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Re: Manure for garden fertilizer


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Posted by Paul on May 06, 2017 at 09:21:37 from (66.60.207.13):

In Reply to: Manure for garden fertilizer posted by John in La on May 06, 2017 at 07:49:12:

In farming, I have my soil tests pulled on 5 or 2.5 acre grids, they take about 8 tests from each grid.

Get maps and data back in a week or two, and the coop can then apply fertilizer to each grid area exactly what is needed for that spot, different rates of P, K, and somewhat N, so I don't under apply or over apply for what the crop will need.

We soil sample every 4 years. After some years now, they are just applying a flat rate of fertilizer, as my high and low fertility spots are nearly balanced out to even. It is not 'cheaper' to do this, but the fertilizer I buy goes where it is needed, and the plants will use it. In the end I get more dollars in my pocket from better yields and healthier plants, and my soil will not wash out excess fertilizers from the over applied spots I used to have.

And this is where I have to laugh at, and wonder at, the claims of organic being more sustainable and 'better' for the planet. I'm not opposed to organic, but a few of the extreme organic proponents have really gone overboard on all that..... I don't mean to put down organic, just some of the wild claims by some sellers......


My neighbor from town moved out to a farm site, put in his garden. Bought a new shiny compact tractor, tiller, fancy pretty fence around the garden spot. You know the type. He hauled in a lot of manure, and tilled it in, worked it, oh he made it so rich..... And by fall he had almost no produce, he had a very tall, rank, green, garden with all vegetation, no actual produce.

When he asked around and looked into it, he found the spot he put the garden on used to be the old mud wallow of the old hog barn, and the P and K soil test readings were off the scale too high. And he added a lot of extra manure to start.... He had to learn what farming/gardening is all about.

Composted manure is better, it has some of the weed seeds cooked out of it. Fresh manure can bring in a whole lot of seeds.... As well, I get a bit squeamish with fresh manure and garden produce that is in or touching the ground? My corn and beans the grain is many months removed from a manure application, but a garden patch can be producing something in less than 30 days.....

In any case, when using manure you probably have to watch your P levels. Different manures offer very different fertility levels tho.

Chicken and poultry manure is very hot and a little bit goes a long ways. Be careful, even to a farmer used to dealing with many tons over many acres, the value of poultry manure is easy to overdo without realizing it.

Hog manure is typically very hig in P, and will not be enough K and not enough N for grass crops so you need to add something else to make those up. BUT some new ways of feeding hogs creates a manure that is actually very low in P, then N becomes the limiting factor and you don't get enough P from this, as well as the manure being worth less. Also if the manure comes from momma pigs, baby pigs, or finished pigs makes a big difference in its nutrient type.

Dairy and cattlemanure is valuable but has low values of N, P, and K per ton, so it's hard to get way too much on?

Horse manure tends to be pretty low value, sometimes hardly worth hauling. Especially if wood bedding, or massive amounts of straw bedding are used, this manure can tie up more N than you get P and K from it, messing up your garden balance. It can be composted for several years to make a good low value fertilizer, but consider the time and value before hauling very far.

So, there, a lot of 'it depends' instead of good hard answers.... ;)

For a garden I would sure composite manure before putting it on. Kills some weed seeds and most all pathogens. It is a mellowed, easier to spread product after composting.

I would soil test the garden, some extension type places might get you a free sample, or $25 isn't much to know where you are at. Get an even mix of 8-10 spots around a small garden, exactly 6 inches deep, mix it all, and send a small sample bag in. You don't need every year, just even once to see what you got going on in your dirt?

If your garden is low in ph, fix that with lime. Nothing else matters much with low ph, an acid soil holds on to nutrients more than the roots can pry it away, so manure and fertilizer don't help much. Fix ph first. (Roots put out an acid to loosen and grab nutrients from the soil - if the soil is already very acidic, the roots can't overpower that and come up empty, even in a rich soil.....)

Then see what your soil is real high and real low on, and add stuff to balnce it out. You don't benifit from real high of something; a person wants the soil a little above medium, to not quite high in everything. That is a real nice balnce for your crops to grow in. There are many organic products that can balance whatever is low, build only that low part up.

Once you get your soil balanced, things will grow better. It will be night and day different!

And then you can add some composted manure and so forth to keep things humming along year to year. Composted manure is especially good at adding the micro nutrients back into your soil. The fertilizer truck can add thrm too, I get sulfur and boron and something es others of these added, a few lbs per acre; but manure is a great source of these things for a garden plot, easier to use the manure for the micros, really.

No, you don't have to do any of this. In general throw seeds in the ground, hoe a few weeds, and you get a crop in the end. But if you go through the work of all that, might as well get one soil test, know where you are at, and work to balance your soil? Doing it right isn't any more work and only $25 extra, and the results by fall are amazingly different?

On my farm, I am hauling away 2.5 times more bushels per acre than dad did 40 years ago. Think how much nicer your garden will be if you look at the details a little bit.

Soil health isnt about 'more organic manure' it is about finding the right balance of all the parts to make the crops love to grow without any excess stuff wanting to wash out. I think that is exactly what your question is and good for you to ask, I think I sound preachy here I don't mean that, just sitting here waiting for $20,000 worth of fertilizer to be delivered and you really got me thinking on the topic. ;)

Paul


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