Reverse mowing

Axell · Dec 28, 2021

Hi there!

I have some corners in my pasture with brushes and stinging nettle. So I have to mow in reserve slowly. in the manual of my "new" mf35 it says that the pto goes backward when tractor is in reverse and that will hurt the impliment. I will be using a flail mower.
Can a flail mower turn backward without being damaged and will it cut at all?

J Hamilton · Dec 28, 2021

I replaced a clutch in a MF35 for a friend
last year, it had a 2 stage clutch and the
pto did not reverse when backing up when
using a mower. It may reverse if in ground
drive pto, I'm not sure, never tried it.

paul · Dec 28, 2021

If a flail mower uses a chain or belt with a tensioner it would not work well spinning in reverse. All gear drive it would
probably spin ok, Id think oiling would work....

The blades on a flail mower wont cut well or at all, depending on style of blade, cup or J or etc, so no it wont work
spinning reverse.

Im not familiar with your tractor, but does it have a normal mode and a ground speed mode, and it will work ok in
normal, but works as you say only in ground speed mode? Just use it in normal mode?

Paul

Matt in Oz · Dec 29, 2021

Lot of years since I operated a MF 35. Would try running the tractor backwards in engine PTO setting. Don't think it will run in reverse. The reverse spin PTO would be more likely in ground drive PTO setting. Trial it without anything on the tractor and then you will know what you have. If it were me
I would not run a flail mower backwards.

rrlund · Dec 29, 2021

I never thought about it, but now you have me wondering. I made a bet with Dad one time that an 8N Ford would move with it in gear
and the clutch pedal pushed down with the PTO engaged. I had him sit on it with the pedal down while I turned the PTO with a pipe
wrench. Never considered it might turn backwards in reverse. It wouldn't if you had an over running clutch on it, which you should
have anyway, would it?

paul · Dec 29, 2021

Most pto that are not live/ independent take their power from the shaft right behind the clutch, which is always spinning the same direction as the engine.

MF and others had some ground drive option that also took the power for the pto off of the output shaft to the rear axle, which would spin whatever speed and direction the transmission was in. I believe this option was in addition to the above normal operation as above, not as the only way the pto operated?

If I am wrong I certainly want to be corrected here.

Paul

lugnuts2030 · Dec 29, 2021

The Massey tractors with ground drive pto had Eng drive and ground drive positions on the lever. Ground drive Mostly used with a 3pt hitch rake so rake maintained a good speed. I have heard of using the grd drive and backing up tractor to unplug a machine. I would not recommend using the ground drive for much other than a hay rake. Why would one want pto to stop when tractor stops moving, and changing speed with wheel speed?

Axell · Dec 30, 2021

(quoted from post at 17:04:19 12/29/21) The Massey tractors with ground drive pto had Eng drive and ground drive positions on the lever. Ground drive Mostly used with a 3pt hitch rake so rake maintained a good speed. I have heard of using the grd drive and backing up tractor to unplug a machine. I would not recommend using the ground drive for much other than a hay rake. Why would one want pto to stop when tractor stops moving, and changing speed with wheel speed?

My manual says that ground is only for light work. So I gues I could use that for the spreader for fertilizer.
But the engine pto looks like it goes en reverse when gear is in reverse. But hart to see properly when sitting on the tractor.
Mine is a but hard to disengage so would like not to when doing places like corners where I have to go backwards.

Jim.ME · Dec 30, 2021

(quoted from post at 09:33:57 12/30/21)

(quoted from post at 17:04:19 12/29/21) The Massey tractors with ground drive pto had Eng drive and ground drive positions on the lever. Ground drive Mostly used with a 3pt hitch rake so rake maintained a good speed. I have heard of using the grd drive and backing up tractor to unplug a machine. I would not recommend using the ground drive for much other than a hay rake. Why would one want pto to stop when tractor stops moving, and changing speed with wheel speed?

Click to expand...

My manual says that ground is only for light work. So I gues I could use that for the spreader for fertilizer.
But the engine pto looks like it goes en reverse when gear is in reverse. But hart to see properly when sitting on the tractor.
Mine is a but hard to disengage so would like not to when doing places like corners where I have to go backwards.

Engine speed PTO turns the same way all the time it is engaged, whether the tractor is in forward or reverse, as it is engine driven. The ground speed PTO is driven from the differential pinion, so its speed is proportional to the ground speed. Since it is driven by the differential pinion it will reverse direction when the tractor is operated in reverse. Your flail mower was not intended to be run in the ground speed mode; it should be run in the engine speed mode. A hay rake and some manure spreaders could be run at ground speed. A spin fertilizer spreader would run engine speed I believe. Check your implement operator's manual to find the recommended PTO speed.

paul · Dec 30, 2021

Unless you rake hay with a pto hay rake, just always use your engine driven position and dont worry about it.

It turned out it really wasnt all that useful or handy a feature, pto stuff wants to be run at a steady same speed for
the machinery.

Paul

Axell · Jan 2, 2022

Wonder how you engage the pto on tractors without 2 stage clutch when using pto driven impliments . Do you start the engine with it engaged. If you engage while the motor is running it cant be done wothout a lot of grinding which cant be good. Or did they just repair the pto mechanism very often if they mainly used demanding impliments.

jsborn · Jan 2, 2022

(quoted from post at 09:12:10 01/02/22) Wonder how you engage the pto on tractors without 2 stage clutch when using pto driven impliments . Do you start the engine with it engaged. If you engage while the motor is running it cant be done wothout a lot of grinding which cant be good. Or did they just repair the pto mechanism very often if they mainly used demanding impliments.

With a single stage Clutch when you push Clutch in (disengage) the PTO Stops along with the tractor. The motor continues to run just disengaged from drive line and PTO. When everything stops turning you put PTO in gear or take it out with out any problem. This has been done for years.

rrlund · Jan 2, 2022

As I alluded to before, if you're running something with the PTO that will run on after you push the clutch pedal down, use an over
running clutch on the PTO shaft. When you push the pedal down without one, the tractor won't stop moving forward until the
implement stops turning. It'll push the tractor and there won't be anything you can do about it.

redforlife · Jan 2, 2022

I have a 235. It has two settings for
PTO. One is engine speed. The other is
ground speed. It'll only turn PTO
backwards in the ground speed setting.
And only when backing tractor up.
You should be using the engine speed
setting for the mower. Mower likely
wont mow if you don't.
The 235 is just a newer version of the
35. I'm not familiar with the 35.
Presuming it would be the same
PTOwise. On mine (I think) the PTO
lever back is engine speed. Forward is
ground speed. Of course middle is
neutral. Vise Versa if I'm mistaken.
Its been awhile since I've used the
PTO on it.

Texasmark · Jan 9, 2022

You can disconnect from the engine but you can't shift gears (shift out of a ground movement gear into Neutral) till the load quits
spinning and releases the pressure on the transmission gear train. Since the tranny is also connected to the rear wheels, they
continue to turn until the kinetic energy stored in the rotating blade of the mower is consumed....then you can shift out of gear
and stop the tractor. Course if your brakes are good you can slow things down or maybe stop ground movement. The overrun
clutch allows the implement to free wheel any time it rotates faster than the PTO shaft and disconnects the mower from the
drivetrain thus stopping the ground movement of the tractor regardless of the gear selected.

On old Fords and such it is a PTO accessory. On a 2016 Branson 2400 manual shift with tranny driven PTO I had, the overrun
clutch is built into the tractor and you don't have to add the PTO accessory.

VicS · Jan 11, 2022

You need a over-riding clutch. Get them
where you get rotary cutters. A 35 MF
should have a 2 stage clutch. First few
inches stops forward motion. Then a harder
petal and that stops the pto. Should back
up in corners well. Forget about ground
drive pto. Don't use it.

Texasmark · Jan 13, 2022

The only question is what's back there turning and how long will it take it to burn up its Kinetic Energy and quit turning.....the rear
wheels....and itself.

Reverse mowing

Axell

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J Hamilton

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paul

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Matt in Oz

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rrlund

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paul

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lugnuts2030

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Axell

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Jim.ME

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paul

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Axell

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jsborn

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rrlund

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redforlife

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Texasmark

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VicS

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Texasmark

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