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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac.

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Jason In Ohio

12-06-2007 21:00:59




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I also put this same discussion over on the �Ford Tractors Discussion Board� as well, just so that everyone knows.

I was just curious about some things that I�d typed down in the past and was wondering if anyone could clarify if some of my theories were correct or close to being correct. Also, I had a few questions.

The first Ford square balers (Dearborn models: 14-XX or 14-XXX {i.e. 14-49 or 14-292}) were available in 1956 (Or was it 1952?). These balers were built by the �LONG Manufacturing Company, Inc� of Tarboro North Carolina. They were built by another company because it was much cheaper that way instead of �Ford� paying people to make the machines to make the balers themselves. LONG continued manufacturing for Ford to introduce Ford�s newer-designed 150, 250, & 350 square baler models. In August, 1962 (when the �Ford Tractors Division� was mandated by Corporate to join the �Ford Motor Company�-wide paint scheme and slogan of �Ford Blue Stands For Quality�), LONG produced an even newer design of square balers for Ford; models: 520 (a redesigned 150, repainted from Dearborn red to Ford blue and white), 530 (a redesigned 250, repainted from Dearborn red to Ford blue ), and 540 (a redesigned 350, repainted from Dearborn red to Ford blue). They were the first blue square balers Ford produced.
At this point in time, LONG, seeking to cure their financial troubles (partially caused by Ford), started producing its own baler, model 680, to compete with Ford�s model 530 square baler. The LONG 680 and Ford 530 were the exact same baler- only painted a different color, sold for less, and called a different brand and model. The �Ford Tractors Division� wasn�t pleased with this decision on account LONG was able to sell their 680 cheaper than Ford was able to sell their 530 because LONG didn�t have to deal with sales tax when a 680 was sold in contrary to Ford- because LONG made them for Ford. So the �Ford Tractors Division�, angry with LONG�s back-stabbing decision, demanded LONG to stop production of their 680 or Ford would look elsewhere for all of their (Ford�s) square balers to be manufactured. In 1964, after two years of being in the market, LONG�s 680 square baler was discontinued and the good life continued... for Ford. For LONG, after discontinuing their 680 square baler, continued to face their financial troubles with �no light at the end of the tonal�. So LONG had no choice but to sell Ford the design rights of their (Ford�s) balers in order for LONG to receive the extra money to (slightly) help out their financial troubles. This was kind of misleading on LONG�s �part� on account Ford demanded LONG to stop production of their own baler, or Ford would look elsewhere for all of their square balers to be manufactured- which they were forced to do anyway.

Is it that AVCO-(I know that there�s an �AGCO� but I think that �AVCO� is suppose to be there- even though I�ve never heard of it before.)-New Idea, Located in Coldwater, Ohio, built square balers for Ford, from 1972 to 1978? Was there anything else that New Idea manufactured for Ford?

Another person told me that late Ford square balers were manufactured by Gehl. However, I do know that Gehl manufactured Ford�s round balers, forage harvesters, and mower conditioners. Was there anything else that Gehl manufactured for Ford?

Another person told me that both the Ford 532 and 542 square balers were produced form 1969-1981. I thought that it was from 1972-1978?

So if some of the information above is correct, who manufactured Ford�s square balers from 1964-1971? Gehl?

Was the �LONG Manufacturing Company, Inc of Tarboro North Carolina� the same �Long agribusiness� in affiliation with Farmtrac? Any information about �LONG Manufacturing Company� and �Long Agribusiness- purchased by Escort Ltd. Group of India� (if Long and LONG are two different companies {?}) would be appreciated.

Was there anything else that LONG manufactured for Ford?

Thanks in advance everyone.

Jason

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RMinVa

12-10-2007 02:24:15




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
Was the �LONG Manufacturing Company, Inc of Tarboro North Carolina� the same �Long agribusiness� in affiliation with Farmtrac? Any information about �LONG Manufacturing Company� and �Long Agribusiness- purchased by Escort Ltd. Group of India� (if Long and LONG are two different companies {?}) would be appreciated.

The first part is "Yes". Second part is "No". There are a few products still with the Long name on them. Bulk barns is one of them. Farmtrac produced about 100 barns in 05 or 06 (can't remember) which year but they decided to continue production even after the tobacco buyout.

Back in the 70's many local Ford tractor dealerships here sold Long implements (mainly Long disks) on their lots.The disks had the Long name on them.

Today Montana tractors owns stock in Farmtrac/Escorts. Farmtrac is in control but Montana is in the picture. There are 3 Montana tractor models that are the UTB /Long tractors. Farmtrac offered those models for about a year. Guess they made some type of deal for Montana to take those. Montana had them upgraded. Don't know how much but I do know they went from dry brake bands to wet breaks.

Montana has made or hashed over taking over Farmtrac. So far it hasn't happened and hope it doesn't. Farmtrac also has SAME tractors with the Farmtrac name on them.

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Eric SEI

12-08-2007 19:07:16




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
AVCO also owned WLW in Cincinnati at one time, I think that WLW was still doing the Midwestern Hayride at that time (1960's).



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Wisconsin Cowman

12-07-2007 17:42:50




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
Never mind today I saw a Ford baler for sale and thought of my post I had left. Gehl did make round balers for Ford. Been along time since I have seen a Ford round baler.



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730virgil

12-07-2007 16:59:45




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
i am pretty sure the ford hay rakes were also built by new idea in the 70s. i think the disk and plows were built by white at that time.



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karl f

12-07-2007 16:19:44




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
we have an old Dearborn parked out in a fence row. It has a tag that says "LONG MFG" on it. i do not recall the model number, it might be in the archives as i once asked about it 10 yrs ago. the baler has a Wisconsin engine on it, and the flywheel is on the side like a JD. the baler has a short drawbar, about 2 ft long, and apparently made a bale heavy enough to require duals on the chamber side (the story goes that it had duals on it when in use). I do not recall how the pickup was driven. I think the bale tension may have been sideways, but don't quote me on that, as i know the knotters are in the normal position.

Dearborn could likely compared to Deere's new Frontier line. Frontier is a short line of equipment made by other manufacturers painted green and branded Frontier, and sold exclusively (under the Frontier name) at Deere dealers. I believe Dearborn was the same for Ford tractor dealers, a line of equipment branded as Dearborn and sold at Ford dealers. Slightly different than Deere today since Ford had no line of it's own, but similar business arrangement.

just a few comments for the thread

karl f

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A-C hayman

12-07-2007 11:24:13




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
New Idea made the 535 and later the 538 mower conditioners for ford. Owatonna made the 536 and 537 mower conditioners. The big round balers were gehl. I"ve seen a long baler at a salvage yard, looks just like my 532. I"ve seen advertising for a new long baler probally less than five years ago that still looked like a ford baler, but i"ve never seen a new one in person.



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Jason In Ohio

12-08-2007 21:49:42




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to A-C hayman, 12-07-2007 11:24:13  
Did Owatonna manufacture anything else for Ford? Is Owatonna still around? Any info on Owatonna will be appreciated. Thank You.



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Tim(nj)

12-09-2007 19:26:03




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-08-2007 21:49:42  
Owatonna was bought by Gehl, and now Gehl is out of the ag machinery business.



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RodInNS

12-09-2007 09:00:41




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-08-2007 21:49:42  
I believe that Owatoanna also built a line of skid steer loaders for Ford back in those days. I don't know much about them tho....

Rod



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Wisconsin_cowman

12-07-2007 07:48:37




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
Gehl never made anything for Ford.



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rrlund

12-07-2007 16:43:40




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Wisconsin_cowman, 12-07-2007 07:48:37  
Oh yes they did. The Ford round balers were a Gehl 1500A. I bought a new one in 1979.



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RodInNS

12-07-2007 09:47:15




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Wisconsin_cowman, 12-07-2007 07:48:37  
I'm about 99% certain that Gehl painted their balers blue for Ford. Somewhere I saw a picture of one, but I can't recall where at this point.
I'm also about 99% certain that NewIdea built the last of the square balers for them. I've got a 532 and we were led to believe from day 1 when we bought it in 1980 that it was built by NewIdea. We bought it new and it was the selling dealer who told us that. Who's design it was is anybody's guess, but I was always under the impression that it was a NewIdea baler, right or wrong.
What I am reasonably certain of is that Ford did not build it. I don't believe that they built much in the way of impliments in those years. They were a tractor company, and a utility tractor company at that. It wasn't until the acquisition of NewHolland in 1985 and the following acquisition of Versatile in 1987 that they actually became a 'full line' farm equipment company. I think it can easily be said that Ford's management was very practical in terms of the financial aspects of their activities. It didn't pay them to build their own impliments, so thy didn't. Any shortcuts that could be taken in tractor designs were taken. There was very little pig headedness in their desings the way Deere was in that everythign had to be "deere". They got the parts they needed and slaped a tractor together. Deere tried to do it all. Cat was much the same way. Ford didn't have the size to pull that off... so there were sacrifices.

Rod

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Tim(nj)

12-09-2007 19:28:59




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to RodInNS, 12-07-2007 09:47:15  
Gehl did make a square baler, but not for Ford. They made the last Massey-Ferguson balers before the big Varity reorganization in the late eighties and the coming of AGCO in the nineties.



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RodInNS

12-09-2007 20:55:23




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Tim(nj), 12-09-2007 19:28:59  
No, Gehl never made a square baler for Ford, but they did make round balers for Ford.
The Massey round balers were made for Massey by Vermeer. That's been well documented on this forum in the past... I'm not aware that Gehl ever made a baler for Massey.

Rod



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Blue Horse

12-07-2007 05:58:54




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
This is interesting, as I did not realize that Long built balers for Ford. Apparently the connection between the companies continues, at least in a sense, to this day, as the "Farmtrac" tractors are almost clones of some of the Ford tractors of the 60's-80's.



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marty g

12-11-2007 05:33:48




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Blue Horse, 12-07-2007 05:58:54  
The clone Ford tractors that are sold as Farmtrac are made in India. The tooling was sent over there or bought by the Indian company Escort. There is no relation with the Ford company.



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georgeky

12-06-2007 22:34:28




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to Jason In Ohio, 12-06-2007 21:00:59  
All I know is that AVCO owned New Idea. Long and Farm Trac are the same company. Don't know who made what, but both the 2 old 530 balers I had, had Ford Logo on all castings, so I don't know and haven't been able to find out much about this. I do know that Gehl did make some hay rollers for Ford..



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IH 1466

12-08-2007 17:17:49




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 Re: Question on: Ford, Long, Gehl, New Idea, and Farmtrac. in reply to georgeky, 12-06-2007 22:34:28  
Very interesting and makes sence. I was never sure who built Fords Balers. I do know that the Farm Trac is built in India with tooling purchased from Ford, so they look very much like a Ford as they were Fords. Farm Trac also sells repower kits for Ford Tractors. Following some of the bloodlines of Farm Tractors and Equipment can be an interesting endevor.



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