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Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos)

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Berryville

11-18-2007 14:07:24




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It looks like runny peanut butter but it neither smells or tastes like it.

third party image

I'm sure its water contamination. Well now the old girl is always parked inside where its nice and dry, where she deserves to be.

While I was under there looking around I noticed this too..... Looks like this could be a problem....

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Pete

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Berryville

11-20-2007 09:54:22




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Jeff-oh, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
Well the oil in my trans is peanut butter again..... ARGH!

Pete



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Berryville

11-19-2007 09:58:42




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Gerald J., 11-18-2007 14:07:24  

Jeff-oh said: (quoted from post at 18:46:02 11/19/07) Do not put in new oil until it is completely clean, else you will contaminate the new oil and be tossing it out too.


LOL TOO LATE!

Im gona run the oil I put in for a while than replace it again, I was hoping this would clean 99% of it out....

Hope I didnt just waste a fist full of money, this stuff aint cheap....

Pete

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Jeff-oh

11-19-2007 13:22:11




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-19-2007 09:58:42  
Don't worry, I did the same thing when I first changed my oil...

Actually, I drained one sump, then the next and then the third. The porblem came when I failed to go back and open them all up. The oil redistributed it self and I ended up leaving about a gal. of old oil in the system.

Jeff



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Jeff-oh

11-19-2007 09:46:02




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
Berryville,

As others have said, that is typical water in the oil. Here is the cleaning procedure I wrote several years, ago.

Note, last week a fellow said he propped up the back end on jack stands and Ran the Transmission and lift up and down with diesel to clean it out. Seems like it did a good job.

Do not put in new oil until it is completely clean, else you will contaminate the new oil and be tossing it out too.


Prior post....

To refill you will need 6 gallons of oil. Check NAPA"s price, ask for PN 65-205. That is a 5-gallon bucket of the GL-1 oil.
Cleaning procedure
There are three drain holes and one filler hole. Note the fill slow at the end comment. As the filler hole is in the front of the case and the dipstick is at the rear. Only fill with four to five gallons, then fill 1 quart at a time with a couple to 5 min. wait between quarts. This gives the fluid some time to level out so that it can be read on the dipstick. The first time I changed my oil I overfilled by more than a gallon, I had oil coming out the axils on the breaks... what a mess.

This is a job you do not want to do too often, so plan it right. Determine all the maintenance that needs to be accomplished while the transmission is drained. (PTO seal, Pump repairs, Hydro leak fixes, axial seals etc) Get the parts and get them done while you can.

This is the procedure I used to clean my transmission oil housing. You will need to wash out the old fluid. Any remaining fluid will contaminate the new fluid. If you have time in the evenings start to drain the tractor now. She will drip for hours/days.
You should also be prepared to deal with the gallons of fluids you the will gush out of the tractor. Have containers ready to pour the old oil in to take to your auto parts store for recycling.

Do your lift arms drop/leak down quickly? If so prior to draining the fluid pull the right and left side inspection plates. Lift an implement and look to see where the fluid is leaking out of the system as the lift lowers. Then you can repair/replace the required parts without the fluid in the way.

I would also recommend the you replace the PTO seal and O-ring seal if needed at this time and replace the inspection plate gaskets. The inspection plate gaskets are fairly easy to cut yourself if you need to.

Open the drains one at a time to handle the gush of fluid. Once you have gone through all of them open them all up again with a pan under each and let it drip at least over night. Make sure your lift control is in the down position to drain the piston.

You should plan on "Washing/Flushing" out the inside, particularly if you have water in the oil... i.e. if brown/milky. To wash the inside use either kerosene or diesel. (Note: It is generally recommended and I agree: DO NOT operate the tractor with your cleaning fluid in the transmission) I put mine in a garden sprayer and sprayed the insides down. I put the garden sprayer nozzle everywhere I can, up the PTO shaft opening, if you pulled it. Through the Filler hole, through the inspection ports, through each drain plug. I catch the diesel in clean oil pans let it settle then decant the "clean" fluid off the sludge and spray again, and again. Go have a beer and let it drain. I then wipe out the bottom with clean paper towels to get the crud out. (do not use cheap towels here you do not want them falling apart). If your fluid had water in it, the "Milky" oil will continue to appear for a while, I just came back and wiped it out again, and again until gone.

This is a good time to do other maintenance. Grease the fittings, Pull the air filter and clean it.

Be sure to do the diesel flush with good ventilation. The fumes are powerful.

Button her back up with your new seals and fill. Toward the end fill slowly... i.e. quart or 1/2 liter per 5 to 10 minutes, to let it all even out in the sumps. The first time I changed the oil I did not do this and I over filled by a gallon and a half. And because I did not wash out the back that gallon and a half was now water contaminated and useless.

You will be glad you did this when it is done.

Jeff

p.s. all that said. Letting a gallon or two of diesel or kerosene sit in the transmission case overnight will eliminate a lot of paper towels. Driving it around with out any load will not hurt the transmission gears. The only reason to drive around is to slosh the cleaning solution around... thus you have to decide how effective that would be.

I do not believe you need 6 gallons. a gallon or two is quite enough.

Jeff

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john a moore,jr

01-20-2008 08:26:34




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Jeff-oh, 11-19-2007 09:46:02  
I have a newly purchased TO-20 with low transmission oil! No history; Do not know if oil is contaminated; stored in shed; maby not!

I understand 3 drain plugs and the PTO: Mine leaks so will have to be replaced! Have manual so know how!

However: Do not understand where you are wiping out transmission! Only place I can see access would be thru PTO opening after removed! That would not get to front of transmission!

Please expand! How important would it be to drop hydraulic pump and clean? Not looking for work!

Talked to Unilube Lab people, Massey ferguson field rep-Raleigh, N.C/xx Illinois as well as several Ford and massey service departments regarding replacement fluid! Napa does have the GL1. About $42/5 gallons Greenboro area of N.C..
Advance Auto has $32/5 gallons but is 80/90w Gl,3,4,5! Am sure you know the 80/90w is viscosity and the G's are various improvements and changes in additives for performance. GL2 is no longer manufactured!

According to Massey and Unilube who apparently provides the Coastal Lube sold by Advance, GL 3,4,5 would be fine! The viscosity is correct-80w-90w; which is the same as original except that the original was not available in multiweight- had to use 80w or 90w. The GL numbers represent additives which do not really react until temps above 300 degrees and are sacrificial in minimizing bearing wear! Particularly the Sulfur-Phorphorus compounds. There thinking was would not be a problem to use the 80/90w with the higher GL's! Did not think there would be a problem in the hydraulic pump either!

Thoughts/comments?

Can someone tell me if the TO-20 and TO-30 share the exact transmission with the Ford 2N,9N, 8n, etc.? Where does TEA-20 fit in? Was it manufactured in the UK only? Does it have the exact transmsission of the To-20? I have a TEA-20 service manual! Do not have a TO-20 manual, need to understand differences

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gshadel

11-19-2007 07:29:01




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
Pete, that looks like my tranny oil the first time I changed it too.
Look thru the archives on how to clean out that tranny real good. I just did the same last weekend on my TO-20. I used a garden sprayer to spray mineral spirits inside all the tranny openings to get all the water, gunk, and sludge out of there. Let it drip dry while I watched my favorite football team get a big win, then took a rag to mop-up any residual. Blew compressed air thru the tranny, then bolted-up the access ports & plugs. I'm still working on my shifter lever, so I'm not quite done yet.

I've seen oil filter cover plates that look like yours. They can be difficult to seal up if the approp. care is not given to doing the job. When you pull yours off, clean-up all that old RTV of everything, make sure you use a new rubber gasket on that plate. You can get them from any Tisco parts place or Agco dealer. I usually buy several at a time so I have them when I need them. You can make your own too, but I like the thick rubber ones the dealer sells, they help compensate for uneven mating of the cover plate to the pan. Make sure the flat mating surface on the bottom of your oil pan, and on the cover plate is clean & smooth. If you have nicks, gouges, etc. you can patch them with JBWeld and sand smooth. Check that your cover plate isn't warped, and that the threaded end of the drop tube, and the bolt is not buggered-up and tighten properly. Try to avoid using all that RTV goop like your prev. owner used...shouldn't be necessary. It's hard to tell with all that RTV, but it doesn't look like you have any cracks, dents, warps, etc. Probably just need a new gasket and a little TLC.
I think the service manual has a pic. of the filter order. You may find that your filter stuff is all in backwards... mine was the first time I changed the filter. The order going back in is screen (open side down), filter(don't matter which way), gasket, cover plate, bolt to secure. I find it a bit tricky trying to get all that stuff in there & lined-up. I use a dab of RTV, just a dab, to glue the gasket to the cover plate so that I don't have to worry about that moving around while I hold all that stuff in place to get the bolt started. Use a new copper, or platic washer on the bolt also.


George

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Berryville

11-19-2007 05:27:26




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Gert Lerm, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  

Fred T. Hart Jr. said: (quoted from post at 02:23:49 11/19/07) What year and model tractor do you have?

When did you last change the transmission oil.

Are rubber boots on gear shift levers in good repair.

I know its expensive to change trans oil but I would think it should be changed every 5 years on low use tractors. Moisture will accumulate in tranmission.

Oil change is less expensive than tranmission repair.

Just my 2 cents.


It’s a 49 TE20, I’ve only had it a few weeks now.

5 years?!?!?! I plan on doing it every year, I will be using this machine to mow 5 acres, haul stuff around and for my PHD.
I may change the trans oil in another few weeks in hopes to get the rest on the contaminated oil out. I did see some condensation on the inside of the filler cap when I removed it to refill the case.

I’m hoping that parking it indoors (it WILL NOT be sitting out in the rain and snow and more) will help with any further issues of water contamination in the trans oil. I’m sure I’ll get some from condensation but compared to being out in the elements it shouldn’t be as much.

I’m sure I’ll get better performance out of the 3pt (lift) hitch now that it has more oil than water in it….. I was having problems with pulling the PHD out of the hole (getting stuck really easy) so hopefully this will help.

I’ll have to look at it again but the oil pan didn’t look cracked. For sure there looks like there’s a problem with the plate that covers the oil filter… Anyone know where I can view an exploded view of the oil pan so I can see how this all fits together before I cut the sealant off and disassemble this area?

Thanks,

Pete

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phil(va)

11-19-2007 07:07:23




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-19-2007 05:27:26  
I know some people say to change it every year, but oil is very expensive now, not to mention the disposal issues, and if you are not really farming with it, and if it doesn't have water in it, I would not bother to change it that often. Once you get it filled with the proper stuff, it should work well for several years, in my estimation and experience, especially since you will keep it indoors. Water isn't good in there, especially in a cold climate, but sludge rarely is the cause of problems with the lift.

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Branlin

11-18-2007 18:00:10




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to John (UK), 11-18-2007 14:07:24  

Ken Crisman said: (quoted from post at 21:19:07 11/18/07) Is that a cracked oil pan I seee ? If so apparantly the previous owner let water in it & it froze cracking the oil pan . I"ve read where condensation forms from the tractor getting hot & cooling down numerus times .
From what I know, sludge under the valve cover, in the oil pan, and elsewhere in an engine is caused by condensation that was not burnt (steamed) out because of the oil not reaching full operating temperature, repeatedly, before it is shut down.

The colder the weather, the worse it is.

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Fred T. Hart Jr.

11-18-2007 17:23:49




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
What year and model tractor do you have?

When did you last change the transmission oil.
Are rubber boots on gear shift levers in good repair.

I know its expensive to change trans oil but I would think it should be changed every 5 years on low use tractors. Moisture will accumulate in tranmission.

Oil change is less expensive than tranmission repair.
Just my 2 cents.



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DennisPinOhio

11-19-2007 04:15:39




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Fred T. Hart Jr., 11-18-2007 17:23:49  
According to John(UK), trans./hydraulic oil should be changed yearly.



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Ken Crisman

11-18-2007 17:19:07




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
Is that a cracked oil pan I seee ? If so apparantly the previous owner let water in it & it froze cracking the oil pan . I"ve read where condensation forms from the tractor getting hot & cooling down numerus times . I always assumed water was getting in from seams or bad seals somewhere . I found my 4 spd trans case cracked near the drain plug on my 8n Funk conversion . Had to change it out to a replacement case donor . My outlook is to save as many of these old Fords as possible . Over on the ntractor site there"s guys that have replacement parts to sell . You might check iwth them . Good luck & God bless, Ken

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Bruce(OR)

11-18-2007 14:47:42




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 Re: Peanut butter in my Trans (Photos) in reply to Berryville, 11-18-2007 14:07:24  
That"s Purty!
You might want to tap the drain plug and install a smaller flush mount plug, something such as a set screw. This way you can remove the smaller set screw and drain the water without starting it and mixing it all up.



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