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Farmall M Starts in Gear

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vic

09-07-2002 18:12:28




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I bought this tractor about a year ago, it starts and runs very well, however I don't like the idea of it starting in gear. Is this the way it came from the factory? Or is there a simple way to disable the starter so won't start if left in gear? I don't like this feature, it is dangerous.




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Andrew from Aust Safety switch no substitute for common sense!

09-08-2002 22:30:44




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
I'm sorry but,.... just form a habit of checking whether it's in gear. When it was designed electric start would still have been a luxury. I think you'd bother to check if you were standing in front cranking!!!! Just be thankful you don't have to remember to retard the spark!!



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john d - Well now...if you're really into safety.....

09-08-2002 22:00:18




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
You can probably rig a switch that would accomplish what you want. It seems to me that it would be pretty simple to install a micro-switch bracketed to the bottom portion of the steering column support post. The switch could be positioned so it would only allow starting when the gearshift lever was in neutral AND pushed hard to the right. To accomplish this, you'd likely need to run power from it to a solenoid that would then send power to the starter.... I hope you see where I'm headed here....you can likely do something like this, but you'll be adding some additional layers of complexity to the situation! If that was the plan of choice, it would work mostly because the operator would have to put the shift lever into neutral, and have ahold of it! The best plan is to never start the tractor except when you're in the seat, and have checked to make sure it's in neutral.

"Old-time" farmers (including some of this board) would never see the need for a neutral safety switch. By comparison to farming with horses, a Farmall M absolutely REEKS of safety! By comparison with tractors of the 1920's and 30's, it looks pretty good also. Most of us who grew up on a farm in the 40's 50's and 60's farmed with stuff that would grab us and kill us if we didn't learn (and follow) safe procedures. Having said that, there's no way to be 100% safe with any tractor, anymore than with a car, a truck or a firearm.

Let's face it, starting that M from the ground is just too tempting at times. We've almost all done it, and if it's in gear, there's a chance it's in a gear that will head it in your direction! A previous post mentioned the old Ford tractors as being pioneers in neutral safety swithes. Could be in part because about the only way you could reach the switch from the ground was to stand between the wheels on one side of the tractor! If it was in ANY gear, it was coming your way!

For those who don't like safety devices of any kind... I suppose the world would be simpler without ignition keys, door locks, safety switches on firearms, and matches that would strike anywhere....but sometimes there are limits to what common sense and the legal system will allow!

Think safety and learn to enjoy that M!

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joe

09-08-2002 20:12:00




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
I am a farmer. I therefor believe that safety switches are nothing other than a nuisance. All it takes is some common sense. I always clutch when starting if I am in the seat, it makes the motor turn easier. And those few select times I am not in the seat, It has brakes set because it is running stationary equipment, I shake the shifter to make sure it is in neutral, and THEN, and ONLY then, do I start it. Even when I have clutched it, I still make sure it is in neutral. Companies were better about not messing with all these gizmos and gadgets and switches back in the day.... they are just one more thing to break down. And besides, it weeds out the idiots in the population.... (ok, I am just kidding, not really serious about that one)
Just my 2 cents worth

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mark

09-08-2002 19:04:11




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
We have pictures of the Super WD6 we still own with the front wheels down in the feed hole because "the tractor never started the first time the crank was turned" . First gear was slow enough to have time to jump out of the way. My mother had an 88 ford conversion van, she jumped out after stopping, when she came back out the van had went over a hill and stopped on the next ditch still in drive. the van has all kinds of safety switches on it but you can't overcome human stupidity!

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Safety starts with you.

09-08-2002 13:21:51




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
If you are worried about someone else (children or whoever) being hurt by your tractor, then you could put a clutch safety switch on it or just remove the battery. As stated in other post, safety inventions do come at a high price, and people have a knack for bypassing the best safety devices. Teach any person that has any thing to do with your tractor, the proper way to start it. And the number one things to learn is to make sure it is out of gear and the clutch is depressed and ONLY STARTED FROM THE SEAT.

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caseman-d

09-08-2002 11:01:08




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Vic,
Considering the history of the tractor from the 1900's to present day there have been many improvements on the way they start. First there was just the crank, just think how amazed our forefathers were. It didn't take them long to realize that they turned over much easier when they were left out of gear. Hey they probably even read the owners manual if they could read, buy hey they had some great pictures for them to look at.

Then there was the electric start, no more broken wrist from the backfire of engine causing the operator much pain. With the electic start came batteries, generator's, and starter's along with lots of exxtra's. Guess what, they still had a operators manual telling you the do's and don'ts. I bet the owner was so proud he sat down and read the owners manual to figure out the do's and don't's. He even looked at the pictures to see what happens when one fails to follow the proper operations.

The great thing from the crank to the electric start was that the farmer/rancher could always park the tractor on a hill and start it by rolling it down a hill to get it started. Sure that wasn't in the operators manual. Then as the machine got older the operator started having problems, lets say electrical switch, well farmer Joe can't afford a new switch so he by passes the switch with his pliers to get it started. Well this works fine till little Johnny see's pa do this. So little Johnny takes his pliers to start it while pa is in eating supper. Well little Johnny didn't realize that pa had left it in gear as it run over him and sent him to visit his great grandpa.

Well farmer Joe felt so sadden for the loss of little Johnny that he sued the tractor company for not having a shield on the solenoid where they were jump starting it. So tractor company lost the law suit so they put covers over the solenoid. Farmer Joe got his money for the loss of little Johnny and the tractor company added another picture in the operators manual.

As time changes so does the tractors. They have a cover on the solenoid to keep one from getting run over(Tell farmer Ben). Ben was having starter problems, but he couldn't jump the solenoid because of the new cover they had on them, well Ben found another way to jump start his. Worked great till little Ben was playing on the tractor and stuck it into gear. Well Ben comes out the next morning jumps his tractor and starts up(yeah you guessed it) and runs over Ben. Cripples poor ole Ben, well Ben sues the tractor company because it had no neutraul safety switch. Yeah poor ole Ben gets a big settlement and the tractor manual gets another picture.

Tractors today have many many safety features but I an sure Farmer Tedd can still find a way to get around the safety switches on today tractors. Makes one wonder what happen to common sense and why people can not be responsible for there stupidity. I could go on and on but if you don't know how to operate a piece of equipment safely stay away from it. At least stay away from me if you do. It's all common sense folks

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Gene

09-08-2002 12:10:52




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 Re: Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to caseman-d, 09-08-2002 11:01:08  
caseman-d: Ya know, I think man's ability to goof up a good thing has been going on ever since the "Garden of Eden." We got the 10 Commandments years later to help straighten us out but we found that those 10 commandments did not stop the damage that we all do to each other. Newer laws and rules or suggestions..?? Nope. Not for very long anyway. But we can keep on trying.
G.



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Zonie

09-08-2002 09:44:45




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
The farmall M's were built 50-60 years ago long. These and all other tractors were built befor the Company's ever gave safety much thought. I guess they thought anyone who used them would learn the hazzards and learn to cope with them.

These old tractors are inherently dangerous, There's lots of dangers involved. I guess the best advice I can give is get familliar with all the dangers and be careful. Either that or trade the tractor for a new model with all the safety goodies. I'm sure they still have hazzards but maybe the worst have been addressed

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Hugh MacKay

09-08-2002 02:30:46




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Most of the early tractors up to about 1965 did not have any type protection. It was easier to get on tractor and start than reach from ground, on older row crops and standards. The tractors that created a lot problems early on were the ones you mounted ahead of rear wheels i.e. Fords and Fergusons. It was so easy to stand in there in front of that rear wheel and start the tractor.

Knowing the design of your tractor and if this concerns you a lot clutch pedal switches for 06 and 56 and later Farmalls should be quite easy to adapt to your M. I am willing to bet the price of it will do wonders for your memory.

Trying to make tractors, trucks and cars idiot proof has cost society a lot of dollars. It really hasn't helped. Today we have a society with a very cavalier attitude towards SAFETY.

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big fred

09-07-2002 20:59:04




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
You sound like you might be a lawyer fishin' for evidence to use in a lawsuit. Am I close?



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Fm...Here is how to fix that.

09-07-2002 19:57:01




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Do like it says in the operators manual and A.)shake hands with the gearshift before you start it and B.) be in the seat and push in on the clutch before you start it.



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Jailkeeper

09-07-2002 19:01:09




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Dad had a Case VAC when I was a kid. The only time I ever seen him start it from the ground, it happened to be in gear. It fired right up and ran over a brand new battery charger, about $300.00 worth.

I learned a valuable lesson that day. Get on and push in on that clutch pedal!!!!



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Don LC

09-07-2002 18:59:31




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
A tractor "OPERATER" doesen't need a safety switch,on the clutch....that tractor is to big for you..... .(smile every body else is)



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CNKS

09-07-2002 18:41:28




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Got in the habit years ago of pushing in the clutch (if it has a clutch) before I start anything. Just make it a habit.



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Jim in Michigan

09-07-2002 18:18:51




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 Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to vic, 09-07-2002 18:12:28  
Every Tractor that I have ever had(25 or so) has started in gear,, push in the clutch before starting, or be really certain its in nuetral,, either way dont stand in front of the tires when starting it,,,Jim



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the tractor vet

09-07-2002 18:32:56




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 Re: Re: Farmall M Starts in Gear in reply to Jim in Michigan, 09-07-2002 18:18:51  
Ford and fergasons where some of the first that ya had to have them in neutral with IH's it was the 06 seires that had a clutch safty switch but some of them have been bypassed over the years , and i almost got run over by my owen tractor because someone else used it and did not put it in neutral and like a dumb @#$%$#@@ i walked up to it like i always did and pulled the throttel down a bit and turned the key and pushed the botton and it did like it always did it fire right up and was in high 1 not in park like it should have been from then on i fixed the safty switch and never started one from the ground again .

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