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new to farmall's need help with an M

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garry lee

08-15-2006 09:40:54

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i'm new to farmall's and just picked up an M and understand it has a hydrulic pump under the mid section of the tractor. i do have one hydraulic hose that comes out on the right hand side (siting on the tractor) and goes to the back with a quick coupler, and two short plugged lines coming off the other side of the tractor. is this pump a power one way type pump, where is the resevoir and how is it checked? i'm guessing it's not a live type pump. i'm getting a book but dont have it yet so thought i would ask for advice here.
thanks
Garry

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Andy Martin

08-15-2006 11:28:20

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to garry lee, 08-15-2006 09:40:54

You've got it figured out. Either of the three ports can be used for pressure. The rod on the right side controls the pump. Forward is return oil, back is pressure oil, and there is a middle detent position which will hold a cylinder up. The pump runs all the time that the clutch is engaged. The raise position closes a dump valve and allows the system to pressure. The forward position raises check valves off their seats to allow oil to return. The rear left and right ports are the same. The front port is on a separate valve and was used to stage the front of a cultivator different from the rear. You will get pressure on the front first and it will let down first. Sometimes if the pump will not hold a cylinder up you can change to teh front port and get better results because it uses a different check valve. If it is working properly there will also be a detent at the most forward position. I have a couple of pumps which iwll let an implement fall but once it stops, the valve seals off again and you have to push the rod again to get it to really let all the pressure off. I think this was intended to let a cultivator fall to the ground then hold it from digging in further. The pump has to be in good shape to work this way.

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Wayne Swenson

08-15-2006 12:55:42

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to Andy Martin, 08-15-2006 11:28:20

Andy, you are partly correct. The so called "delay valve" was usually installed on the rear left outlet to allow the farmer to lift the front cultivator gangs (L & R) as the tractor was moving and then the rear gang would come up at about the same point in the field as the front did. It worked the same when lowering. The delay valve was purchased separatly, is on the OUTSIDE and could be attached to any port but usually the left rear for above mentioned reasons. Having taken belly pumps apart in the past, I never found any separation between the 3 outlets. They were one common casting and served by the full pump output. The ball & spring found inside are for pressure relief to prevent excess pressure on cold mornings with 30 weight oil.

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John M

08-15-2006 17:36:36

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to Wayne Swenson, 08-15-2006 12:55:42

Hmmmm....IF I plumb my 3pt on my M in the rear port,it comes up slower than if I plumb it into the front port.I dont see anything extra on the outside of the pump other than a pipe.

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Wayne Swenson

08-15-2006 21:31:10

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to John M, 08-15-2006 17:36:36

John, I had to go look in my parts manuals for H & M"s and in a Lift-All original supplement book to verify that the valve is an add-on. I put 2 images from a parts manual in the Implement photo section.
Why your 3-point works differently I cannot explain.

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John M

08-16-2006 13:58:12

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to Wayne Swenson, 08-15-2006 21:31:10

Then every freaking Farmall M or H that I have ever had or worked on is wrong. There is no valve of any sort on the outside of the pump.When I had a set of cultivators on one of my Ms, the fronts came up faster than the rears. Guess I dont know what im talking about it since ive been told that once today by someone on this board.

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Andy Martin

08-15-2006 15:23:14

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to Wayne Swenson, 08-15-2006 12:55:42

Are you 100% sure about that?

The funny little rocker lever that depresses the ball checks to release them will release the front one first, then the back. I am certain the front port is on a different circuit than the two back ones. But now I'd better go look. I have one sitting on the bench.

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CNKS

08-15-2006 17:18:43

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to Andy Martin, 08-15-2006 15:23:14

Delay valve goes on the rear port. The manual says the rear port is for the rear cylinder, but does not mention the delay valve. We never really got the thing to work right anyway. Been 50 years, but if I remember right, on our H, if the delay valve was not used, the rear section came up first. Whatever it did, it didn't matter much with our cultivation.

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Wayne Swenson

08-15-2006 21:34:26

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Re: new to farmall's need help with an M in reply to CNKS, 08-15-2006 17:18:43

With hydraulics, the easiest cylinder to move will work first and as pressure builds in the system the next easiest and so on.
The rear gang of the cultivator was probably lighter than the front ones.

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