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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

diesel timing light

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maddog

01-19-2005 17:19:27




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Anyone know of any web site online where I can buy a timing light for checking injection timing? or will a automotive timing light work.




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Jerry/MT

01-20-2005 11:59:12




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
I learn something new all the time from these forums. The newer automotive diesels and I believe the neweer tractors have electronic controls and there is probably some simple tool that you can find to check timing on them. I didn't know how one checked for running timing on a mechanically injected engine. thanks again for the info.



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Bryan in Iowa

01-20-2005 06:13:08




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
snap on and otc make a timing meter for automotive /pickup dielsels . Mostly 4.3/5.7/6.2/6.5 Gm's 6.9/7.3 ford .Has adapter that screws in glow plug hole , picks up on light created when cylinder fires . Very accurate unit, used it alot when was workign on those motors. Not sure if it is adaptable to other engines , but i know Snap on had other glow plug adapters avail for it.Pretty much sits in bottom of tool box anymore.If anyone interested would sell it .

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jdemaris

01-20-2005 06:04:16




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
As other's mentioned, there have been injection-pulse adapters available for years. I've got a pulse tach and timing light for diesels, but never had much use or need for it. As far as what other's mentioned about the timing marks - well that's only partially true. ALL the marks do is provide you with a way of checking the "initial" or "static" timing, not the advance timing that is very important on a running engine. Checking injection advance varies with the make of pump, and if it's a distributor pump (like CAV, Stanadyne-Roosamaster, Diesel Kiki, American Bosch, etc. ) or an in-line like some older CAVs, Simms, Bosch, Cat., etc. Some of the pumps come with gauges or viewing windows that allow checking and adjusting timing advance with the engine running. Stanadyne, for example, uses a plastic degreed window for the DB pumps.

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NC Wayne

01-19-2005 21:07:39




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
You don't say what kind of engine you have or why your needing to "time" it. Both things can make a difference as to what kind of tool you actually need, if you even need a tool. Personally I've never seen an actual timing light for a diesel. In fact I've never seen a diesel with external timing marks that you could use one on anyway. Maybe there there on some of the new stuff, but nothing I've ever seen. I know SPX Kentmoore makes what they call a Tach and Time that reads the vibration from the fuel pulse in the #1 injector line and allows you to use it for timing in place of the spark impulse in a gas engine. They list them on Ebay one in a while for pretty good prices. I know some pumps have elongated holes allowing a little adjustment in them but if you properly timed the engine before pulling the pump and marked it then you should have the right timing when you go back. If you had the pump rebuilt then the shop should have timed it properly before they let you have it back. In that case watch the valves and make sure you are bring #1 back to TDC on the compression stroke. All of the pumps I've ever seen can only be put back in either right or 180 degrees out. As long as the pump is timed right you should be able to time the engine this way and only need to move it a few degrees either way for it to line up with the pump shaft. From there, even if the pump wasn't actually marked you can usually just look at the paint marks and get it back in the right spot. Granted there are many different punmps and engine out there and the couple things I've said won't work on all of them but ensuring the pump is timed and timing it back in by watching the valves is pretty basic and should work on alot of them. Good luck with whatever your actually needing to do, I hope this helped a little.

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tony in Ne

01-19-2005 19:50:43




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
Mac tools makes a diesel pulse adaptor(part # ET18dpm) the pickup leads from your gas timing light hook up to it. The pulse adaptor hooks up to a fuel line with a little clamp and relays that signal to your timing light. I bought mine a few years ago for around $120.



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Jerry/MT

01-19-2005 18:40:55




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
Since the diesel engine is a compression ignition engine,(as opposed to the gas engine which is a spark ignition engine)there is no electrical signal to trigger a timing light.

Most diesels that I am familiar with are timed mechanically. You have a scribe line on the pump and marks on the engine block. When you install the pump you match the mark on the pump to the appropriate scribe line after indexing the pump drive properly. Look in your manual on how to do this.

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Mike (WA)

01-19-2005 17:43:07




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to maddog, 01-19-2005 17:19:27  
Automotive timing lite won't work, because there's no juice involved with ignition in a diesel engine. Don't really know how you could rig up a timing lite, but I suppose someone has come up with something. Let's see if any of the heavy hitters on the site weigh in on it.



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txblu

01-20-2005 05:30:24




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to Mike (WA), 01-19-2005 17:43:07  
You would have to sense pressure and know where the crankshaft position was. There is no spark so you have to have a "pressure transducer" or something like it that senses pressure and generates an electrical impulse to fire the light. Since the whack off a sparkplug wire is pretty high, it would take a special transducer to measure with an ordinary timing light.

Then you have to find the timing marks on the flywheel (if any) and find the timing data.

Lot easier to set it up per the book and if you aren't happy, advance or retard it a degree at a time and see what you get.

JUST DON'T UNLEASH THE PUMP WHEN THE ENGINE IS RUNNING. UNLIKE A DISTRIBUTOR, THERE IS SIGNIFICANT TORQUE ASSOCIATED WITH IT AND YOU OR SOMETHING CAN GET HURT.

HTH.

Mark

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mj

01-20-2005 09:39:35




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to txblu, 01-20-2005 05:30:24  
Ditto on the "SIGNIFICANT TORQUE " warning! As to setting the timing I remember a rancher in Gunnison, CO (7,700 ft. altitude) that was originally from Kansas. He used to buy tractors back there and bring them to CO but they always smoked and ran rough with no pulling power so he'd bring them into the IHC dealer where I was working. After we reset the pump timing 'by ear' he was good to go.



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txblu

01-22-2005 06:20:41




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to mj, 01-20-2005 09:39:35  
Hear you. Only way I can as I don't have any equip.

Mark



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Allan in NE

01-19-2005 18:53:16




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 Re: diesel timing light in reply to Mike (WA), 01-19-2005 17:43:07  
Hi Mike,

I sure as heck 'taint no heavy hitter, but have seen a few diesel timing lights.

They are triggered by the impluse or "vibration" if you will, of the fuel being pushed down that injector line. Used the same as a gasser timing light, they are just triggered differently, is all.

Then again, newer computer operated injection systems not only control the fuel, but read out it's timing points as well.

Allan

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