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Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy

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Phil in MS

06-30-2003 06:30:42




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I have purchased a roll bar/canopy for my 1975 MF 255. The unit had been in a fire and I have sandblasted, primed and painted and am now about ready to install. My question is could the bolts used that were burned be used to install? Would the fire weaken them enough that I would want to purchase new bolts? Your opinions are appreciated.

Thanks




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ted

06-30-2003 19:04:13




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 Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 06:30:42  
If you change the bolts be sure you put in the same grade you took out. I, myself wouldn't put grade 8 bolts where grade 5 were. Grade 8 bolts tend to shear first instead of bending before shearing. You may be weakening the structure. (depending on how the bolts are used)



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Mike

06-30-2003 12:58:46




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 Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 06:30:42  
One thing I havenīt seen mentioned is the structural integrity of the roll bar itself. If it has been in a fire it will NOT pass certification as a ROPS under any circumstances! I wouldnīt want to bet my life or an employees life just to save a few bucks. You DO NOT have a ROPS, you have a repainted canopy support.



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RAB

06-30-2003 13:49:29




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 Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Mike, 06-30-2003 12:58:46  
Agree Entirely. It needs checking out by an expert, not by a victim.
Regards, RAB



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markct

06-30-2003 18:34:19




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 Re: Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to RAB, 06-30-2003 13:49:29  
yea but its still better than no rops at all in my opinion, and its better than many of the homemade welding jobs that i have seen called a rops, rops are not heat treated, they are just mild sguare or rectangular tubing usualy, so most likely it wasnt affected by the heat to a degree that would render it useless, the bolts however are an alloy steel so i wouldnt trust them



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RAB

06-30-2003 23:21:43




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to markct, 06-30-2003 18:34:19  
Quite likely you are right, but as 'most likely' can be 51:49 to 99:1, I would still get the advice of an expert rather than a very unreliable estimate of the chances of killing someone. Also remember, any advice you give can render you subject to legal claim in the unlikely event the roll cage integrity is tested and fails. I didn't see one 'disclaimer' amongst all the replies, so at least you would probably not be alone on the list of defendants.
Regards, RAB

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Phil in MS

07-01-2003 06:57:32




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to RAB, 06-30-2003 23:21:43  
I have operated this tractor for 27 years and with the Good Lord's help I hope to operate it for another 27. I began on a C Farmall with the tricycle front and will admit that I sometimes put the C in places I had no business being. Maybe I should be worried about the ROPS itself but am not however I do appreciate your comments. I believe that a great deal of knowledge floats around this site and I was and am looking for opinions tied to working experience. As another poster said this unit is better than nothing which is what I've had for 27 years. I had considered the fired bolts as possibly being weakened and had considered new bolts and would likely have gone with grade 8. A comment above does make me pause and consider if grade 5 would be better. I will certainly try to replace with the grade that was on the original unit.
Thanks for all the comments, sometimes it just helps to have another's thoughts on the problem.
Phil

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markct

06-30-2003 09:07:25




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 Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 06:30:42  
well it all depends how hot it got, was the paint burned off the rollbar near the bolts? if so then i would definatly not take a chance on them, bolts are cheap compared to the things at stake in a critical application like a ROPS. if the tractor just had a fire in the front say, and the rops didnt get the paint burned off harldy then i wouldnt worry about reusing them, but if theres any question then replace them for sure

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paul

06-30-2003 08:03:33




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 Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 06:30:42  
No one can say for sure, unless you know how hot & for how long the fire was at the bolts.

Some good grade 8 bolts shouldn't be very spendy.....

--->Paul



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F14

06-30-2003 06:46:47




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 Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 06:30:42  
Why take chances on anything as important as a ROPS? New bolts are not that expensive.



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Phil in MS

06-30-2003 10:01:18




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 Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to F14, 06-30-2003 06:46:47  
Thanks guys. I try to be safe to a fault and even though these are fairly large and long bolts, new hard grade bolts likely wouldn't cost over $25 or $30. Why go to the trouble to do something if you cut corners to the point that it then would not work as designed. I'll just get the old bolts and then replace with new.

Thanks again.



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markct

06-30-2003 10:13:59




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 Re: Re: Re: Burned bolt on roll bar/canopy in reply to Phil in MS, 06-30-2003 10:01:18  
good call phil, and that doesnt mean ya cant save the old bolts for some other less critical application, just a rops isnt a place to take chances. of course i say this as we have 4 tractors, a bulldozer and a road grader, none with any rops, but if ya are gona go thru the trouble of adding a rops ya might as well do it right



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