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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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6 or 12 volt??

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Farmallkid

12-13-2003 16:07:05




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I want to convert my M to twelve volt, the six doesn't cut it, I don't want to go to a show and not be able to start it. Some people tell me that it won't be original if i put a 12 system on it, but i want it to start every time.
My brothers h has a 6 volt on it and starts up good, it turns over fast, my m turns over once and if you don't get it started the first couple cranks then your screwed. There is a big difference between a h and a m engine.
What do some of you guys do when you restore a tractor, original or 12 volt?

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Heath

12-14-2003 19:17:16




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
Switch to 12. I have converted many H and M's and the improvement is dramatic. Heavy cables help 6v but 12v isn't even fussy. When I convert 826,856's to two 12v batteries instead of two 6v batteries the improvement is even better. One 12v battery will outdo two 6v batteries in those tractors any day of the week. Why did IH go to 12V? If you want it original by all means stay with 6v because it can be made to work well.

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Hugh MacKay

12-15-2003 18:53:57




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 Re: Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Heath, 12-14-2003 19:17:16  
Heath: Cranking amps is what counts, doesn't matter whether you have 1, 2 or 4 batteries 6 or 12 volt. You will get longer life from 6 volt batteries in any situation 6 or 12 volt system. I live in a cold climate and it is rare for me not to get 10 years on a 6 volt battery. I have never had one fail under 6 years. In contrast how often do you ever get 6 years out of a 12 volt battery. I only have once in 40 years.

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Delbert

12-14-2003 06:08:00




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
Use as big a 6 volt battery as you can find. They used to make a group 3 but a good group 2 will work also like the others have said cables and starter will do the job. I had a m farmall 6 volt would start anytime 18 to 20 below 0. Also you might try a 8 volt they crank over good. I have A m that is bored out like a super m and it starts right up with a 8 volt battery.



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randy hall

12-13-2003 20:27:37




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
the six volt starter on an m with high compresion pistons won't wheel it over very well. i change all of our m's over to twelve volts for better starting better lights and the economy of a alternator. there is quite a bit of difference between an h engine and an m engine.



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Hugh MacKay

12-13-2003 18:37:18




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
kid: You nailed the problem in one phrase of one sentence," it turns over once fast and if you don't get in a couple of turns your screwed". Clearly you have ether a bad starter or poor cables. My bet is its cables, which are just too light. Three turns of the starter and they are hot and plain useless. Go with 1 gauge wire and soldiered on ends and run your ground strap right to a casting. I find the best place to get heavy cables is heavy truck repair shops. 1 gauge is what they are using on those big diesels.

Take it from me, I am the guy that once started a 6 volt Farmall 300 unassisted by any means at -40 degrees F.

I also own 3 tractors with alternator conversions, one of them is 6 volt and has by far been the most sucessful. It has been over ten years and the battery and alternator I installed are still in tractor. I did replace the cables this summer as the old ones were stiff, brittle and had broken covering.

I had a 6 cylinder 100 hp Deere, batteries were 6 years old, coming on fall it got sluggish about starting. I replaced all the battery cables with new 1 gauge. That machine was started every day that winter no boosts and much of the time sub zero weather. I replaced the batteries in that Deere 2 years later.

If I had a dollar for every battery, starter, generator, etc. that has been thrown out across North America, when the real problem was battery cables, I'd be a very wealthy man.

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farmallman

12-13-2003 17:50:45




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
I got a farmall with a 6-volt. just adjusted the timing and that thing purrs like a cat so I don't see what problem u guys are having with the 6-volt system.

Good luck though with ur decision



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BIG JOHN

12-13-2003 17:38:16




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
I always go to 12 volt system if the generator or the regulator need work. If they are working properlly then put on new 2/0 battery cables. You will probably have to make them. Welding Supply houses all have the cable and Auto Parts houses will have the ends. In addition to the new cables I always run the ground cable to the base of the starter. There is no substitute for these heavy duty cables on a 6 volt system.

Even if you change to a 12 volt system later the cables will never be a wasted expense.

I am like you a 6 volt system never really works well for me, so it really doesn't take much for me to change to 12 volts.

GOOD LUCK

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farmallman

12-13-2003 17:33:33




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
Hey farmallkid

Keep it original and fix it. a guy one told me..."with antique tractors you have to close your eyes and open your wallet" how true



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Steve - IN

12-13-2003 17:28:25




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 Re: 6 or 12 volt?? in reply to Farmallkid, 12-13-2003 16:07:05  
Farmallkid,
Sure there's a difference between a H and a M engine; but it's not large enough to account for the difference you and your brother are getting from your starting systems.

I've got an H on 6 volts. It was 25 degrees today. It turned over quickly and started easily. The system is real simple - battery, cable/connectors, motor, switch.

Rebuild the motor (it's the same motor you'd use for 12V anyway, and you can clean it and install new brushes for less than 5 bucks) and it will turn a lot easier, requiring a lot less current from the battery. Get some cheap 0 or 00 gauge welding cable and connectors to make your own cables, and throw in another 10 bucks or so for a new switch to make sure there are no narrow spots in the road from the battery to the starter. Assuming your 6V batt and charging system is half way decent, your M should turnover as fast as any 12 V system with those changes, at less than or equal to the cost of changing to 12. Besides! -- you'll be able to brag how easily your M starts with the original 6V setup when you take it to shows.

There is some logic to the thought that an alternator makes a world of difference, as it has a higher amperage than any generator. But you can get a 6V positive ground alternator for not much more than a standard 12- ground.

Six volt systems have been starting tractors for years. You'll probably be in for less money in fixing a 6 than converting Given all that, it's hard to see why 12 volt systems are any kind of magic cure all.

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