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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

I’d like to choke my 860!

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Dale-SWMI

01-28-2004 01:07:22




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Even though I will never see 55 again I’ve never owned (or tried to start) a vehicle that had a manual choke. Well, with my new 860, my lack of experience may have hurt me some last Sunday when I tried to start my tractor (and only succeed in running down my 6 volt battery) in the middle of the current deep freeze.

My question is; what process do you use to choke when starting in cold weather? I was told I should have used full choke and cranked until it starts/tires to fire then go to about half choke, crank until it starts then keep it there until it warms up a bit. How do youall do this?

I’m in Southwest Michigan and we generally get into the single digits with an occasional foray into the subzero temperatures during the winter. Currently the tractor is sitting in a neighbor’s barn waiting for spring.

Thanks in advance for any advise you could give.

Dale

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Tom in Texas

01-29-2004 06:03:45




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
I grew up in central Illinois and eventually married a Nebraska farm girl. The cold starting method I have seen used in Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska is to place a few corn cobs on the intake mainifold and light them on fire. It warms the intake air. Crude but effective. Oh yes, The Nebraska farm girl left me and I now live in Texas where starting a cold engine is not a problem.



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Jim.UT

01-28-2004 12:36:42




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Sounds like each one of these old tractors has its own personality and therefore its own magic sequence of events to achieve startup in the cold.

Here's what works on my 850:
Clutch down, key on, throttle about 1/2, one thumb on the starter and the other hand ready to pull the choke. Then I push the starter and pull the choke out full for just a moment then I let it go. My choke seems to be spring loaded and returns to open position when I let go. If it doesn't start immediately I pull the choke out again for just a moment and that usually does it. If not I shut the key off and wait a minute then try again.

After it starts I leave my foot on the clutch for a minute or two and then let it out very slowly or the engine will die. Also, my tractor wants to die until it warms up so I keep my hand on the choke. When it starts to stumble, I give it 1/2 choke for just a second and it usually recovers. I probably have some easily fixable problem that would cure the "dies when cold" symptom, but I don't know what it is yet.

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paul

01-28-2004 13:13:40




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 Re: Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Jim.UT, 01-28-2004 12:36:42  
Sounds normal to me. Ford is the only make I have with the spring loaded choke, rest are friction, you set where you want it.

My 960 broke the spring, then I had to use a clothes pin to keep it off! Did find a new spring eventually.

--->Paul



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JMS/MN

01-28-2004 11:52:14




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Granted, every engine is different, but any well-tuned gas engine should start at one-fourth throttle. Higher settings cause more engine wear, because the engine is cold and the oil is not circulating to the crank bearings. Doesn't matter if you pull the choke before cranking- the choke does not add gas- it reduces air flow, and that does not happen until cranking starts. Some engines, when started in cold weather might still need a bit of choke for a minute or so. If you've cranked with choke to the point where you smell gas- you've flooded it, and it is not likely to start until you let it set for a time. Generally a few seconds of choke is enough. If you need to wait, hook up a battery charger- batteries have very little power at cold temps and run down soon.

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Kelly C

01-28-2004 09:46:17




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
One thing I have done when its real cold. I have taken a hair dryer out and placed it in the intake. Be careful around the gas in the carb as there are red hot wires in the hair dryer.
Works great though. Warms up the air and helps to adomize the air/fuel mixture. Usually starts most of the beast on my place. A few winters ago it got down to -40 and my vehicles were the only ones in town running before 1 pm.

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jim

01-28-2004 15:19:48




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 Re: Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Kelly C, 01-28-2004 09:46:17  
hey



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Kelly C

01-28-2004 18:31:03




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 Re: Re: Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to jim, 01-28-2004 15:19:48  
Well.... HEY!!! back.



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Scott

01-28-2004 08:59:40




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
My 641 workmaster, and my Allis WD45 are both the same way, but the ford usually doesn't take more than one try...two sometimes if it's below 0.

Foot on clutch, key on, neutral, choke full out, throttle 1/3rd, hit starter. On first rev, choke off, and she's running. NEVER try to give the ford choke till she's running.....she'll flood, and if it doesn't, it'll foul a plug at best.

If it doesn't stay running, repeat.

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Scott

01-28-2004 09:07:13




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 Re: Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Scott, 01-28-2004 08:59:40  
Just noticed, I said one rev...actually, it's one cyl. over center, not all 4. I guess I should have said 1/4 rev.



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Larry NE IL

01-28-2004 08:56:33




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
All the comments above are good, but there is one thing more that I do that seems to help, at least it helps me; stand back and swear at it!!!



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Miss Grundy

01-28-2004 10:54:43




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 Re: Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Larry NE IL, 01-28-2004 08:56:33  
You ain't no Sunday School Teacher?



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paul

01-28-2004 08:42:27




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Wow. You gave up on one try???? If you have 2 hands, it's not hard to run a choke & a starter button at the same time.

Anyhow, every tractor is a little different. I have run about 2 dozen gas machines here on the farm regularly, & each one has it's own personality. Even our 960 wide front & 960 narrow front were slightly different.

In general, open the throttle about 1/3-1/2, full choke, crank it over 1-2 revolutions, let go of choke while continuing to crank engine. after 2-3 revolutions, pull full choke again for 1, maybe 2 revolutions, let go of choke, continue starting 2-3 revolutions.

At some point in all of that it either started or puffed a bit. (If it did not, walk away from it for a couple of minutes. Starter & batt need a rest. Then try it with full choke for several revolutions - this will probably flood it, but some are very cold starters and need that.)

Where-ever it tried to puff a bit, that is the 'sweet spot' of your particular tractor and that is about what it will like most of the time in cold weather.

If you hold the choke too long, it will flood the engine. Three engine revolutions is often too long... Then you need to loosen & pull off the lower end of the air hose, let the gas drain out, waith 10 minutes, open the throttle to wide open and start it up.(With the air hose off, you can be more agressive chocking it than normal.) Remember to reattach the air hose, as you are drawing dirty air into your engine & this will harm it. Also, with a wide open throttle, your engine will race very fast with very cold oil - not a good thing. As soon as it fires up, back that throttle off REAL fast. If it does not want to fire, and you feel you have not overly flooded the machine, leave throttle open, leave choke closed, and shoot ether into the open carberator while cranking the engine over.

Now, my Ollie s77 needs FULL choke, but at the very FIRST hint of firing it needs the choke all the way in. after running 10 seconds it starts to die, so it needs 1/2 choke right away again. This will start that tractor at minus 5 degrees, no problem, time after time. for years in Minnesota winter. Any other proccedure, any fooling around with 1/2 choke or choking 2 seconds too long, and it will be a dead machine for hours. Not even puff.

My IHC 300 likes to puff & fire up with no choke at all, but imeadiately needs 90% choke to run for about a minute, then back off on the choke as it warms up.

You just will have to find that sweet spot of your particular tractor, and not give up so easy.

I go to lots of farm auctions, and it is real noticable - the auctioneers always want the owner to start up all the machines, as they know each particular starting personalities. Things never go very smoothly when a 'stranger' tries to start a tractor in the cold.

One last note - you will bust your battery leaving it sit like this in a barn over winter. You need a charger on it, top up that battery. It will freeze up & die discharged the way you left it.

--->Paul

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C.Bryant

01-28-2004 08:00:46




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 Re: I?d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
On my 860 I have to depress the clutch pedal as well
as choke it. In cold weather the tranny fluid gets thicker and puts a drag on the engine when cold. I use 1/3 throttle, 3/4 choke. Once running I back off the choke, after about 60 seconds I let go of the clutch. If I let go of the clutch right after it starts in the winter time it will kill the engine.
This is not a problem in the summer. Also is your PTO engaged while starting?

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JD dozer mike

01-28-2004 07:58:54




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Ok we all wonderin the same thing. How Did You Get Past 55 without ever starting a manual choke device.????? INCONCEIVABLE ! :)



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Bob

01-28-2004 06:33:37




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Dale, you've lead a sheltered life..... ..... .



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RWK in WI

01-28-2004 05:57:07




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
My 860 starts best just above idle. Ignition on, pust starter button with right hand, then as it's turning over pull choke with left hand. If it doesn't catch at once push choke back in and then stop cranking. Try again. On mine never pull choke out then crank. On my 640 and Ferguson TE 20 they like a little more throtle ( but less than 1/4 ) but same procedure. If mine don't start an about the third or fouth try I pull the air tube to the carb. and give it a shot of either before I run the battery down.
Hard starting on hundred series Fords can be a sign of water / ice in the air cleaner cup oil. Something to check .

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Steve W (NY)

01-28-2004 05:51:57




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Seems every engine has it's own proceedure. When I'm unfamiliear with an engine, I'll usually geive her a small bit of throttle, and no choke. My logic is that that way, you won't flood her immediately. If she fires, ease into the choke a little. If nothing happens at all (no firing), lean on the choke good. I think your 860 has an updraft carb. One thing I've found helpful is to take the air cleaner hose off temporarily, so you can monitor how much gas she gets. I also think that if she doesn't fire after ten revolutions or so, hit her with a small shot of ether (starting fluid). This usually will do the trick. Of course, you don't want that to become a routine. Poor starting can be tied to so many things. Poor compression (expensive), bad spark (fairly easy to fix), bad carburation (often blamed, seldom the real cause).

Good luck and keep us posted.

Take Care
Steve

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Dirthog

01-28-2004 03:55:48




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
With my MF65 I need to have a fast choke hand, when it's real cold I go full choke with no throttle, The instant it fires I push the choke in about half way and take it from there. About a miniute is all the choke is on. You'll get the hang of it.



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MarkB

01-28-2004 03:15:55




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 Re: I’d like to choke my 860! in reply to Dale-SWMI, 01-28-2004 01:07:22  
Here's what I do with my Ford 4000, which is very similar.

1. Warm weather: no choke, open throttle halfway. It usually starts right up.

2. Cold weather (below 40F): full choke, open throttle halfway. Open choke as soon as it fires; if it sputters, pull the choke out as needed to keep it running. If it quits, repeat (still using full choke).

As soon as the tractor is running smoothly, you shouldn't need to use any choke unless something is wrong.

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