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Allis Chalmers C Fairbanks Morse Magneto

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Lee in Wisconsi

02-21-2003 09:39:44




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I've nearly completed overhauling and restoring a
1947 "C". This tractor and a parts tractor both
ran prior to the restoration. However, now I have
a problem in that after the motor runs for twenty
minutes or so, after shutting it off for a minute
or so it won't start again until its cooled off.
It restarts under the warm condition if I restart
it immediately. Does this sound like the magneto
coil is bad or could it be some sort of
carbeurator vapor lock? I have a handy book by
Neil Yerigan titled "How to restore tractor
magnetos." The book is very helpful but it
prompts several questions and I don't know how to
ask them of Mr Yerigan directly. So, if any of
you have some ideas about them I'd appreciate your
response:

1: What is the magnetic rotor? Is it the armature?

2: Where is the neutal point on the magnetic rotor?

3: At one point Neil Yerigan states "if the high
tension points of the distributor cap shows a lot
of wear the cap should be replaced. . ." How does
one determine what "a lot of wear" is?

4: On page 97 Mr Yerigan alludes to
"remagnetising" the rotor. How is that done?

5: How does one run the magneto on a test bench?

6: At another point Mr. Yerigan suggests that "by
testing the nagneto with a grounded screwdriver,
if you see a 1/4" or larger spark when turning the
impulse. . ." I'm not sure how to create such a
spark - - between what and what?

Any comments regarding any of the above will be
greatly appreciated.

Lee in Wisconsin

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Leroy

02-22-2003 19:12:16




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 Re: Allis Chalmers C Fairbanks Morse Magneto in reply to Lee in Wisconsin, 02-21-2003 09:39:44  
My 1945 Allis worked a little like that except it lost power after using it about an hour. I would eventually kill it and it wouldn't restart until after it had cooled off quite awhile. I used it once when there was snow on the ground and it never did lose power then. Mine turned out to be the coil, but I would think yours would more likely be a fuel problem, since it will restart if only momentarily turned off.

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Mike (Oh)

02-21-2003 16:46:45




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 Re: Allis Chalmers C Fairbanks Morse Magneto in reply to Lee in Wisconsin, 02-21-2003 09:39:44  
I really don’t have an answer to this. My B does the same thing - kind of. It runs fine until it gets warm then starts to miss and finally dies. It will not start until it cools down. The only thing I can offer is what I have been thru. Was told the coil could be bad. Looked at spark when cold - looked good. Looked at spark when hot and was yellow. Ok found problem. Picked up another mag and put it in. Same thing - died when hot but spark looked good even when hot. Ok found a problem but not the cause. Someone told me they had a farmall M that did the same thing and it ended up being worn valve springs. Ok simple enough to change and kind of inexpensive - made no difference. Did notice timing mark would jump around and that ended up being bushing on end of governor (towards radiator) was working it way out - pushed it back in. timing mark was steady, ran better but still died when warm. Took compression test when cold - 75psi then when it quit - 50psi. Think this may be my problem. Not going the whole route just now. Bought rings and about ready to tear it down. Hopefully that will be the fix if the cylinder walls are in good shape and not too worn. Aren’t old tractors fun.

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Steve in N.J.

02-21-2003 15:36:11




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 Re: Allis Chalmers C Fairbanks Morse Magneto in reply to Lee in Wisconsin, 02-21-2003 09:39:44  
Lee,
I rebuild F/M mags, so I'll try to answer your questions in simple terms for ya.
1.Yes, the magnetic rotor is what you're calling the amature. It's not really an armature. Main shaft would be a little better reference name.
2.The neutral point is when you turn the mag. rotor shaft real slow at the spot you don't feel the drag anymore that's what he's calling the neutral spot. If you turn it slowly a few times you'll feel that drag, then it will turn easy for a second.
3. The F/M mag caps are pretty tough. If the high tension terminals aren't round anymore, or one of them is 1/2 of what it's supposed to be, I usually replace them. As long as they are still pretty round and have their shape, the cap's good to go.
4. Remagnetising a rotor is something you don't have to worry about. You have to have a magnetizer to do it correctly.
5.6. Again, a distributor machine is needed to do testing for distributors and magneto's. Here's how you can do it home. Set the points manually (.020) and start from there. Turn the lights off and turn the snap coupler and take a look at the spark at the points. A nice bluish white spark is what yer' lookin for. You can adjust the points a little tighter to get the spark you want. Depending on the wear on the rotor cam, will determine the best spark at the point contacts. You may wind up with .018 for optimum flash. Coils usually stay around a long time. The condensor is the little bugger that causes problems sometimes. Hope this helps ya out.
Steve/B&B Custom Circuits

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jeremy

02-21-2003 09:53:42




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 Re: Allis Chalmers C Fairbanks Morse Magneto in reply to Lee in Wisconsin, 02-21-2003 09:39:44  
Lee This is a common problem for this engine. It is flooding when warm. There is a petcock on the manifold above the carb. Open that before you attempt to start the tractor when warm. Or drain the carb bowl then crank until tractor starts. Then open fuel valve and re start quickly. This is a ritual I go thru all summer when mowing.



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