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Allis Chalmers Discussion Forum
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Model C converted to 12 volt

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Mark Keim

07-17-2004 15:16:20




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I have a 1949 Allis model C. Long before I purchased the tractor it had been converted from 6V to 12v. Recently I had some work done on it and the shop told me it had been wired wrong from the battery. They told me and re-wired the 12V battery to be positive ground. When I drove it home, just a short distance, the generator began to smoke badly. Were they correct about being positive ground, and/or should they have done something about the wires to the generator?

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Steve in N.J.

07-18-2004 17:42:10




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 Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Mark Keim, 07-17-2004 15:16:20  
Mark,
We offer a complete 12V conversion using Delco's 10SI internal regulated Alternator. This system is Negative ground. Because the regulator is "built-in" to the Alternator, it isn't neccessary to have an external regulator box hanging off the side of the machine. Our kit comes with our color coded wiring system, hardware, Alt brkts, switches, Voltmeter, step by step instructions, & diagrams for an easy to install system. Drop us a line if interested. If your machine is equipped with a generator, you can design the system to run positive ground. If smoke came from the generator, they possibly criss-crossed a wire by accident in the system. More than likely, on the voltage regulator side the way it sounds, but it's tough to tell you what to revise, or what went wrong via the internet than troubleshooting the problem with the tractor in front of you and making the proper changes....
Steve/B&B Custom Circuits

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ron

07-18-2004 15:34:15




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 Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Mark Keim, 07-17-2004 15:16:20  
Additional question
When you convert from positive ground to negative, won't the starter spin backyards. A man who did it on a Ford told me no but couldn't explain why



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steve

07-18-2004 20:13:53




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 Re: Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to ron, 07-18-2004 15:34:15  
no, when you connect the battery cables backward the starter spins the correct way, the generator must be repolarized so it will charge opposite, assuming you voltage regulator is a "dual" type. if not, you have to change the voltage regulator. 6 volt coil and lights are the main trouble.



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Doug in OR

07-17-2004 20:00:36




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 Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Mark Keim, 07-17-2004 15:16:20  
Positive ground is the wrong way for a 12 volt system. Sounds like your "shop" was not very whippy, electric-wise. In my opinion, they owe you a new generator.



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JMS/MN

07-18-2004 22:15:01




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 Re: Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Doug in OR, 07-17-2004 20:00:36  
You can get a 12 volt system in positive ground. If is an alternator system, it will be negative ground. But generators come in 12 v or 6 v, positive ground.



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steve

07-17-2004 19:00:59




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 Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Mark Keim, 07-17-2004 15:16:20  
what makes them think it was wired wrong? the original tractor was 6 volt positive gound. when you convert to 12 volt you can go with a 12 volt positive ground generator, or a 12 volt negative ground alternator. what do you have? if you have a alternator and they grounded the + on the battery, your internal voltage regulator is porbably fried.



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Mark Keim

07-18-2004 14:02:15




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 Re: Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to steve, 07-17-2004 19:00:59  
Thanks to Doug and Steve for their responses to my original message. Maybe you can help me futher if I give you additional information.

Here's how the tractor is wired right now:
From the 12V battery: The positive terminal/cable is grounded to the body of the tractor, Negative terminal/cable is attached to the starter solenoid ( I guess it's a solenoid ),
A smaller gauge red wire goes from this solenoid to the ignition ( key start ) box,
There are 4 to 5 smaller gauge wires that exit the key box: A white, blue an another white go lights. A red wire goes to the voltage regulator mounted on the tractor next to the round access door, There is a black wire, but I havn't been able to trace where it goes yet,
From the voltage regulator: One yellow wire is atttached to the "tab" indented "GEN" ( I suppose for generator " and attached to the outside post on the generator, another yellow wire goes to the inside post on the generator.

Anybody know if this is correct? By the way, I am not interested in nailing the guy who worked on my tractor, he has done good work before. I just want to get the tractor set-up correctly. Thanks

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steve

07-18-2004 20:08:19




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 Re: Re: Re: Model C converted to 12 volt in reply to Mark Keim, 07-18-2004 14:02:15  
Mark, you have a generator so it can be positive ground if the voltage regulator and generator are polarized to do this. it could also be negatvie ground if you wish, again, it needs to be polarized for this. i cant follow your color code, but i can send you a print if you wish.----- ----- - [email protected] ---- the battery positive terminal is grounded, the negative goes to the amp meter, other side of ampmeter goes to the "B" terminal of the regulaltor. the "G" and "F" terminals of the regulator go the the "A" and "F" terminal of the generator.----- -ther should be a big wire off the negative side of the battery that goes to your solenoid, and the other side of the solenoid goes to the starter. small wire off the solenoid goes to the starter button. ---- if you want a print, send me a note and say it is for a 12 volt generator.

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