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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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Difficult Shifting

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PAULIH300

06-02-2005 18:50:13




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My 300U has always been a bear to shift once its warmed a little.You have no problem shifting into gear from a neutral start,but after a while,when stopping with the brakes it will fight coming out of gear.I thought maybe the clutch is dragging,but it doesnt grind when entering a gear,and clutch engagement is very smooth.It doesnt seem to be in multiple gears either as I have replaced the shifter with a very good used one.It does free up once you roll the tractor in gear slightly,or let off the brakes.It seems the brakes put a load on the trans and locks it into gear.It has TA,but this happens TA on or off,and it happens in every gear.I have not yet changed out the gear lube/motor oil they have in there,but I plan to once I tear the other brake apart that I havent yet.

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captaink

06-03-2005 06:35:54




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 18:50:13  
Good posts on the TA and the need to get it adjusted correctly. What happens when it is not adjusted correctly is the direct clutch on the TA planetary doesn’t fully disengage preventing the planetary unit from rotating and the sprag clutch (one way on the back of the planetary unit) prevents it from rotating one way, so any pressure between the gears in the transmission is not relieved.

BUT you noted that you have a hang up with the TA in either position which leads to other possibilities also. I have personally seen where the original full faced fiber clutch disk (main clutch) has been replaced with a metallic button clutch disk. These button clutches were sold on the premise that they reduced the heat created by a slipping fiber disk and that they could handle higher horsepower better in hard use situations like under loaders. What I have noted is that these clutch disks are harder than the flywheels and pressure plates and wear a curve into the pressure plate and flywheel surfaces. Tearing the clutch apart and installing a new disk, pressure plate, and resurfacing the flywheel will cure the issues for a while unless you put a full faced fiber clutch back in. I have theorized that this curved area causes the clutch to “drag” when released and even may get “sucked” against either the pressure plate or flywheel. Some have had some reduction in this phenomenon by grinding an X shape in each pad on the clutch disk.

I usually put up with poor shifting until I have the tractor apart for another reason, then I reface the flywheel, replace the pressure plate and the clutch disk with the original style full faced fiber disk. This seems to offer the best solution when adjusting the TA won’t take care of this problem.

My nickels worth.

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captaink

06-03-2005 06:37:56




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to captaink, 06-03-2005 06:35:54  
One other thing. It could be the pilot bearing (bushing) on the front of the clutch output shaft draging. Some can be greased (H and M for sure) from the outside if the engine is rotated to the proper place so the zerk in the flywheel lines up with the hole in the torque tube.



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brownie45

06-03-2005 05:32:32




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 18:50:13  
a possible problem here could be that the brakes are not releasing fully. If the ta is in proper adjustment , and the brake discs are rusty/ not free on the splines this could affect shifting as you are describing.



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PAULIH300

06-03-2005 13:43:43




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to brownie45, 06-03-2005 05:32:32  
I still have to open up the right side brake and have a look at whats going on in there and to change the bull pinion seal.However,the brakes DONT drag.This happens when the brakes are applied to hold the tractor in place for shifting.When the brakes are released,it usually shifts fine.



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Hugh MacKay

06-03-2005 02:39:17




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 18:50:13  
Paul: Van has the answer, TA must be adjusted by the book and to the letter. Close doesn't count. Go to about page 3 or 4 on this discussion, look for Lance and the adjustments on his 560, and just how happy he is with it correct. The very best instruction for this is right in your operators manual from IH. IT manuals don't cover this subject very well.



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Lance R.

06-03-2005 05:42:58




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to Hugh MacKay, 06-03-2005 02:39:17  
Hugh, After I posted the message on the IT manual I found the IT manual to be just as good as the IH preventative maintenance Manual. I'm sorry I bad mouthed the IT manual.



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Hugh MacKay

06-03-2005 13:11:40




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to Lance R., 06-03-2005 05:42:58  
Lance: Didn't intend to sound as though you were bad mouthing IT manuals, it was purely my own opinion. Don't get me wrong either, I like IT manuals in many ways. I just like the way IH handled the TA subject.



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Van in AR

06-02-2005 19:43:24




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 18:50:13  
Paul,
Your TA clutch linkage is out of ajustment, if it is not to the letter perfect the trans will always seem in a bind trying to come out of gear.The TA linkage that is out of ajustment just a little due to wear, etc will cause the clutches to bind or fight each other if you will. When you get it perfect by the book if it still binds you have a TA problem. When ajusting all linkages DO NOT skip any step, start from #1.
Good luck,
Van

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Tweeter

06-02-2005 19:09:49




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 18:50:13  
My 330U does that sometimes too. Fifth gear on mine does not slide into gear the same distance that all the others do. Meaning the shifter doesnt shift the same distance into gear as it does when I would say put it in 3rd gear. But I can still drive it in fifth, is that common or is something wrong there.



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Jimmy King

06-03-2005 06:14:49




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to Tweeter, 06-02-2005 19:09:49  
That is normal in 5th



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PAULIH300

06-02-2005 19:23:37




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to Tweeter, 06-02-2005 19:09:49  
I havent noticed that,but I've only used 5th gear a few times and never gave it any attention....of course it was below zero at the time,and all I was thinking of was getting out of the cold....



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TDK

06-02-2005 20:21:28




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to PAULIH300, 06-02-2005 19:23:37  
The travel in to 5th gear is less than the others, so that's normal. As far as the T/A adjustment goes, I would do it according to manual. But sometimes after doing this it will still not work quite right, maybe due to wear. After adjusting, stop tractor on a slight grade, release the brakes and while holding clutch pedal all the way down see if tractor will roll backwards. If not, it means the T/A clutch is not releasing, then adjust until it will (with clutch pedal all the way down). This worked on our tractors .

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Hugh MacKay

06-03-2005 02:52:31




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 Re: Difficult Shifting in reply to TDK, 06-02-2005 20:21:28  
TDK: You are quite correct, if after adjusting by the book, it's not quite correct, just shorten the short linkage between clutch shaft and TA shaft a bit more. Just 1/2 turn on yoke at a time until you cure the hanging in gear.

The principle here is quite simple. Many guys report they cant shift gears until they pull back on TA lever. Technically what that short linkage does is shift TA to low as you push clutch pedal in. So rather than having to pull TA lever each time you adjust so clutch pedal does it all. Truth is none of the older Farmalls will shift easy when TA is technically still in high.

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