Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Attention Forum Users: On the 28th of December 2023 at 9:00am Central Time, we will be taking the forums down for maintenance while we prepare the new forums for your use. Please click here for more information.

Harry Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
:

unleaded gas VS the valves?

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
Bud

10-11-2003 03:10:33




Report to Moderator

hey guys I am making my way through the archives learning all I can about my TO-30 and was wondering- Jerry/MT (?) mentioned he has a 1954 TO-30 and he uses 10W40 engine oil with the lastest specification (SJ?)and regular unleaded, 87 Octane ((R+M)/2)gasoline. My 60+ neighbor uses his tractor hardly ever because he swears the unleaded gas will/does ruin the valves. The tractors were designed to run leaded he always says. Just how much truth is there to that? Is it an urban myth?

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
TO24424

10-13-2003 18:56:36




Report to Moderator
 Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to Bud, 10-11-2003 03:10:33  
O.K. I'm not as knowledegeble on the correct terms for lead. I, do know however, that we thought it was the end to sports racing cars of the day when they quit producing it. BULL!!!!
Modern gasolines are perfectly capable of performing up to the standards of leaded fuels. The long term effects may be harmful, but not in our lifetimes. Have fun, and good luck.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jerry/MT

10-11-2003 10:13:57




Report to Moderator
 Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to Bud, 10-11-2003 03:10:33  
Bud,
My TO-30 has valve rotators on the exhaust valves (I believe they all came that way) and as I understand it the valve seats are hardened. They don't require leaded fuel. Tetra-ethyl Lead was put into gasoline as an anti-detonant (knock reducer) that upped the octane rating of the fuel. A side benefit was that lead was deposited on the valve seat and was purported to be a "cushion". I don't know if that is true or not.
Since Tetra-ethyl Lead is outlawed there is nothing you can do about it so your neighbor might just as well us the use the tractor. That's what they are for. Also I checked the my oil supply and I believe the lastest oil API rating is SL. Regarding using modern multi-vis oils in old tractors, I believe there is an article in "Tractor Tips" on this site that discusses this. Do an archive search. Maybe there is a tractor engine development engineer or a lubrication engineer that uses this site that can speak with some expertise on this subject because I hear a lot of discussion about it. My experience is in aircraft propulsion. Respectfully,
Jerry/MT

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bud

10-11-2003 10:46:19




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to Jerry/MT, 10-11-2003 10:13:57  
Hey thanks Jerry. I will keep on searching through the archives.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Ray,IN

10-11-2003 20:16:37




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to Bud, 10-11-2003 10:46:19  
I used to have a website bookmarked that explained this in great detail. The article was written in Canada I believe. I found it with a search for leaded gasoline. My old machine crashed and I lost everything so I can't post the link. Alberta Mike and I discussed this site, perhaps he still has the link.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
David

10-11-2003 21:45:36




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to Ray,IN, 10-11-2003 20:16:37  
I think I read somewhere that unleaded is unlikely to damage valves on old tractors. Basis for this argument was that fuel they originally ran on was not leaded and that lead only began to be added when engine compression ratios were getting increased in a search for more power. That caused detonation and so lead had to be used to combat this. So T20 engine in its relatively low state of "tune" may be safe enough. Perhaps. I don't know. I just think this is what I read and it does seem mechanically plausible.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
tractorfix

10-12-2003 04:38:00




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the valves? in reply to David, 10-11-2003 21:45:36  
The lead was also needed to lubricate the valve seats. I think it would be a bigger problem in cars, because they turn so many more RPM's. They started hardening car valve seats in the early 70's.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bud

10-12-2003 06:36:03




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the valves in reply to tractorfix, 10-12-2003 04:38:00  
Thanks for the info. My 60+ neighbor grew up in this house. As his Mom got into her late 80's he would bring his Ford 9n over to brush hog the 5 acres the yard used to be (after cutting his 5 acres). His story was the tractor would lose power and get slower and slower to the point it could hardly operate the the 'hog. He had the entire motor rebuilt "from the radiator cap to the rear seal" he likes to say. Since then he blames unleaded gas. Although -- My brothers first car though was a 66 delta eighty-eight and it never had a problem with unleaded gas. It did have a problem with him never checking the oil though - lol Thanks Again

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Arnold R.

10-18-2003 05:08:09




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the va in reply to Bud, 10-12-2003 06:36:03  
Forgot-suppliers you want to look for are Penray/Nalco--E.t. lubricants--Fuchs/Century Lubricants-- The last two you wont find over the counter in the U.S. go on line to find the dist in your area.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mark G

10-12-2003 15:08:12




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS the va in reply to Bud, 10-12-2003 06:36:03  
Bud,
As the others have commented, tetra-ethyl lead was used as an anti-knock additive and not a valve lubricant.
By the way, has anyone ever heard a similar claim made of tractors run on kerosene or distillate?
I haven't heard anyone mention this.
There is no reason not to run an older engine on today's lead-free fuels.
I run my 1946 Ford 2N (and have done so for some time) on regular 87 octane unleaded gasoline.
Additionally, I use a synthetic multi-viscosity motor oil (Mobil 1 5W30) and am quite happy with the results.
There is really no reason not to take advantage of modern lubricants and fuels.
The mineral/synthetic motor oil debate has been discussed ad nauseum over on the Ford N discussion board.
Just check the archives if you wish to research this subject further.
Good Luck,
Mark G

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Arnold R.

10-18-2003 04:55:55




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: unleaded gas VS th in reply to Mark G, 10-12-2003 15:08:12  
Lead was added as said for anti-knock,hi-hp eng's and there's on the market,lead replacement's.
which dependent on the mfg (some shady snake oil pedlers) some not, In general, A small container
say a qt. @ $8-12 price and treats 125 gal is the real deal. The 1 gal container for a third the cost is a little product and a LOT of filler.and as the container states dependent on the sisuation more may be needed.. never did the math cost/product, but if you are worried and want to lube the valve/up the octane
simplely add 2 cycle oil each time you fill up. I have a 72 JD 140 and it had a tight valve.. I could till all day in 90 deg heat,but put the 47" mower deck on and couldn't get 1 hundred across the lawn,without it hanging up,add a few oz's and could mow 1' grass in 90 deg ht.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy