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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Tractor HP Confusion!!

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Linx

06-25-2004 04:10:04




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We have choice to buy tactors from two sources. The first is with 4.75 L diesel engine is said to be rated at 57 HP at 1700 RPM with 263 Nm torque at 1400 RPM. The second on with 4.1 L diesel engine is 85 HP at 2200 RPM with 291 Nm torque at 1600 RPM.
Both are 2WD. I am a bit confused about HP and decision to buy. Any suggestions!!




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Jery/MT

06-25-2004 13:13:21




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 Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Linx, 06-25-2004 04:10:04  
What is confusing you? How much horsepower do you reasonably need? Engine power and torque are usually specified at their peak values and peak torque always occurs at less rpm than peak horsepower. Are these values for power and torque at the engine shaft? Is the horsepower consistently specified (i.e. at the engine shaft for both or at the PTO for both, etc). I guess I'd like to know what's confusing you?

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Kendall

06-25-2004 09:05:40




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 Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Linx, 06-25-2004 04:10:04  
If you speed up Tractor#1 to 2200PRM would it now make closer to 85HP and if you slow down Tractor#2 to 1700RPM would it now be closer to 57HP? Easy to see how you can be confused. (assuming tractor#1 will go 2200 rpm). Seems like everyone has good things to say. Especially "what will the tractor be doing". Why not toss out the name/model and let everyone vote on their choice based on what you want the tractor to do.?

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Ed

06-25-2004 06:39:46




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 Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Linx, 06-25-2004 04:10:04  
Your not giving us the entire picture. Their is a lot more to a tractor than just the engine HP.

I would first look at what I want to do with the tractor. Do you need a small framed tractor or a large frame tractor? The bigger the frame the larger load you can safely manage with a loader. Are you pulling a disk? and 8'IH wheel disk would be a better match with the larger tractor. Are you just mowing the grass with a tow-behind real mower then a lighter tracctor will do less dammage to the grass.

Second, what is the PTO and drawbar HP. That's a better indication of what the tractor can really do. You'll need to match this to what you want to do with the tractor.

PTO HP is how much work the power take off on the back of the tractor can do. Mowers, balers, harvesters, etc

Drawbar HP is how much work the tractor can do pulling something. Plows, disks, etc.

Is the 4.1L turbocharged? If you have inexperienced drivers or ones that don't care a non-turbocharged model is better. Bigger displacement engins turning slower will last longer than a smaller one running faster and even more when equiped with a turbo.

Then their is the color war is JD better than NH (including CashIH / McCormick, Agco (and all it's brands), Kubota, those China tractors (under numerious brands, and others. I'd steer away from the cheep imports as I hear some of the real cheep China tractors have brittle castings that are porus and leak oil. Amound the brands known to be good ther's not too much difference and will come down to features and cost. Remember even John Deer can have a bad model or lemon but they will probably be around tomorrow to fix it.

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Ron

06-25-2004 06:24:00




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 Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Linx, 06-25-2004 04:10:04  
A tractor has to be matched to the work you intend it to do. There is an old saying "a big tractor can do small jobs but a small tractor can't do big jobs".

If you will be operating PTO driven implements, then the tractor must meet or exceed the required PTO hp rating.

If you will be using it for plow or loader work, the heavier tractor will always be a better buy than a lighter tractor.

Because tractors make extensive use of gearing, the actual hp and torque characteristics of the engine aren't very important except regarding fuel efficiency. The general rule is that with two tractors of the same PTO hp rating, the smaller displacement engine will be more fuel efficient. But that is a very general rule and there are a lot of variables.

One last point. Often these decisions come down to budget. While buying more tractor than you need might seem expensive, a bigger tractor that is operated at 50%-75% of capacity will require far fewer repairs and last much longer than a smaller tractor that is always operated close to 100% of capacity. Kinda like the FRAM commercial... "you can pay now or pay later". Probably the comment I hear most often from recent tractor buyers, even if thay are very happy with their purchase, is "if I had to do it over again, I would have bought a bigger tractor".

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txblu

06-25-2004 05:59:57




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 Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Linx, 06-25-2004 04:10:04  
Torque is the rotational moment (of inertia) that moves mass. Tractors move mass. HP is torque x rpm's.

Your 57 hp will probably be:

Cheaper to buy
Cheaper to run
Quieter
Last longer due to lower rpm's
Easier on-off as is probably smaller chassis
Easier to shed

You probably won't notice the 10% drop in torque which you are getting at a lower rpm (which is always better).

OT: I am amazed at GM truck commercials where they boast about their HP and Torque. Those values are in the 4000 to 5000 rpm area. When's the last time you ran your vehicle at those rpm's? Maybe a European sports car on the Autoban. I run my truck between 800 and 2000 wanting torque peak as low as I can get it to get the load started rolling.

Only one answer for me.

Mark

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Ron

06-25-2004 06:41:38




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 Re: Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to txblu, 06-25-2004 05:59:57  
Wow! There are two of us!

I have this conversation with people all the time. Horsepower is marketing garbage, that's all it is. But people who don't know any better just fall for it hook, line, and sinker. At least you and I both know that it's all about torque and the lower the rpm maximum torque is developed the better.

Before anyone else points it out...

HP = (torque x rpm) / 5252



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txblu

06-25-2004 07:27:39




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 Re: Re: Re: Tractor HP Confusion!! in reply to Ron, 06-25-2004 06:41:38  
10-4 good buddy (as they say in the trucking business).

Mark



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