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Why mineral oil for hydraulics?

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Woody

10-23-2002 07:30:50




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What is the "school of thought" in using mineral oil for TO-20 or other vintage tractors in the hydraulics? One would think this was the best they could come up with 50-60 years ago but with new technology and years of testing, heavy wgt. hydraulic fluid like that recommended and sold at stores like Fleet Farm would be more feasible. Why would this not be correct and what damage would occur in not using mineral oil? Are there two schools of thought, one for keeping vintage tractors vintage and the other for using the best now availavle for vintage work tractors?

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Ford Man

10-25-2002 17:30:04




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
My question is why can I use New Holland 134 spec fluid in my Ford 2N and I am supposed to use mineral oil in my Ferguson 30 ? Aren't they pretty much the same hydraulic system ?

I need to change the fluid in my Fergie soon and I don't want to mess her up !

Ford Man



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Norm to Fordman

10-25-2002 19:43:33




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 Re: Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Ford Man, 10-25-2002 17:30:04  
I am not sure of the Holland oil designation you mentionned here but it has to be GL1 and not GL5.
The brass parts and old seals in these tractors don't like the detergent additives as damage will not occur overnight but in the longer term.
I know some have mentionned that they used it for a long period without problems but we sitting at our desks typing away on the puter can't really know all the details surrounding the assumptions except the mineral oil is what the manufacturers recommend and most of these tractors have survived to this point based on oils suggested by the manufacturers.Unless we jump in on conspiracy theories, I'll follow the manual's guidelines. :)

Good Luck

Norm in Ont

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Ford Man

10-26-2002 13:43:41




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 Re: Re: Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Norm to Fordman, 10-25-2002 19:43:33  
Norm,
I will take a close look at the specs before I change the fluid in my Ferguson . I would think that is would be the same for the old Ford but better safe than sorry !

Thanks !
Ford Man



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DAn

10-24-2002 10:32:23




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
The original oil in my TE 20 transmission appeared thick, though dont think that just because gear oil says 90 on it it is thicker than a much lighter engine grade. The gear oil is given a high viscosity figure not because it is thicker but simply to differentiate it from engine oil. Be careful with 90 gear oil, this has an additive in it which hardens gears but corrodes bronze components. The TE20 has bronze bushes and selector forks (as does Fordson F/N). Engine oil can froth up in a hydraulic system, though that is not always such an issue nowadays. Best to call a major reputable oil companies customer service and ask them which oil to use if unsure. They still are likely to have updated specifications for your model or could advise otherwise.

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Norm

10-23-2002 18:38:32




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
A case in point, this past summer I changed the axle seals on my TO35. The ones that came out looked very much made of leather. Now the new ones are made to accept the newer oils but I don't feel like changing all for the newer oil sake.


Thanks

Norm



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Ray,IN

10-23-2002 17:27:06




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
I echo the previous posts. The seals and bearings in these old tractors aren't made to withstand the additives in "modern" oils and WILL deteriorate, then eventually fail from it's use. I try to never out-engineer the guys that disigned old equipment and just follow their instructions faithfully. Guess it works, my 1953 TO30 still performs well in it's all original condition. The engine's never been apart for any reason, the trans/hyds/diff has always ran on 80/90wt straight mineral oil per owners manual trouble-free. At this rate, the tractor will outlive me; it's 50 I'm 60.

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Woody

10-23-2002 19:33:20




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 Re: Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Ray,IN, 10-23-2002 17:27:06  
I appreciate all your comments and now feel it necessary to go to 80/90 wgt. mineral oil. I just changed my Hydraulic pump in a TO-20 and put in hydraulic/trans. oil purchased from Fleet Farm. Ray's comment is somewhat sobering to say the least. Again, thanks for all comments.



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Fred OH

10-23-2002 09:41:14




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
The way I see it is....the manufacturers of this equipment just seen a void that they created by not selling the old style oil(mineral oil) any more, so....they looked at what they sell today and decided to push this off on anyone who would buy it. It's probably the only oil they carry today that won't etch the bronze bearings and other bronze parts....but in my opinion is way too light. Did you ever see a differential that used anything lighter than 90 wt? Well, I have sort of....a tag on the pumpkin of new Ford pickup says to use only synthetic 50 wt. It's a good bit thicker than the light viscosity oil that they're telling you is okay to run in their Ford and Ferguson tractors. Some users are starting to complain that their system is leaking down and doesn't perform like it did with the thicker 90 wt. stuff. Naturally...it doesn't have the clingability of heavier oil and probably if the right tests were done....the wear factor is significantly increased. The only place that I can see to use the lighter oil is in the winter time....and probably if you looked around....you might be able to find a 50 wt. mineral oil or a way to add some lighter oil mixed to the 90 wt for winter use. Just an opinion....take it for what it's worth. I'm no expert, but I have my thoughts. L8R....Fred OH

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Phil (VA)

10-23-2002 07:58:28




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 Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Woody, 10-23-2002 07:30:50  
A couple of points: The archives are full of this with reasons, etc. You can do a search and come up with lots of info. I can tell you from experience that Ford 134 hyraulic fluid (or equivalent) will leak past seals much quicker than 90 wt. oil. Second, the GL-1 gear oil is the same as mineral oil, and it is sold by the farm stores and NAPA and others, so it is readily available in most areas. Five gallon cans of Warren GL-1 at Agri Supply in Petersburg, VA are about $21. NAPA is slightly higher.

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Rusty

10-23-2002 16:17:31




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 Re: Re: Why mineral oil for hydraulics? in reply to Phil (VA), 10-23-2002 07:58:28  
The GL-1 is in my old tractors. Someone had fluid that looked like motor oil in the te-20. Changed it out.



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