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Pertronix Installed

A

Aaron Ford

Well-known Member
I ordered the Pertronix with matching coil from this site and installed it last night. Talk about easy. I made it a little harder by soldering the solderless connectors and heatshrinking the connections. It is amazing. I opened the plug gap to .039 to take advantage of the new coil. It starts on the first crank, needs no choke even when cold, and produces power from a much lower RPM. My electronic tach is also rock steady. I found that my max RPM is 1500 instead of the 2500 that the tach used to bounce to. I need to adjust that. My gear reduction calculations had suggested that I wasn't getting to 2500,, but I had to play it safe. Much less black smoke from the exhaust.

I am aware that this simply fixed problems that I had, but was unaware of. I had new points, condensor and a coil that tested good...

Yeah, it's chrome.

Aaron
DSCN1966.jpg
 
If you had, or still have black smoke -there are problems other then the igntion system (as you aleady acknowledged).

Same goes for a gas engine that starts right up when cold with no choke. With a pefectly tuned engine and a perfect working carb - it would NOT start without the choke function. That defies the physics of how a carb works with the "venturi-effect." Sounds like your extra spark-voltage is masking other problems. If that carb is "rich" enough to start cold with no choke, how wonder what it's doing on a warm engine?

By the way, had to start my TO-35 gas tractor yesterday. Just old fashioned coil and points system. 16 degrees F and it hadn't been started in two months. Started just about instantly (with the choke pulled out). Same for my Deere 1010 - which i also had to move.
Just offering evidence tractors with OEM points systems also start well when in good tune.
 
It used to require choke, and two crank attempts. To get the tractor to run steady and produce power, the carb had to be set rich. I have been able to back off the idle mixture and tighten up the main. It will now pull off cleanly from a dead stop in third high range. I am sure there is more power to be had. I initially set the advance to 5 degrees, but suspect I can get it to run cleaner with some fine tuning.

I, too, have had many vehicles, power equipment, tractors, and snowmobiles that run perfectly fine with points and condensors. I think this one did not have enough spark for the compression increase. At 7:1, it would have been fine.

Aaron
 
jd what are you callig a cold start? my a starts fine with no choke in summer time once temp drops below 60 degrees farenheit i have to choke it first start of the day and of course goes down hill after that would you say i have a carb problem? lol
 
What compression-ratio do you have now? Highest CR ever used sucessfully in a production gas tractor was Oliver, I think that was 8.5 to 1. Oliver still holds the worlds-record for fuel efficiency in a gas tractor.

We tried putting 8.5 in several John Deere tractors and it was awful. Even with the highestr octane gas we could buy, and retarding the timing, the pistons still suffered from detonation under a heavy load. With Deere, all you had to do was intall the high-altitude kit in a tractor NOT run in high-altitude - to get high compression and quickly ruin the engine.

Other then the record-breaking Olivers, 8 to 1 seems to be the high barely-safe limit for a gas tractor that gets worked.
 
In my world, I'm calling anything below the temp that water freezes - cold. I.e. 32 degrees F.

Carburetors work by venturi effect and a properly working carb cannot provide a mixture rich enough to start a cold engine - unless it's choked, or has an accelerator pump you can cycle, or has a primer of some sort. My old British bikes had "ticklers" that forced the float down and flooded the engine for cold starting. Crude, but effective. Primer-bulbs can have the same effect.

Most if not all cars and trucks had accelerator pumps - so you could stomp up and down on the gas pedal and make them start with no choke. Not very common in tractors though. That beind said, many International Harvester British tractors with Brisish Zenith carbs DO have accelerator pumps. Kind of nice to have that feature.
 
That is interesting. I am running a 60 John Deere with a propane power block and shaved head that runs very close to 9:1 and it will plow all day on regular octane pump gas (ethanol). Timing is set at 22 degrees. When I had the engine apart I was very careful to watch for any areas that would cause hot spots. The tractor gets used each fall running a ten inch auger and always does fine. I would not hesitate to plow all day with this tractor if need be. In fact, I have done it. No spark knock or detonation problems whatsoever. Mike
 
I used high altitude pistons. My machine shop measured and determined that I should be seeing a 9:1 compression. My measurement showed closer to a 9.5:1. I run 91 octane for safetys sake. I have had 87 in it with no knock/ping/preig problems. They said I may have problems with a stock ignition system. My next tune will include advancing the timing to try to get a better burn. Hopefully I can pull more fuel out of the motor. I am also working on a cool overflow tank for the radiator.

When I get all this sorted out, it will be on the pulling track...

Aaron
 
I've been told that having two huge combustion chambers, instead of four little ones makes an engine much more forgiving with compression ratios, low octane fuels, etc. Can't say I ever experimented with it though. All my attempts with high compression in Deere gas engines were with 300 series Dubuque engines. At the time, high-altitude pistons weren't any more expensive then standard. We tried it in a few 2020s, 2510s, etc. In this area with 1300 feet elevation, it was disaster when those engines got worked hard.

Does make me wonder though, why Deere didn't do it themselves with the two-cylinder series. By the time Oliver broke all records with their 8.5 to 1, Deere hadn't made a two-banger in North America for 6-8 years.
 
JDEmaris!! You better watch your tounge now. Jegs , Summit and a few others might just sue you if these people quit buying their "speed" parts. We all know if it's good for race engines it's gotta be good for our tractors now. Put a MSD box on and bet it will start right up even with the gas off. Just pokin' fun but ya know I got a restored '66 GTO with 400 cubes , three 2 bbl carbs , 11:1 compression , Ram Air III cam , headers etc that runs 13.2 at 104 in 1/4 mi ( street tires), starts up instantly and run to 6000rpm and never miss a beat. Ignition...single point distributer and hi po coil. No MSD , EI or huge blue wires here. Man that's a lot of fuel to fire with those outdated points. Guess everybody,s got to spend their money somewhere.
 
I had many, many GTOs. Mostly 64s and 65s. Some with 389s and tri-power, and one with a 421 and a huge Carter AFB on it. I don't even know if the choke worked on any of them. Stomp the pedal a few times and they'd fire right up.

Biggest problem was the tri-power setups was catching fire, every once in awhile. Back when 65 Goats were common-plsce, many had three little burn-holes in the paint on the hood.

I never had a 66. Many 64s, and 65s an one 67 with a 400. Also had a 63 Tempest "pre-GTO" with a 326 in front and transmission in the back. Wasn't very common.

60s GTOs were my all-time favorite cars. I'd love to have one all stock - but that's one car never seems to show up anywhere cheap. I do have a 65 Chevelle SS with a 327. Nice car, can out-rev a Goat, but has nowhere near as much neck-snapping torque.
 
Here's a photo. Wipe that drool off! I remember the fires also. The paper filters would saturate with fumes when hot engine turned off and then when started up the next time if the choke wasn't set perfectly it might spit back (hot cams) and catch the filters on fire. Loved them '65,s also.
a29234.jpg
 
Beautiful car. Guess it looks just like a 67, except for the differnt tail-lights?

When one of my friends came home from Viet Nam in 67, he bought a brand-new 67 GTO convertible. Brand new, bone stock, and quiet. 400 engine and Muncie 4 speed. We all piled in and went for a cruise. What an amazing car. Having the factory quiet exhaust made it seem more powerful. Five jerks in a car, with couple of six-packs and that thing would leave rubber in the first three gears.
 
Didnt the 730 diesel hold the fuel efficiency record? Maybe your talking strictly gas. I have driven several gas olivers and they dont lug very well, but they do run smooth
 
I said gas and Oliver holds the record. A Yanmar turbo-diesel tractor with a Deere name on the hood held the first-place diesel record. Deere 720 diesel was second.
 
(quoted from post at 14:44:11 01/04/11) I've been told that having two huge combustion chambers, instead of four little ones makes an engine much more forgiving with compression ratios, low octane fuels, etc.
Click to expand...

And that would be unbelievably incorrect.

If you violate the 4 inch rule, then there will be penance. Them Deere plugs hanging out the side are a disaster, as they are with most tractor engines.

Get things just a little bit wrong on a 36 inch piston and watch the head blow off. Real detonation. Not that piston jingle that people think is detonation.

Most people don't actually run the compression they think they have in the place they think they have it. And when they pull out a measuring stick and say it is "x" to one, well it just makes your teeth grind. Not to mention that look they get when you ask what their fuel distribution looks like.

Sorry to rant, but most engine talk just irks me.

By the way, cool that the tack works nice. One of the benefits of a clean ignition.
 
That's been my experience with the Pertronix kit in my CA Allis and model 60 Oliver. They both start far better and run much smoother than they ever did with points. I set my plug gaps at .045. They need less choke now also when cold.
 
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