Thanks,
ShepFL

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Dave, Sherburne, NY

09-27-2002 07:29:03




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 Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 18:53:43  
Those rear tires on that tractor in the pic are adjustable ---reverse the disc, or wheel on the inside of the disc , have you got a manual for that tractor? put the tractor on the blocks like you said, front left tire also on a level road, level the plow left to right with the crank on the tractor lift arm. Level the plow front to rear with the top link between the plow and tractor,after you use that adjustment on the plow to make the top link attachment vertical. If you have more than one top
link attachment point on the that Oliver, use
the lowest hole. There is usually an adjustment on the plow to point the plow towards the center of draft of the tractor which is somewhere ahead of the tractor, where the center of the tractor will be as you drive along. This adjustment is sometimes a long lever with a notched quadrent, or the round lower attachment
point for tractor lift arms which is adjusted by loosening the U bolts and turning it which will change the angle of attack of the plow, or sometimes a pair of nuts locked, one on each side of an attachment which changes the angle of the lower lift arm attachment points relative to the angle of attack of the plow. DON'T USE ANY CHAINS to keep the plow where you think it should be If it is adjusted right it will go where it is supposed to. E-mail me if you have more questions and I will get out the books instead of trying to explain it from memory . Did I say don't give the leading disc any extra down ?

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Larry from Maryland

09-28-2002 15:14:55




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to Dave, Sherburne, NY, 09-27-2002 07:29:03  
I agree those wheels are ajustable.There is allways alot of wiggle or slack in the top link mount where the spring is ,so to hold the plow correctly when its in the ground,the rear end has to hang down when its lifted.



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Burrhead

09-26-2002 14:57:30




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 Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to thurlow, 09-26-2002 14:27:59  
10-4 on the "fine tune".

Shep all I can think of is this.

I use a double pan Ford plow and set the rear a little lower than the front.

I also set the right lift arm pretty high so it looks like the plow is laying down to the left.

I run it in heavy black clay (gumbo) and it does good. The long ribbons it slices off sure are hard on arthur hips and h-roids when ye cultivate or disc it over again.

When mine is doing best I have it adjusted so that the front pan runs about 6-8" inside the right rear wheel with the rear about 6" lower than the front and the right side about 6" higher than the left. That disc plow works good when you use it on the egg spatular techneek.

You'll need to run the sway chain on the right side to keep it positioned but the left side is optional.

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Burrhead--I fergut sumpin

09-26-2002 15:00:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to Burrhead, 09-26-2002 14:57:30  
Shep would ye post us a pix of the house over at KL. The last pix I saw it was gonna be beautiful. Congrads



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ShepFL

09-26-2002 17:22:38




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to Burrhead--I fergut sumpin, 09-26-2002 15:00:11  
I sure will post pic of the plow but not the furrows at this time!!
Folks would laugh me off the board and I would end up disgracing the Oliver brethren.
Standby. . . Grins from FL



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Dale(MI)

09-27-2002 13:23:14




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 17:22:38  
Well it sounds like the plow and not that fine tractor. I gave up trying to use a friends worn Ferguson behind my 550. Shortening the furrow side chain did help. Now I am using my father's 3 bottom Oliver trailer plow behind the Super M. I am looking forward to the day that he gets the 770 restored and I can plow with all Oliver equipment.



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Farmer Gene (WI)

09-27-2002 06:52:52




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Not so hot redneck plow !! Seeking TRACTOR GOD wisdoms :) in reply to ShepFL, 09-26-2002 17:22:38  
This must mean that you got your tractor out of that sticky situation. Did you ever tell us how you got it out? I mighta missed it.



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