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Only Firing on Two-Cylinders

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Phil

09-04-2002 19:51:31




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I am having trouble with my show tractor. I broke down in a parade and could not get the tractor to restart. I did a complete tune-up, points, coil, wires, condensor, cap, rotor and plugs. Everything but wires. I got it to start, but it was running rough. I noticed if I pull one of the spark plug wires off the cap, it did not change the sound of the engine. It appears that only two of the cylinders are firing. I narrowed it down to the last two spark plugs. The first two plugs are firing closest to the seat of the tractor. The back two plugs do not appear to be firing. I have plenty of spark from the cap and the wire when I remove the wire from the cap. I cleaned up the plugs again tonight and even put new spark plug wires on it and they still do not seem to want to fire. I have a show to go to this weekend. Any ideas would be helpful. This is the first trouble I have had with this tractor. I do not have a compression gauge to check to seem if I am getting any compression from the cylinders. I do not hear any knocking or strange noises?

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Irv

09-07-2002 18:42:06




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Amen to G's comment. Broke down in the middle of a parade? Hard to get wires crossed there. Symptoms the same after all the work done? Do a compression check. Sound like a head gasket between the cylinders. Hard to tell somtimes though. Let us know. Irv



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David T (MO)

09-06-2002 08:08:15




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
I'll also tell of a recent experience. Father-in-law was hogging a field. Shut her down and left her in the field for the night. Horse pulled a plug wire off. He hooked it backed up and hogged until dark. Left her in the field another night. Horse pulled all the plug wires off and ate the coil wire. He replaced wires according to the firing pattern but she wouldn't start. A week later after working on her daily, found the horse must have cracked the distributer cap, but more importantly the distrubuter was rusted solid in its housing so no way to change the timing. Turns out TDC on #1 didn't match #1 on the distrubuter. Had to shift all the wires by one place before she'd run.

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steve

09-05-2002 18:33:04




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Phil, all the guys got good ideas. I also noted that you said you had good spark from the cap to the wire? but not from the wire to the plug? If that is the case, you might look at your wires. i know they are new, but older tractors with weaker coils, or magnitos, do not have really hot sparks. it is more important to use copper core wires on these motors. if you got the new resistor wires, you can develope the problem you stated. ---also the motor cylinders number 1 in the front by the radiator and 4 in the back by the gas tank. as the guys said look at the wire rotation on the mag. note that 1-2-4-3 backward is 1-3-4-2. it is easy to get the center two cylinder wires mixed if you look at the mag rotation wrong. this asusumes you get spark at all four plugs first, which i am not sure you have. also put the sparking plugs in the bad wires and that will chekc the plugs virsus wires.

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Bus Driver

09-05-2002 17:25:13




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Some really sharp thinking on the previous suggestions. In case it might help someone, here is my recent experience. Friend had Allis B that sat in the "dry" for 6 years. Engine could be turned by hand crank. Points corroded. When cranked, was not running on #2 cylinder. Removed valve cover and discovered that exhaust valve was stuck open. The resulting clearance had allowed the pushrod to fall to one side. Took brass drift, ball pein hammer and lots of WD-40 sprayed on the valve stem. Tapped on the stem and the valve partially freed. Reinstalled the push rod and adjusted that valve clearance. Still missing that cylinder- adjustment now too tight as the valve had come completely free. Readjusted that valve, ran engine on all cylinders (YES!) and when warm, readjusted all valves. Running the engine without the valve cover will result in some oil spray on the tractor.

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Larry

09-05-2002 17:16:34




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
You might try one more simple thing I found on a WDthat I bought. I thought the valves were bad but discovered it was just intake gaskets. Replaced the and it runs like new. Just a thought.



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Steve in N.J.

09-05-2002 07:40:23




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Phil,

All the fellows have great advice, but if this just all-of-a-sudden started, I would look for the simple things first. Cracked distributor cap, or mag cap (whichever your running) spark plug, like some of the guys said. Something dumb. You say it's a show tractor. Is the engine fresh? There's so many things that you have to take into consideration. If it's a freshly done resto and the engine is fresh, I would have to think it's something simple before I pushed the panic button. To me it sounds like it's an ignition problem. Something is causing the ignition system to go to ground and knock two cylinders out on ya. Run through the ignition system slowly. Check the coil (if equipped) for grounding to the high tension tower. You might be able to find the problem fast in the dark while the engine is running. Find an arch, or a spark, and there's yer' problem...
Good Luck! Hope you make that show!! Steve B.

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Don LC

09-05-2002 05:55:48




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Are these two plugs covered with oil?...If so oil is getting past the valve seals....The best thing to do in a hurry is very hot plugs.....replace the plugs with hot ones and increace the gap about .005".....these extra hot plugs are ok for a paraid,but don't work the tractor ,using them.....my guess is what you realy need is head work.....



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gatractorman

09-05-2002 02:54:53




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
I had a Farmall Cub do this to me a while back, tried everything but could not get the front 2 cyls. to fire, about to give up I took the side cover off and there it was a stuck valve on #1 got it loosened up and runs like a champ.



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Scott

09-05-2002 02:37:48




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
Hi Phil,

You know I have a JD that for some reason will have a cylinder go dead on me, and what it has always turned out to be is a sparkplug that has gone bad on me. I would suggest doing a simple test of removing one of your good sparkplugs that you know is firing and putting it in one of the dead cylinders that is known to not be firing and see if you get fire in that cylinder, if so then get some new sparkplugs. I have had sparkplugs drop out dead on me on my truck too, and I hope I don't hurt anyones feelings on this but I refuse to put champion plugs in anything I own, I have found they seem to go bad faster than any plug I have ever used in my tractors or vehicles. Hope this helps ya Phil, I know how much it means to have the tractor looking good as well as running good.

Scott

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Tom

09-05-2002 17:24:51




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 Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Scott, 09-05-2002 02:37:48  
Bought a dodge van in 88, was two years old, put new champions in it, have taken them out twice to replace but they looked new so I put them back in. Have put almost 100000 on it and they are still working great. Had AC in my dodge pickup,86 slant six, would skip under load, couldn't find problem, put champions in it and they have been in for 5 years. I know some engines seem to like certain plug brands so I know some will not agree with me, but I like Champions.

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JDGnut

09-05-2002 13:49:17




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 Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Scott, 09-05-2002 02:37:48  
Scott.. at first I thought U were going to tell him to make sure it wasn't a John Deere.. hahaa.. I agree with Scott on the Champion plugs.. sometime they just die with no reason, have changed everything to a different brand. I think everyone has given you some good leads, good luck...
JDGnut



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Punchie

09-05-2002 04:19:25




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 Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Scott, 09-05-2002 02:37:48  
HI Phil

Frist I would think Scott is on the right track and after, tring these things, I would start looking into a major job of enghine work. Sound like plugs use AC if you can. In my wd's that oil them up, I use AC they will last about 4 times as long as champion Plugs. Normal for them to go out slowly, but if you were running her very slow, she may have done it fast.

If you don't have new plugs sray with carb cleaner. Wire brush and spay with carb cleaner again. Take a knife and clean off the electrode ( that is the steel pin in the plug, sets under the arm or plug ground ) DON"T scrach the porclein ( glass ) spay one last time . Get sand paper or abrasive cloth and clean between electrode and the arm. Gap and sray with starter fiuld and let dry. You have got a plug with good chance that it will work for a short time.

Sand blasting is the best, all most like a new plug.

Next if it does not run right. Take all plugs out. Turn enghing over with your figure in the plug hole, becareful not to push too tight(don't get hurt), your see if the compression is there.

If that is ok, then look at your wires. Not a fun job. You may get super charged LOL, Dam hot shock. One at a time take off of the plugs and see if they spark. By the way some times you can get a plug to fire this way, hold about 3/8" -1/2" away from plug and they often fire.

Good Luck !!

Be Safe !!

Punchie

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coldinc

09-04-2002 23:16:39




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 Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Phil, 09-04-2002 19:51:31  
I had a problem like this at one time and found that the camshaft had broken between the cylinders that was firing and the oenes that were not. Just a thought and I hope you find something cheaper wrong.



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David Maddux

09-05-2002 05:53:42




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 Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to coldinc, 09-04-2002 23:16:39  
I had the same thing happen to me a few weeks ago on a G allis. Front two plugs would not fire. I did all the new tune up things, still no fire finally I checked the obvious some one had crossed the two wires. That is when you have to ask yourself how smart you are. Check the obvious.



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Dave

09-05-2002 15:05:18




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 Re: Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to David Maddux, 09-05-2002 05:53:42  
I tend to agree with Dave Maddux. I think you have a couple of wires crossed. Look for the simple stuff first. I don't think your problem is serious. When two cylinders go down together it is usually an electrical problem. Check you firing order. I am betting that is where your problem is. Good luck. Dave(Ontario)



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G

09-05-2002 18:27:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Only Firing on Two-Cylinders in reply to Dave, 09-05-2002 15:05:18  
If all else fails, back to the old compression test. Seen many gassers and diesels alike that have blown the head gasket between two cylinders with no loss of coolant. Depending on firing order may exhibit some strange sounds from either intake or exhaust. Good luck.



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