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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum
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Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 series ?

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Walter in Ky

01-16-2007 10:55:51




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Always thought the 220 was a brute and wanted one. Remember Al Arnold taking 5 through pulls at NFMS pull for 2 straight wins in heaviest class in late 60's or early 70's.

What are strong/weak points on the 220, and what was supposed to be improved in the 7000 series replacements? I understand there were transmission problems in the 7000's, also what is special about the "Red Belly" series 7000's? Thanks - Walter

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Jack A

01-18-2007 03:56:33




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 10:55:51  
Pretty much agree with what Hurst said. The 220 was a bullet proof tractor but didn't have the up to date features. There is little difference between the maroon belly and black belly 7000 series except in the straight 7000 tractor. The 7080 was a little over speeded and had crankshaft problems but I knew of a couple that were turning around 250 hp. The transmissions were, in my view, in their time the best built absolutely. The cab had about the same cubic feet as the Deere 30 series. They were wider at the belt level but narrower at the top and they were the quietest cab built. The hydraulics were also about the best in the industry. The 220 also had good hydraulics but not like the 7000 series.

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Walter in Ky

01-16-2007 16:48:20




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 10:55:51  
Hurst - small world. Am in Danville, 45 min away from Midway which is perhaps the most beautiful place in Ky. Been to Moores many times.

Curious, if the 7010 and up were so much more advanced, why did you get the 7000? I know money and "deals" are different.

What were the rated HP on each of the 7010 and up series? Walter



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Hurst

01-16-2007 17:36:47




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 16:48:20  
The main reason for the 7000 was that I found a nice late black belly, 24th from the last one made, about 150 miles away from me. The closest 7010 I could find was around 200 miles away at the time and was over 10,000. I got the 7000 black belly for 7500, so that was not too bad for a 106 hp tractor. It is also a lot more simple to work on than the 7010, which is good because I have had mine torn down quite a few times due to seals needing to be replaced where it had sat for so long and the seals hardened and decentigrated. Overall, the tractor looked like it had always been shedded, had supposedly had the engine redone at 4000 hours, and it had 5200 on it when I bought it, and it was close. Another thing is that the tractor is quite a bit lighter weight wise. It would have been really hard to convince my dad to let me have much larger of a tractor than the 7000 on the farm.

The HP for the 7000 series went like this:

7000: 106 PTO
7010(were only black bellies): 106 PTO
7020(were only black bellies): 124 PTO
7030(were only red bellies): 131 PTO
7040(were only red bellies): 136 PTO
7045(were only black bellies): 146 PTO
7050(were only red bellies): 156 PTO
7060: 161 PTO
7080: 181 PTO

Also, another thing about owning a 7010 vs a 7000 is the cost of maintenance. A 7010 in the hydraulics/tranny uses more than my 7000 does in the rearend AND hydraulics and tranny combined I think, or close it it. I pretty much wanted a learning project, so I didn"t need the biggest and the best, and plus, the 7000 was based on an older, simpler design (bull and pinion final drives, dry brakes still, etc). If I was going to use it for a real work tractor, I would probably try to find a 7010 unless you are just talking about a small farm, then a 7000 is all you will need. Hope it makes sense... You thinking about getting into orange again? I got started when my dad sold our D17 series IV diesel when I was a small kid, I missed that old tractor, used to ride on it with him baling and actually was the first tractor I ever drove (did back the manuar spreader into the side of the barn once on it too... lol) and since I couldn"t find it, I figured I would try something more practical, so I chose the 7000. If you know the whereabouts of a D17 IV diesel that has a snap coupler and 5 bolt front hubs (a sign of an early series 4), let me know, I would be interested in seeing the old girl some day. It was sold through moores, we traded it in with a blown head gasket.

Hurst

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Walter in Ky

01-16-2007 14:46:53




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 10:55:51  
Hurst - thanks for a great explanation! Super job. Although my Dad went from an Allis 200 to a 7000, I never knew all the engineering updates that accompanied that move. He traded the 7000 for a Deere 7210 in 1997, primarily due to dealer issues. Over the years, we went from a Red outfit, to all Orange, to all Green now. I must say those Deere PowerQuad Transmissions are wonderful.

Dad still has his first tractor, a one owner original 1950 M Farmall, and it runs like a top. Thanks again - Walter

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Hurst

01-16-2007 15:06:49




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 14:46:53  
No problem. Glad to help! The 7000 was a different beast from the 7010 and up (these are known as the 7000 series, it's really confusing, but the 7000 is excluded from the 7000 series... so really your Dad did not get too much of a different tractor mechnaically, but a lot more comfortable and user friendly one). The 7000 was a 200 in different skin with a couple of improvements in the tranny, rear end, and PTO, but it had all the older stuff like the dry brakes, the dry clutch (on the red bellies only, they were wet clutch on the black belly) etc.

My uncle has a 7200 with a powerquad and he says he really likes it and it is coming up on 7000 hours. I still think if I was going to spend the money, I would keep my blood orange lol.

Just wondering where in Kentucky you are from? I am from Midway, right outside of Lexington and use Moores equipment in Shelbyville, not too bad of a drive, about 35 minutes normally, so I guess I am pretty lucky. I bought my 7000 2 years ago this coming summer when I was 15 years old, so now that I am 17, its a little easier to get parts since I don't need to bug the ol man about driving me to get them. Moores has been very good for me, but they can be a little pricy, but they have a right to be considering they are the only original Allis dealer in central Ky.

Sorry for the confusion on the 7000 vs the 7000 series, I too was really confused when I first discovered allis tractor. Basically, the 7010 to the 7080 are all on a very similar platform, the only difference is how heavy the parts were made, while the 7000 is a 200 with a 3spd powershift, an independent PTO, new sheet metal, and a couple of minor changes, and when compared to the black belly 7000, it also had a wet clutch and inching pedal vs. the standard dry clutch.

Hurst

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Hurst

01-16-2007 14:23:47




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 Re: Allis 220 -why was design changed to 7000 seri in reply to Walter in Ky, 01-16-2007 10:55:51  
The 7000 series replaced the hundred series mainly because they were becoming outdated compared to their competator"s counterparts. The 7000 sereis had wet brakes, a wet clutch, an avalible powershift transmission (and the standard transmission had a powerdirector which was a 2spd powershift), planatary final drives, an avalible 540/1000 rpm, a cab that was very nice for the time even if some complain about it being small and it was also safe, features such as stadium lights, radios, power mirrors, and air conditioning, stronger frame rails, heavier front end, and also had a lot more "stylish" modern look. The 7000 was kind of a transition tractor into the modern tractor era into the 8000 series. However, the series had very few problems, and no weaknesses that were common that I am aware of. They were much stronger built than the previous tractors. The 220 only made around 150 hp, while the 7080 could make 190 hp. They were just a heavier built tractor that are very reliable if maintained (just like any other tractor). The 220s downsides to the 7000 series were: dry brakes, dry clutch, a mechanical 8 spd transmission (vs the avalible 12 spd powershift or 16/20 spd powerdirector transmission), an open platform (only a few factory cabs and aftermarket cabs, but they were not much), a 1000 rpm only PTO, bull and pinion final drives, bigger engines for the same power (the 210 had a 426 while the 7020 had a 301 turbo and intercooled engine that made around the power), and they did not have the features that were becoming needed to sell a new tractor. They were just becoming outdated. The red belly 7000 series were the early 7000 series tractors and a few of these had problems with the powershift shearing bolts, but it was rare and could be easily upgraded and was upgraded in the black belly 7000 series powershifts (7/16 bolts used in place of the 3/8 bolts) This is about all I can think of now. I don"t own either, but did a lot of research when I was looking for a tractor before I ended up buying a 7000. Also, the 7000 series had a transmission brake that some absolutely hate, but it can really save the transmission and is needed in a tractor with a wet clutch. It was not as convenient as a syncronized transmission, but was a nice addition in my opinion. Good luck and feel free to e-mail me if you have any questions.

Hurst

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