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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum

B Allis that won't stay running

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James Ralston

05-29-2005 22:26:09

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I purchased this "B" model Allis, a 1948 model, with an FMJ magneto for ignition. It runs fine for about 6 to 10 minutes and then quits, just like you shut the gas off or turned the kill switch on. I have completely cleaned the carb three times to where it sparkles. Put all new fuel lines on, a new sediment bowl and fresh gas. Timing was set to the exact method as per manual. Tractor runs good for about 6 minutes and then sputters a little and then dies. In taking apart the magneto, an FMJ, I noticed some sort of set screw missing on the end that goes to the governor. There are two spring-loaded(whatever, I don't know what they are for) arm-like parts that pass by the one remaining screw, causing the spring arm to trip over it. I have not been able to find a Fairbanks Morse FMJ manual to explain what they are used for and tell me what parts are supposed to be there. Everytime I get it running, and it dies, I go through and find that the magneto timing is out. I may sound like a big dummy, but can anyone tell me if this missing part could be what is causing this thing to go whacky?

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Steve in N.J.

06-05-2005 20:03:06

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

James,
You are not missing anything in the impulse coupler cavity. There is only one set trip stud which is used to "trip" the impulse coupler. A lot of the early Fairbanks magneto's were equipped with the old style tar taped coils. These coils as they aged started to leak and eventually grounded themselves to the inside of the mag housing which killed the spark. Usually, this problem would start as the coil and the mag itself would start to get warm from engine heat. Once it started to warm up, the coil would fail shutting the engine down. Another thing to check is a failing mag kill switch if your B is equipped with one. Disconnect the kill switch and see what it does. If it dies again after a short period of time, then it's probably not the switch. If you find that the fiber gear and steel gear are not in time, the fiber gear shaft might have siezed itself to the lower cover bushing and spun the bushing in the cover making it very sloppy and making the fiber gear jump time. If that's the case, your mag will need some major work to get her back in shape. We service, rebuild, exchange, and sell parts for Fairbanks mags. Be glad to help you out! Drop us a line if interested. Thank You Jim for referring us!!
Steve@B&B
[email protected]

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Dave NE IA

05-31-2005 21:00:06

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

Pay attention to the exhaust as it shuts down---is there any white smoke? White smoke is gas--if there is no smoke you are looking for gas related problems. If you have white smoke --look for ignition problems, -- the gas is not being ignited. Valves could be the problem, but-- MY money is on the coil because of the time frame before shut down. Does the mag seem a little hotter than usual--kind of progressivly get hotter util shut down? Dave NE IA

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James Ralston

05-31-2005 13:55:35

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

Again, thanks to LWD and Chucko for your replies. I am not turning a deaf ear to anything. Just got all new parts for my magneto and will see what comes about.

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LWD

05-30-2005 23:44:07

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

I had the same problem, my cure was clean the rust out of the fiting the sediment bowl screws in to, take it out of the gas tank to do so.

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Jim Rose (NC)

05-30-2005 17:39:23

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

James, I have a 1950 "B" with the FM magneto and it does the same thing. With the help of Bill Long and Steve at B&B Circuits we have determined that the magneto coil is defective. As soon as the coil gets warm the fire stops. Give it 30 minutes and it will start right back up and run again for a few minutes. Steve at B&B has a repair servive or will do an exchange if you determine that the mag coil is bad. When I checked mag parts prices, his repair/exchange was cheaper than I could buy the parts. He checks this site often and will probably respond to this. He can most likely solve your problem with information you have already posted. He is a straight up guy. Jim

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Chucko

05-30-2005 19:23:41

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to Jim Rose (NC), 05-30-2005 17:39:23

Just ran into this same thing - but as we would give throttle, it would sputter and die. I found that the exhaust manifold was cracked and heating the carb. Fixed the crack by welding it runs fine again for the extended times. Might want to check that - just in case.

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Rod (NH)

05-30-2005 04:03:06

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-29-2005 22:26:09

Hi James,

That setscrew you mention is called a "coupling stop pin". It engages the pawls of the impulse coupling that cause a timing retard at starting. There is only one such pin used, even though there are two pawls. Your pin should be on the right hand side looking at the impulse coupling. There is a location for such a pin on the left side also. I think that location is used for magneto applications requiring an opposite rotation than the B does. Click on the thumbnail to bring up a full-sized cross section of the FMJ:

How do determine that the timimg is out after it dies?. I suppose it's possible that the fiber gear is worn enough to jump some teeth. I would suspect the coil but I don't think that would cause a timing change. Have you checked for a spark immediately after the engines quits?

Rod

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James Ralston

05-30-2005 07:32:05

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to Rod (NH), 05-30-2005 04:03:06

Rod, thank you for the quick reply. I shall check the spark after today, holiday makes things a little hectic. I feel better knowing that the part is not missing, as I thought it might be. I figure if it were missing, how did it run so well for a short time.

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Hubert

05-30-2005 16:44:01

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-30-2005 07:32:05

I once owned a B that sometimes suffered from shut down syndrome too . In my case acomplete cleaning of the carb would solve the problem for awhile.The installation of a in-line fuel filter solved the problem. hhy

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James Ralston

05-30-2005 17:35:30

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to Hubert, 05-30-2005 16:44:01

Hubert,
Thanks for the reply. I must admit that I am willing to try just about anything. I finally got it running again today and it did the same thing, spit and sputter, almost like it had a miss, run for about 10 minutes and then when I tried to idle it down, it died. I can bet that if I check the distributor again, the timing is off. Again, thanks for the reply.

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payne

06-01-2005 06:08:42

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Re: B Allis that won't stay running in reply to James Ralston, 05-30-2005 17:35:30

I had a problem similar to this on my Allis Chalmers CA and it is a coil tractor. I ended up figuring out that the sediment bowl kept getting clogged due to rust in th bottom of the tank. I fixed it by wedging a piece of brake line in the top of the sediment bowl and it works fine.

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