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Implement Alley Discussion Forum

Subsoiler

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Mark

02-07-2006 18:11:17




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Being the tightwad that I am, I am in the process of making a subsoiler. I am wondering how many ponies it takes to pull a 2 shank subsoiler about 30 inches deep in heavy clay. The shanks will be made of 1"x6" material, the foot/point made of 2"x2" square stock..angled of course. My tractor is a 4wd 5320 JD advertised at 64 horses. I thought about trying 3 shanks but figured that was pushing it.

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billonthefarm

02-08-2006 06:03:19




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
mark Yep, these guys are right it will take alot of power. The one thing I might question is the merit of trying to pull it that deep. If you do some reasearch it is pretty difficult to cause compaction below 1 foot and if the soil is tight below that your ability to alter its natural state is minimal at best. Much of the ground here is a very heavy black prarie soil and we try to run around 14". The "experts" have told us that running any deeper is basically a waste of fuel and time. They say the we alter the structure of the soil with the heavy modern equipment but only the top 1'. Below that level the roots can easily penetrate the soil. It may be different in your area so you could do a little asking around. Here in this soil it takes 300hp to pull a 5 shank deep ripper 14" deep at 6mph. I cant even imagine what it would take to pull twice that deep. Good luck, those rippers can do a world of good! bill

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Mark

02-08-2006 07:09:50




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to billonthefarm, 02-08-2006 06:03:19  
You guys are a wealth of information. The problem isn't drainage so much, but hardpan. This is heavy yellow Kentucky clay.....you guys who have that black loam soil don't realize how good you have it!

One thing that had added to the problem in the truck garden patch is the use of the tiller....those rotating tines pack the soil and pulverize it so fine, it settles like concrete.

I have rad all your kind advice....one shank, 24" and evidently, lots of black smoke from the exhaust! Thanks.

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Andrew from KY

02-08-2006 17:31:41




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-08-2006 07:09:50  
You might want to only run one shank on your tractor. The only experience I've had pulling a subsoiler through the field was with a 6080 Allis-Chalmers (86 hp) and a one shank ripper. I ran it through tobacco fields after we'd cut but before disking and sowing the cover crop. That was in the better soils in Scott County (ie toward Lexington) and it was a pretty good pull on that tractor. Running in heavier clay would be worse.

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barnrat

02-08-2006 06:28:25




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to billonthefarm, 02-08-2006 06:03:19  
Clays can be nasty, plow pan can be up to 8 inches thick. Most newer rippers go down 18" to kinda "hook" under the plow pan. Somtimes under certain contidions it looks like the machine is bringing up chucks of concrete. It certainly helped eliminate wet holes and my yields are up by about 1/3. Usually a soil compaction test is performed so you know what depth to set the ripper at so you don't waste fuel but get effective shattering.

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barnrat

02-08-2006 04:28:34




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
I have someone come in and rip my fields every year. I have exteemly heavy yellow clay soils. A 4020 Deere can barly pull a 4-16 moldboard plow. The first year the guy came in with a 200hp Deere and a 4 shank set to 30" and he wasn't at it half an hour and the exaust pipe was starting to glow red. He had to come back with his 300hp Fendt on the same ripper to get it done. Make sure you have some good teeth on those shanks as you won't go 120 acres before they are gone. They're hot to the thouch when they come out of the ground.

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Leland

02-07-2006 23:23:34




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
In S.ILL they have some reclaimed coal mine ground and they have a 1 bottom 18" plow and they need the big JD 4wd just to get it 30" into the ground and this beast will spin out from time to time .



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no.2

02-07-2006 20:28:30




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
At least 50 horsepower per shank!! We pull a 3 shank with a JD 4320 with duals and can"t go over 20 inches deep.



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jimont

02-07-2006 18:25:08




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
Mark - I don't know how heavy your clay is, but we find that a one tooth subsoiler, in hard clay is about all a 5000 Ford wants to handle. Two teeth would be out of the question for us. We actually managed to bend our Ford subsoiler's frame this summer running from 24"-30" deep!



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Brendon

02-07-2006 18:23:42




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
To pull a ripper 30" deep in any soil sounds like serious work. Most commercially available V-rippers and subsoilers work about 18-24 inches deep. To the best of my knowledge, a 13-shank V-ripper is about as big as they come and would require a large (300+ hp) tractor to handle.
To pull two shanks at that depth with your tractor will take numerous passes at various angles, working a few inches deeper each time. I would suggest placing the shanks directly behind the tires so nothing is run over without getting worked up.

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Roger in Iowa

02-07-2006 18:19:40




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:11:17  
You better go for one shank. My 3020, but only 2 wheel drive, has all it wants with one and not going that deep, only 18 to 22" or so.

One problem you will have is with the 30". You do not have that much range on the three point arms, at least I don't.

You could always add another later, if built right, but do not think you can handle 2.

Roger in Iowa



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ricedaddy

02-07-2006 18:27:53




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Roger in Iowa, 02-07-2006 18:19:40  
I have a 220 Hp with duals that I pull a big ox 7 shank, but can only go about 18-20" deep, main thing is do it when it's dry so the ground will shatter



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Mark

02-07-2006 18:58:10




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to ricedaddy, 02-07-2006 18:27:53  
Menfolks,

You have helped me tremendously and I am in your debt. How I got these notions in my head, was the only subsoiler I ever worked with was a single shank that went about 24" deep and it was pulled with a Super C. Then, I go online and start looking at commercial units for ideas and see all those 3 shank jobs. Then I read an article or two and the writer saying they went down 30". So, add all this up and figure my conclusion..... Super C; one shank, twice the size tractor and 2 shanks. AS for having the lift clearance for a 30" shank....duh! I never stopped to consider that. Half a dozen heads is always better than one. I know one thing, this ground has NEVER had a subsoiler through it and has been farmed for...EVER! About time it got the treatment.

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plumboy

02-09-2006 04:59:38




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-07-2006 18:58:10  
I pull a 28" monroe in the same ky clay.I use it in the summer or late fall when it is dry,that way the ripper explodes the hard pan.when it is too moist the ground just accomodates the ripper with a single slice through the ground.As it 'explodes' through the ground it has many veins it leaves for air and water penetration.It takes more hp but seems well worth it.I have an 85hp 4x4 and have little prob but there is tremendous energy happening down there.The angle of the blade tip really makes a diff how it pulls.

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Mark

02-09-2006 07:52:10




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to plumboy, 02-09-2006 04:59:38  
plumboy,

Last summer would have been a fine time to use it here because it was so dry (and HOT). I got to looking around for a subsoiler/ripper and figured I could weld one up a lot cheaper than the asking prices I have seen. This is a cabin fever project for the time being.



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plumboy

02-09-2006 15:57:35




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-09-2006 07:52:10  
I know the cabin fever stuff.The one I got was used and got it for $200 in fleming.I think duel would save some time if it pulls good.



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Mark

02-09-2006 16:58:53




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to plumboy, 02-09-2006 15:57:35  
plumboy,

You got it in Fleming? Where? I got folks down that way..over around Muses and Maxey Flats.



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plumboy

02-10-2006 03:00:35




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 Re: Subsoiler in reply to Mark , 02-09-2006 16:58:53  
At roses farm supply.I'm actually in tollesboro, transplant from lex.



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