Thanks!....but a few more questions

Looking at my regulator (by the way, I am pretty sure this is a 3 brush generator on Fergusons if that matters in the questions below), I can identify the cut-out relay.

I understand that regulators cannot be properly adjusted without further knowledge and tools. What I was wondering is if they could be slightly tweaked if you knew what your goal was....in may case increase the charging because it discharges now. Since I have 3 of these non-functioning aftermarket regulators, one of which was connected when the battery was neg ground instead of positive, I figure I can afford to experiment with one of them. I also have a ammeter on my tractor so I can see exactly what is happening.

1. If the gap on the cut-out relay is opened up, what will the effect be on charging or discharging? There is a little lever on top of the points that looks like it is there to adjust the gap.

2. What will the effect be if you open the gap on the relay that controls ground of the Field terminal? (in my case, if I ground the field terminal on the generator, it puts out about 12-15 amps)

3. What happens when the polarity of these regulators is improperly connected? I had an old truck that I got with the wrong polarity on grounding...it would not charge right but worked fine when I fixed the polarity. But can the wrong polarity ruin a regulator?

4. In various places, I have seen that one should not clean the terminals with sandpaper but rather a file. Why is this true? Seems to me like very fine wet/dry sandpaper would remove the least material from the points while still cleaning them.

5. These aftermarket regulators start by working ok on my tractor. They charge a couple amps when running, and would compensate when the lights were on. But they start to work improperly after 10-20 hours of operation. At first, you can correct this by tapping the regulator....later even that does not help. Does this sound like the points need to be cleaned up? Both sets? And by taking of material with a file etc, don't you affect this in some way?

Sorry for all the questions, but I am very curious now.

ALSO A CAUTION That VR is designed to do a job and keep the battery charged depending on battery condition and loads BUT ITS ALSO DESIGNED TO PREVENT OVERCHARGING. Thats why if the battery is staying up and the ammeter is at zero or above (so long as NOT discharging) at low RPM or if the lights are on and youre at above idle RPM, I WOULDNT MESS WITH THE VR AT ALL. Right after cranking its normal to go to high charge (dead grounded field) but then back off (field grounded via resistor inside VR) to prevent overcharge. When you dead ground the Field thats the MAX charge but its NOT normal or the Gen IS NOT supposed to stay there constantly.

NOTE Again I have no specs or data and not even sure if thats a Class A or Class B System and am reluctant to even hazard a guess so take all that below with a grain of salt NO WARRANTY. So long as the battery stays up and she will maintain some charge and NOT discharge with lights on at above idle RPM I WOULDNT MESS WITH HER LOL

1. If the gap on the cut-out relay is opened up, what will the effect be on charging or discharging? There is a little lever on top of the points that looks like it is there to adjust the gap.

My best guess is if the gaps increased it will not kick until the Gen reaches a higher voltage which usually corresponds to a higher RPM. I wouldnt mess with that adjustment provided it kicks in at a decent RPM and drops out soon as the tractor is shut off

2. What will the effect be if you open the gap on the relay that controls ground of the Field terminal? (in my case, if I ground the field terminal on the generator, it puts out about 12-15 amps)

Thats hard to answer cuz I have no specs or data on your VR or Generator. My best guess is if the gap is smaller or less spring tension holding it, it will change state sooner at lower battery voltage and maybe cause her to go to the dead ground high charge condition sooner BUT CAUTION it may overcharge and outgas and/or boil out battery acid.

MESS WITH IT AT YOUR OWN RISK LOL

3. What happens when the polarity of these regulators is improperly connected? I had an old truck that I got with the wrong polarity on grounding...it would not charge right but worked fine when I fixed the polarity. But can the wrong polarity ruin a regulator?

Many VR's are bi polar and will work at either polarity but some may not???? Some will work at either, but the relays wont last as long if used in reverse polarity cuz of the coatings on the relay contacts, I have read that somewhere?? I dont see short term use in reverse polarity as ruining a VR, maybe after longgggg g times if theres anything to that relay coating theory Ive read.

4. In various places, I have seen that one should not clean the terminals with sandpaper but rather a file. Why is this true? Seems to me like very fine wet/dry sandpaper would remove the least material from the points while still cleaning them.

I never use sandpaper cuz of the grit n residue it may leave behind. Thats why they make point files USE THEM LIGHTLY DONT REMOVE MORE THEN NECESSARY. CAUTION once the pretty shiney silvery coating is taken from the contacts, they dont last long and are prone to burning n sticking. If they are that badly burned or pitted or carboned up they ought to be replaced is my theory. HOWEVER if they are only gray oxide coated then a non abrasive clean/buff/polish is in order and recommended.

5. These aftermarket regulators start by working ok on my tractor. They charge a couple amps when running, and would compensate when the lights were on. But they start to work improperly after 10-20 hours of operation. At first, you can correct this by tapping the regulator....later even that does not help. Does this sound like the points need to be cleaned up? Both sets? And by taking of material with a file etc, don't you affect this in some way?

Again, just non abrasively clean/buff/polish the points. Heres the deal in my opinion: The VR and Gen ought to be a matched unit. Buy the VR thats for that make n model of the Generator!!!!! !!!!! ! I fear a generic VR may mess up prematurely unless its PROPERLY tweaked with exact n detailed tensions and air gaps etc matched to the Gens specs. I think the points may be sticking/burning or carboning up prematurely simply cuz ther are switching more current then designed for. I know they cost more but I think you got to get to a good knowledgeable old fashioned Gen shop (if any exist) or the tractor dealer to get the VR properly matched for your gen or else you may face premature relay contact failure cuz of too much current?????

Thats about the extent of my hard drive lol Im an electrical engineer but by no means any expert on VR design, sorryyyyy yyyyy y

John T

The VR point gap is .075", the voltage range is 6.6 - 7.2, adjust to 6.9.
Hope that helps.

Also make sure your regulator has a good ground, the ground is on one of the mount ears on the regulator base. If your ground is poor, your regulator won't work worth a darn. I ended-up running a ground wire up to the dash ground lug just to make sure.

George (in Ohio)

Now, it is not allowing any charging. It is in discharge mode all the time, and really drops if the lights are on.

The regulator is the one sold as a replacement for this tractor. However, it is probably used on a number of tractors and not tailor made for the Ferguson. Unfortunately, this is only replacement I have found.

Note also that it works correctly when first installed., just fails to operate properly after a few hours of use.

The points after it fails to work correctly looks very bright and clean....no evidence of pitting, burned look etc.

I did check the ground on all of these regulators buy running a ground directly to the battery post....never any change so I assume they were in fact all properly grounded without the extra wire.

John T