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F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin'

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holt_2ton

09-05-2006 16:19:47




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I totally restored my'35 F12 a few years ago. and really she's always been hard to start. I mean I can crank and crank and then crank some more and she just won't start. mag was rebuilt and giving good spark, good plugs. but i just cannot get it going for nothing. and if i do get it running i can hear a wheezing sound out of the exhaust like a valve is stuck open, but i checked valve clearance once before and all was in good order and moving like they should. maybe a hardened seat that i had put in came out or cracked??? didn't always wheeze but always hard to start.

friend has a 15-30 and 22-36 and just does a choke-on half crank and choke-off crank and they're off and running....

suggestions would be greatly appreciated...

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Pete in Holland, MI

09-07-2006 05:58:06




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-05-2006 16:19:47  
My F-12 was the same way. Tore the engine down to put in new rings, rebuilt the head, new manifold & gaskets, rebuilt the mag, new wires & plugs. Never touched the carb. It started within the first 2 revolutions of the crank shaft that night. Cold, it starts on the first or second quarter turn of the crank.

Best of luck !



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holt_2ton

09-06-2006 16:48:38




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-05-2006 16:19:47  
John M,

to be honest i can't really recall which way the choke rod is when i do it...just walk up to it and do it. it's in my neighbors barn right now, so i can't really go and check. I am going to tear into it again this winter. need to finish up another project first(1924 caterpillar 2 ton) and then i'll bring 'er home and tinker with it. the wheeze is for sure coming out of the exhaust stack. when i crank i go what i would say is a medium crank speed. i've tried spinning it fast and all i get is a sore back!!

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John M

09-07-2006 03:33:56




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-06-2006 16:48:38  
As I said, to choke it push the rod in.It only takes one or two pulls to get it close or youre flooding it.Put in a set of Autolite 3077s, that cured alot of my problems. When I crank mine I pull up easy, then just before the impulse clicks I jerk it a little, sometimes I just pull it easy.Set the retard to just off the shut down position and verify it on the mag as the linkage sometimes is wore out.Give it about half throttle.

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El Toro

09-06-2006 06:01:55




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-05-2006 16:19:47  
Make sure your plug wires are copper wire and aren't the resistor type wires. Bring No1 piston to TDC on the compression stroke and then remove the cap from the mag and see where your rotor is pointing. Should be at the No1 plug tower. If it is, remove the coil wire from the cap and hold within 1/8-1/4" of a good ground while someone hand cranks the engine. Should have a hot blue
spark. You may have a weak coil if the spark is weak or the magnets may have lost some of their magnetism. Hal

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John M

09-06-2006 14:13:46




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to El Toro, 09-06-2006 06:01:55  
There is no coil wire on that mag.



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KEB

09-05-2006 21:26:46




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-05-2006 16:19:47  
Start with the basics. Engines need compression, fuel/air in the right proportions, and spark at the right time to run. My regular started this spring on the 2nd pull after sitting all winter, & the only time I've ever had trouble getting it to start was when the magneto had gotten wet. One pull with it choked then one or two pulls with 1/2 choke almost always starts it.

If you're hand cranking, you should be able to feel the cylinder come up on compression. Bring the engine around to where you feel it start to come up on compression, then quickly pull it through compression. You should be able to feel the difference if one cylinder has low compression from a stuck valve.

Check the timing and the impluse on the magneto. The impulse should trip just after top dead center (it'll kick back if the magneto trips too soon). It'll be hard to start if the impulse is tripping too late. How did you verify a good spark? Make sure you don't have flakey spark plug wires (and no resistor type spark plug wires).

If its still not running, that only leaves fuel. If its flooded you should be able to smell the gas fumes coming out of the exhaust, although I'm not sure how you could get it flooded in a couple pulls on the crank. Have you tried priming it with a little gas squirted in the air intake instead of choking it? A lot of aerosol carburetor cleaners are mostly propane (amazing what you learn by reading the label), and in my experience make good starting fluid for a gas engine. Propane isn't nearly as hard on an engine as ether. BE CAREFUL, TRY THIS AT YOUR OWN RISK, PROPANE IS EXTREMELY FLAMABLE. Instead of choking it, squirt a little carb cleaner in the carburetor air inlet & give it a couple pulls. If if fires, you have a fuel problem.

Good luck,

Keith

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John M

09-05-2006 16:46:50




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 Re: F12 can't get 'er to start fer nothin' in reply to holt_2ton, 09-05-2006 16:19:47  
How do you choke yours,rod in or out? If out then theres your problem. In is choke, out is run.You shouldnt need much choke at all, and if you are using the choke until it starts them you are flooding it most likely.Are you retarding your spark? How are you cranking it with the hand crank, fast or slow? What plugs are you running? Whne it wont start, have you pulled a plug to see if they are wet? The wheeze you mentuion may be a manifold gasket, or a bad seal on the plug(s)?

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