cheap imported bolts!

kestrel · Mar 1, 2011

Maybe my anger is misplaced here but my first thought was
"these cheap freakin' Chinese fasteners" !

I had it in my silly head that I wanted nice clean shiny bolts for
this restoration. Well, these things have failed twice now.

The cap head just snapped off; once while simply torquing it
down on the wheel. Then I found the sheared cap head from another bolt on the
ground a few days ago. It is pictured on the left in photo.
On the right is my original Case bolt that was removed and stored away, til
today when I put it back on.

I wouldn't mind so much but I paid $50.00 5 years ago for a set
of 10 for this restoration. They were special order items.

Anyone else experience problems with new hardware ?

Is there a good supplier of US made hardware ?

I suppose I could research and trace back the manufacturer but
why bother. I just want a safe ride without the wheels falling
off.....

senoj · Mar 1, 2011

Isn't it comforting wondering how many of this type bolts are in these foriegn AND American made autos and trucks? ggp

Bob Bancroft · Mar 1, 2011

I agree they shouldn't be coming apart like that. But I would be using at least a grade 5.

S.Crum · Mar 1, 2011

Get used to seeing this frequently. I've seen it even with new American made (or so I'm told they are) bolts. Anything you buy at places like Lowe's, TSC, Home depot or any other chain retailer will likely be China made. Sad part is most of this junk is made in China and repackaged in the USA and marketed as American made. Tools that you buy that have a warranty are not worth the paper they wasted printing the warranty on, better off throwing the tool out in the weeds than wasting $4 a gallon gas to take it back hoping to get a replacement. So if you haven't been paying attention to what has been going on around you, you are in for a rude awakening. Anytime somebody touts quality these days, I'm immediately suspicious.

Jon Hagen · Mar 1, 2011

I had a problem like that when I bought a box of generic carriage bolts to retain the opener discs on my JD 750 drills.
I did not realize what I had bought until they started to fail at the initial tightning or soon after. They were a soft grade 2 bolt with markings like yours and it was easy to pull the head off them with just moderate tightning.
I replaced all of them with the correct grade 5 bolt and had no more trouble.

Adirondack case guy · Mar 1, 2011

The problem isn't new. I have seen it with carrage bolts that we got through Case, from Rockford Bolt Co. years back. The problem is with the casting of the weight. One side is higher than the other in the bolt hole, putting all the clamping pressure on one side of the carrage bolt head. High torque impact air tools also contribute.

Anonymous-0 · Mar 1, 2011

Looks like they got the cold heading operation going and use wrong alloy to make it easy to allow the cold header to form the material. I can just see the mess coming when the cold heading dies get worn out.

Lou from Wi. · Mar 1, 2011

We used to have fairly good luck with Fastenal,(local fastener store) for a special order. If it was me I would see if they could get it in a Grade 8 or 9 carriage bolt.Should be a lot more torque you could apply,with out damage. Hope this helps.
LOU & VICTOR

guido · Mar 1, 2011

Hello kestrel,
Breaking hardware while torquing is usually a sign of the wrong grade of fastener.
You need to get a grade 8 hardware for a wheel application. They should be marked that way.
Grade 8 bolts have 6 markings on the head. Studs for wheels are also grade 8.
Fastenal is one sourse.
Guido.

kestrel · Mar 1, 2011

Thanks. I'm going to give that company a try.

I bought mine through a local diesel truck repair shop. I thought they would be decent quality at least. Oh well...

I haul heavy loads of fieldstone every spring with this tractor so I might as well replace them all.

Ultradog MN · Mar 1, 2011

I don't know of any place that sells grade 8 carriage bolts. Fastenal does not.
They do sell gr 5.

JD Seller · Mar 1, 2011

You have simple grade two bolts. They are not very strong when they are carriage bolts. I have found it is hard to get good carriage bolts. There maybe other places but I have found that John Deere dealers that stock John Deere bolts can get grade 5 and grade eight carriage bolts. Now they have to be the ones in JD parts system not the bulk bolts that are out in racks.

If you could tell me the size and length I can check on the part number and cost. Just post or email me.

Lou from Wi. · Mar 1, 2011

Not arguing with you but,We've ordered Special order thru them, took them some time to find them,but usually they can get them here at least.Not sure of carriage bolts though,but they should be able to.

RayP(MI) · Mar 1, 2011

Had the same problem when I replaced the carrage bolts that held the edge on my truck-mounted truck snow plow blade. Hardware store grade bolts were snapping off in the first hundred yards. Had to go to a commercial bolt supplier to get higher grade bolts. They haven't failed.

Lou from Wi. · Mar 1, 2011

Here's a link to GRADE 8 CARRIAGE BOLTS
Don't know what size or length you need,also can order online or give the number to Fastenal tell them they are available here and see if they can match up from there. Hope this helps,
LOU & Victor
carriage bolts

Ultradog MN · Mar 1, 2011

Thanks Lou.
Learn something new every day.
Smaller Fords use a 5/8" carriage bolt where the wheel center bolts to the rim. Looked for them a couple of times before and called Fastenal too.
Grade 8 doesn't rust/seize up as bad as gr 5 or 2. Can get them off after a few years.
I bookmarked that site.

VAIinMN · Mar 1, 2011

sorry i know china bolts suck but i was curiouse if you knew where to find a rim like yours in that picture i need a 10x24 with a bevel like that and 2 of those Wedges/ clips

Dean Olson · Mar 1, 2011

I have started buying grade 8 hardware for everything.
The non standard stuff I get from Fastenal. The standard from my local Tractor Supply.

The final straw was tightening down a fastener with a pair of 9/16th wrenches and stripped the threads, twice!!

Either I'm getting stronger in my old age or the fasteners are getting cheaper.

36 Coupe · Mar 2, 2011

There are some fake grade 5 and 8 bolts being sold.

Billy NY · Mar 2, 2011

The thing that gets my attention here is that the carriage bolt is marked 307, which is an ASTM designation and I believe the equivalent of grade 5, regardless, the manufacturer has marked these as such and they should meet the criteria for same, obviously not the case in tension here is it ? Could be the same for shear, appears to be defective or substandard material. This creates an unsafe connection, one that may fail and cause someone injury. I do not believe a grade 5 fastener should fail like it did, unless it was over torqued. In comparison, structural steel connections are made with A325 fasteners, high strength bolts, which I believe are the equivalent to grade 8, regardless, they are marked as such, you cannot have substandard materials for these kinds of connections, it would be catastrophic. Funny, while on high rise jobs I used to pick up a lot of those A325's and put em in my bin at home, same ones fit and hold my tractor wheels on, ironworkers used to drop buckets of em on jobs, never stop to pick em up, I used to find a lot of useful hardware on jobsites such as these.

JayinNY · Mar 2, 2011

That would explaine why the bolt looks bent to the left in the picture. Uneven torque maybe?

kestrel · Mar 2, 2011

According to the chart below, I bought the wrong grade entirely.

A 307 are low strength low carbon bolts. Maybe designed for wood applications.

Your 325's were worth picking up though !
Thanks for the reply.
bolt grade chart

Billy NY · Mar 2, 2011

307 is a grade 2, been awhile since I looked at a chart, obviously why they twist off when you crank em down. ASTM 325's are less in tension then grade 8's, both are still quite strong. I used to deal with fasteners quite a bit at work in years past. I used to marvel at how many the ironworkers would leave on the decks, always made sure to get my share for the bin, big structural steel buildings were great places to find these, they come packaged in steel cans/kegs, need lots of em for these jobs, guess the handfuls they left behind were the cost of business....

36 Coupe · Mar 5, 2011

I use 307 bolts for picnic tables but would not use them to keep the wheels on my tractor.I pay 2.00 per pound or 23 cents each.

36 Coupe · Mar 5, 2011

If you paid 5 bucks each for those bolts you got ripped off bad.Tsc sells grade 2 carraige bolts for 2 bucks a pound but they dont stock 3/8 x3 1/2 that I use.

kestrel · Mar 5, 2011

Yeah, I know now the 307s are grade 2, thanks to some replies here. but when I bought them, from a diesel truck repair shop, I just assumed they were rated for my tractor. The employee there knew that and special ordered the odd size for me.

You're right. Their rating make them perfect for wood applications.

cheap imported bolts!

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