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Dan I think you took offense when none was intended. I will stand by my earlier statement about the basic design of the D and 830 being the same though. When you break it down I beleive it makes sense. The early D's were 2 speed had a two cylinder cross mounted engine over center hand clutch in a pulley on the right. Later D's had a three speed trans all else was the same. The R had a trans which was a 6 speed I beleive with a HI/LO gearset to obtain the extra speeds live hyd and pto (all to meet market demand) motor clutch layout is still the same. The 80 was a R with power steering and a different starting engine. The 820 may have had a hydraulics change (I know the row crop 20 series did) otherwise the only thing that changed was HP and paint. Hp and sheet metal was the only improvement on the 30 series still had the crossmount 2cyl engine with overcenter hand clutch on the right just like the spoker D did. I would group a 29 Case L in the same group with a 600. As a IH 560 with a 39 M. As a JD 3010 with a 4860. Not that there is anything wrong with the design of any of these tractors actually it shows the forsight of the people that started with a blank sheet on all of these that the run of the design lasted so long. When a 830 and a early D are put next to each other there are a lot of differences yes but the basic layout is the same. I beleive this is apperant when you compare the 830 to the 820, the 820 to the 80 and so on back to the early D. Admitadly this is my opinion but it goes to show that when you have something that works you don't mess with the basics just add what is needed. JM2CW JT
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