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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum
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adding live hyd. to B any ideas

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Jpuleo

10-06-2005 12:46:23




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I have a 46 B. It has the factory hydraulics. They stink! I would like to ad live "or at least usefull" hydraulics. Possible thoughts are as follows.
1)Add a small belt driven pump to the fan belt somewhere.
2)there is a pulley on the differentail housing opposite the hydraulic pump that I never use. Would a pump mounted to that work? I want to ad that I dont know much about hydraulics but have a full machine shop at my disposal. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Thanks
Joe

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LWD

10-07-2005 14:33:25




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
what are you going to lift? how often? I use a myer snow plow pump on one of mine. and I use a D-15 motor in the other with a gear driven power steering pump that came with it.



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Jpuleo

10-07-2005 15:36:44




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to LWD, 10-07-2005 14:33:25  
Im planing to use a log splitter, post digger and grader blade



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Hurst

10-07-2005 16:32:18




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-07-2005 15:36:44  
For the post hole digger and grader blade, you will not need much flow since the lift arm cylinders are so small. I am not sure where you are from, but in Ky, we had a lot of hauns Hi boys for spraying tobacco and the later ones with hydraulics all had a pump that was driven by the alternator belt, which only drove these two things, no fan or water pump. I am not sure how much pull the generator has on the belt. Are you going for stock look or just usiblilty? If you just want to use it for now, I would take off the generator, don't trash it, just keep it around in case you would ever want to restore it, and replace it with a delco alternator off of an old chevy truck with a double pully. For this, I would line up the inside pully to drive the alternator from the engine and then use the outside pully to drive either a hydrailc pump off of a hi boy sprayer (which are pretty good for their size) or a power steering pump off of a GM truck. You won't need 2800psi to lift either of those things. Now for the log splitter, there are about 3 things I would do. First, if you want to spend some money on it and make it more versitile, go find yourself a 5hp honda or briggs, what ever you prefer, and add a hydrailic pump to that, which will cost you some. Second, get a PTO mounted pump and run it off of that, since you won't be needing live power on the splitter. 3rd, would be to run it off the contraption up front if you don't care much about speed. Hope this gives you some good ideas.

Hurst

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D13

10-07-2005 03:42:20




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
Mine has a GM powwer steering pump hung out the left side. The generator has a 2 belt pully (any 60's GM car with power steering and air conditioning). The generator mount has been altered to disconnect it from the mainfold, instead it is supported by a custom bracket off the front support (an extra hole drilled near the top, above the exisiting hole). The power steering bracket mounts to the generator and this new bracket. Belt tension can now be adjusted for the pump by swiveling it on its bracket. Pump lines are fed to what appears to be a Farmall valve set wit hlarge actuating arms.

The pump is live and puts out enough pressure and volume. The issue bcomes the reservoir size. Once the fluid gets hot it expancds, and the volume change on a 3x16 cylinder betwen open and closed is enough to overflow the factory reservoir. This makes a heck of a mess. If the fluid level is adjusted to eliminate this the pump is almost dry when the cyl is extended and the fluid cold. I've been thinking about adding a remote reservoir but it has to be at the correct level and have enough flow to keep the pump happy.

Overall the system works well and is cheap, but I will probably re-engineer it to solve the hot fluid problem.

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mace56

10-06-2005 20:35:48




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
There were some GM automobiles with power steering built off the generator I think but that would not be cheap unless you happen to find one. Also probably low flow.



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J.C. IN AZ.

10-06-2005 20:11:11




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
Char-Lynn used to make an after market Hydraulic Pump. At that time it was PTO driven however in this day an age I would hope a different type would be available.Try Northern Hydraulics for a Parts Source.



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steve(ill)

10-06-2005 19:30:31




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
i had a plan similar to Butch a few years ago. i was looking at mounting a small pump under the radiator with the shaft below the crank pulley. thought about mounting a sprocket on the pulley and chain drive around the pump. i was trying to hide most of the pump inside the radiator wrap around, and not let it stick out the front of the radiator thru the crank hole.----- mounted to distributor drive also is a thought. i looked at a car stering pump, but there aint much room with the mag on one side and the generator ont he other unless you start chopping and modifying.

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Dick L

10-06-2005 13:41:53




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 Another Way in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
Is to buy the hydraulic pump from a Farmall H (if you can find one) that will install in front of your magneto.



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Dick L

10-07-2005 03:34:04




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 Yet Another Way in reply to Dick L, 10-06-2005 13:41:53  
If you have the equiptment. Someone posted pictures of how he designed live hydraulics for a C. He cut a V in the flywheel, cut openings/ slots in the bottom of the bellhousing, and mounted the hydraulic pump under the bellhousing. This was belt driven. You might be able to alter the flywheel to take a gear and chain drive it as well. That would up the cost some. I have a dozen or more old flywheels off crank start tractors that I have though about doing just that with cutting a gear for a chain. Thought is as far as it has gone.

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Butch(OH)

10-06-2005 13:20:42




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Jpuleo, 10-06-2005 12:46:23  
Pump driven by pulley will quit when clutch is pushed just like OEM. I would go crank driven instead of fan belt myself because like you I own machine tools. If I wanted to retain the ability to hand crank I would machine the front pylley to accpt a cog belt pulley and go down to a pump hung below. A neater installation is to go out the crank hole with a driver to a front mounted pump. Gear pump is what you need and an open center valve. Probably about 4-5 GPM? Im guessing there maybe somebodey else knows for sure. Link is where I buy hydraulic stuff. Qucik ship and good tech dept.

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Brian G. NY

10-07-2005 12:27:00




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Butch(OH), 10-06-2005 13:20:42  
A while ago I visited with a guy who had just completely restored an IB. This tractor had originally been a DOT roadside mower and had a hydraulically driven sickle bar mower on it. There was this neat hydraulic pump set up that ran off the front of the crankshaft. He had already removed it so I didn't see it on the tractor but I did buy it from him as I have a desire to adapt it to my WD. I'm with Butch; this seems like the ideal setup. All I need now is to get a "round toit" to complete the job. LOL

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B Allis man

10-07-2005 06:29:32




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Butch(OH), 10-06-2005 13:20:42  
I saw a B with a Hyd pump mounted where the mag mounts and it had a dist . The resivor was in the tool box . Dick L has the right idea .
B Allis man



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TxAllisMAn

10-06-2005 18:03:40




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 Re: adding live hyd. to B any ideas in reply to Butch(OH), 10-06-2005 13:20:42  
I have a 41 C that im working on restoring and was thinking the exact thing as Dick L about dist mounted pump.



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