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Fuel Prices...Here we go again...

A

Anonymous-0

Well-known Member
In USA Today they said gas will be $4.00gal by summer...What are we gonna do??? It says if it reaches $5.00 we will go into Global Depression. No one can afford anything in the stores now. Who is gonna buy a new car, car workers out of work, grain prices up but fertilizer and seed will be up too! People that dont prepare are going to steal more, poaching cows ect. In Michigan we been in a serious recession, our new govenor gets sworn in today and starts out with a 1.88 billion dollar deficit..so much for our recovery..:(
 
If the economy continues to recover, here or worldwide, I expect gasoline to reach $5.00 this year.

Of course, energy prices will have a major effect upon economic expansion.

Dean
 
Aren't today's problems sufficient for today? Of worrying about what will or won't happen tomorrow, a wise old country friend often said, "Don't borry trouble."

Worry only stresses about things over which we have no control. If we can't control prices, it's unhealthy to worry about them. We can ANTICIPATE them, we can PLAN for them, we can HOPE AGAINST them...but for most of us, we can't do a SINGLE THING about them.
 
Its is sad that the greed of the oil companies set the level of prosperity in the country, and the world.
 
Fuel is a commodity, same as corn or wheat, difference is that when corn or wheat go up production soon goes up as well. If you want to do something positive about the long term stabilisation of fuel prices then vote for people who are for development of Americas energy resources.
 
Filled up yesterday with regular for $4.19 a US gallon.

US prices are headed to these European prices. You don't see Joe Lunch Box driving a dually One Ton as a commuter vehicle. VW diesels and four cylinder fwd econo boxes etc.

Multiply price by 1.34 to to get US dollars.

Irish Petrol Prices : December 2010
Surveyed in December (avg. retail price per litre)
Unleaded Diesel
140.1c 133.3c
Euro Zone Price Comparisons
Local Currency per litre Euro Cent per litre
Country Currency Unleaded Diesel Unleaded Diesel
Austria Euro 1.2 1.12 1.2 1.12
Belgium Euro 1.45 1.21 1.45 1.21
Bulgaria Leva 2.17 2.23 1.11 1.14
Czech Republic Czech Koruna 32.7 31.5 1.32 1.27
Denmark Danish Krone 11.02 9.74 1.48 1.31
Estonia Kroons 17.4 17.4 1.11 1.11
Finland Euro 1.42 1.13 1.42 1.13
France Euro 1.41 1.22 1.41 1.22
GB Sterling 1.24 1.19 1.51 1.45
Germany Euro 1.39 1.19 1.39 1.19
Greece Euro 1.5 1.25 1.5 1.25
Hungary Forint 337 323 1.21 1.16
Ireland Euro 1.33 1.25 1.33 1.25
Italy Euro 1.37 1.28 1.37 1.28
Latvia Lats 0.77 0.75 1.09 1.06
Lithuania Litas 337 323 0.98 0.94
Luxembourg Euro 1.14 0.99 1.14 0.99
Malta Euro 1.22 1.06 1.22 1.06
Netherlands Euro 1.54 1.21 1.54 1.21
Northern Ireland Pound Sterling 1.17 1.2 1.43 1.47
Norway Norwegian Krone 12.68 11.57 1.59 1.45
Poland Zloty 4.67 4.39 1.17 1.1
Portugal Euro 1.36 1.13 1.36 1.13
Slovakia Euro 1.27 1.13 1.27 1.13
Slovenia Euro 1.22 1.18 1.22 1.18
Spain Euro 1.17 1.1 1.17 1.1
Sweden Swedish Krona 12.68 12.26 1.34 1.29
Sweden Swedish Krona 12.68 12.26 1.34 1.29
Switzerland Swiss Franc 1.63 1.71 1.24 1.3
International Price Comparisons
* Fuel in the USA is sold in US gallons. 1 US gallon = 3.78 litres
 
You did not mention that a very large percentage of those European prices are tax.
 
It doesn't matter WHO's in office. Remember 2000-2006, when a single party [hint: NOT nnalert] controlled DC? I didn't see a lot of new drilling then.

I'm no longer deluded into thinking the party in power makes a difference. Both are out for the benefit of SELF, not for the benefit of AMERICA.
 
It is interesting to note that, unlike the US, almost all of the countries on the list have no significant domestic oil production let alone huge untapped reserves.

Dean
 
Our government has slowly but surely turned in to a greedy corporation. That is not what the Constitution lays out, nor was it what our forefathers seemed to want to create.
For those of you that turn a deaf ear or a blind eye, here is how it REALLY works in a nut shell.
It takes $$$ and lots of it in most cases to get elected to any office of significance. The average American that takes the brunt of most laws related to the economy does not have that kind of money. Big business does have that kind of money and they love to spend it.
So, Joe Smoe gets elected by big companies. When he (or she) gets in office, it is common practice and very much expected that he (or she) will pay back the "favors".
Let's say it is a large construction company. Joe Smoe is going to any means to make sure that THAT company gets more business than the others. They will even create false jobs and make sure they win the bid (IE "Bridge to nowhere", and many other projects born out of the need to transfer our tax money to the companies that got them elected) Matters not if it is bid fixing, releasing confidential bid info, etc.
What happens to the real do gooders that want to get elected so that they can do right? They typically do not get elected because the big companies know that there is nothing in it for them.
At some point, I trust that we will get strong enough to change things such as Congress voting their own salaries and benefit packages. That is the proverbial fox guarding the hen house if there ever was one. How many of these white collar crooks would be in office if it was public service, term limits, modest pay, and no golden parachute package for the rest of their lives? Not many.
 
Right!However,the group which are not nnalert took the laws regarding speculating stock prices off of the stock market in the first part of the previous presidents administration,and now there is nothing stopping them from calling paper stocks real.The big banks own the speculators who bought up a years supply of oil that was just on paper,and since its not even pumped out of the ground yet,they claim its a shortage.That way they force oil artificially higher,and everything else goes higher.Its manipulating the stock market,and its illegal in more than one way.It doesnt appear that the nnalert can do anything about it,or if they even want to.So the nnalert must be bought out by the big banks too.
When you start talking about world problems caused by what is going on here,that is what wars are made of.
I guess big banks thing since we have such a good military,they will take advantage of that and misbehave in the world market.This is bound to cause retaliation from the rest of the world.It doesnt pay to be dumb about this stuff.Micheal.W.Masters and others have been talking about this stuff for several years now.Running the stock prices up by extortion is not going to end well for us.
 
Thats true.There is also a name for what you are talking about.Its F@scism(some filter stops it from putting that up if its spelled right).The same thing that happened before WW2 in Germany.
So while what you say is true,its not the way government is supposed to work.Its actually traitors when they represent companys instead of people.
We should throw them all out and start over without big business money and never let them do it again.
 
I don't remember mentioning a specific party in the above post -- I agree with you 100% that the American people are not being represented by politicians that put their constituents best interests first. That is why we need to throw them out and start over.
 
Just as they have tested us in the past say it's going to 5 bucks a gallon take it up to 4.89
during the first major traveling Holiday then drop it to 3.99 and all will be happy.
I would hope that some day people would regain control of OUR situation, and stock about 3 weeks of fuel and not buy any in that time period,
but as in every other mass needed situations that will never happen.
 
Unless fuel prices go down,back to what they would be on supply demand,which was below 2 dollars a gallon,there wont be a recovery.
You are going to hear all kinds of excuses to raise the price of fuel now since the crooks are in charge of the house.However if the price goes up,no recovery and more misery.All you have to do is look at history and who has the lower fuel prices is who has the best economy.The crooks are for high prices and horrible economies.The crooks work for rich people not working people.The crooks lie all the time.If there lips are moving,they are lying.There are even crooks on the other side now.I wonder where the good guys are any more.I dont think there are any good guys left.
 
If you really think that the price will go that high then buy energy stocks and make some money. Not that sure now are you.
 
How is it greed to make a profit? How is it greed to charge what the market will bear for your product? Do you have any idea how much positive economic impact oil companies have in the world? Blame the real culprits, government intrusion on free markets and crack pot theories masquerading as energy policy.
 
That's almost as high as here in Victoria,B.C. at 112.9/litre unleaded and we have lots of oil in Can.
 
trucker 40 -- how did you come up with the figure of less than 2.00 per gallon if based on supply and demand -- you must have pulled it out of the sky because you could not possibly know the projected oil out put and supply for the coming year. Your arch enimies the ''speculators'' set the oil markets by betting on the supply and demand, the same as any other commodity market is priced. If there were no speculators then every agricultural and industrial commodity market world wide would be thrown into disorder and most would collapse.
 
That fuel is a necessary part of life it should not be on a stock market.At least not like it is now,being artificially run up.
You put this stuff up all the time and its actually kind of old now.
I wonder what you will think when somebody comes after us for ruining their economy because you want to make money off of the stock market?The only way these companys got where they are is because of our freedom men fought and died for from our country.
These companys arent people.They have no rights.We should make them be fair or take it away from them and give it to people who will be fair,or even better,break them up into smaller companys which arent so powerfull.
 
I'm not gonna panic just yet. All of these commodities prices are being driven by fund trading not supply and demand,just like they were in 08 before the crash. I don't have any idea what the a-holes on talk radio are saying,but back then they were trying to convince everybody that it was supply and demand. If we could just drill in ANWR or offshore,that would cure everything. Wasn't it amazing that the price of oil dropped from $147 to $39 without pumping one more drop of oil?
Not quite sure what's going on right now as far as what kind of trading the fund managers are doing,but from the 08 crash til recently,they were only trading "sell only" funds,which meant they only made money when the price went down. That,opposed to prior to the crash when they were only trading "buy only",where they only made money on the way up.
Those traders lost HUGE in the crash and I'd like to think they don't have such short memories that they would do it again.
But yea,I'm not holding my breath for any miracles from Snyder. His pick for Lt Governor was my first glimpse into the kind of decisions he was going to make,and Brian Calley was his first of what will probably be a LOT of mistakes.
 
trucker 40 -- What are you talking about? Fuel on the stock market? The people that fought and died for our country did not fight and die for the socialist pablum your spouting. Nobody is entitled to anything that someone else produced.
 
Fossil fuel prices will go up because all fossil fuels cause Global Warming; we know that because Al Gore told us so.

Current administration wants to start a new "green economy" with the people they choose in control of it and the wealth redistributed as they see fit.
 
Electric cars must be the answer, gov'mt thinks so. Herd on TV that it takes about as much electricity to charge the Volt overnight as it does to run 3 average housholds. That is the way to save fuel gov'mt style.
 
You're a fool if you give the oil companies a free ride. You don't even know what the oil companies and for that matter the insurance companies profits really are. You only know what they want you to know.
 
What aggravates me is that when fuel prices go up goods do too. When fuel comes back down the price of goods remains high and never comes down more than a cent or two.

When fuel spiked a couple of years ago or three, whatever it was, eggs jumped from 69¢ a dozen to 90¢ plus. As fuel and feed went even higher due to transportation and related input cost eggs continued to rise in price. They now hover around $1.69 or more than double in 2-3 years. Any bets that they will EVER come back down?

After farm fertilizers spiked I doubted that farmers would ever so those prices drop, but they did come down some.

Seems to me that farmers almost ALWAYS get the short end of the stick.
 
The fomer head of shell oil spouting that gas will be $5.00 per gallon by 2012.He saying we should stop the regulation and let them do what they want to when they want to and how they want to. Typical rehteric from big oil and big money.Lets not forget the lives of the workers of Bp oil spill due to the disregard for safety by BP.Also the people who died in Pasedena Texas oil refinery Bp owned . People are saying they dont want our Government in our business but if we do not have regulations think of what big money and big oil will do_Our food is a perfect example. No FDA inspections at meat packing plant for ten years? Come on now!
 
Your right. For no reason at all fuel prices should bounce around between 2.50 and 3.20. And as holidays, weekends and the slightest bad news out of the middle east should make prices spike.

The guility are: The oil companies, the Arabs, the US government for not allowing more drilling and for letting the big oil companies to merge, Chevron/Texaco, ARCO and BP, Mobil/Exxon.
Teddy Roosevelt broke up Standard oil a century ago.
 
Your right. For no reason at all fuel prices should bounce around between 2.50 and 3.20. And as holidays, weekends and the slightest bad news out of the middle east should make prices spike.

The guility are: The oil companies, the Arabs, the US government for not allowing more drilling and for letting the big oil companies to merge, Chevron/Texaco, ARCO and BP, Mobil/Exxon.
Teddy Roosevelt broke up Standard oil a century ago.
 
What happened to the equasion of a bushel of wheat is equal to a barrel of oil when I was a kid?
 
If things were right,you would be right.However what happened is this.The big banks wanted no regulation of the stock market and it was given to them.Then they bought up a years worth of oil on paer and jacked up the price.The price bfore this all happened,and we were using a lot more oil,was about 1.50 a gallon.So we need to go back to 1.50 a gallon and actually lower than that since demand is down and storage full, and less fuel is being made.So actual price,by supply and demand is between 1 dollar and 1.50 per gallon.
Thats how I come up with it.I am not falling for the price they jacked it up to.I am going by where it was at before they ran it up.
 
What?There would not be a stock market if there was no freedom.Do you think people in Communist China can play on the stock market like you can here?You have to understand that natural resources,such as oil are protected by our military and belong to our citizens.Since we have had wars to keep our freedom, that you are even writing on the internet is because of others sacrifice.Use of our natural resources and a stock market based on supply and demand is what we should have,not the crooked mess that we have now.We always had a supply and demand stock market before they deregulated it and started running it up artificially with oil.
The world you think exists where big business runs everything has a name.F@scism and its not how our country is supposed to work.Actually our country is not working now,its in a depression.your way will never work and probably will get us in a war before long.This time it will be right here in our country.Possibly by our own citizens if the government keeps going further and further f@scist.
 
Nothing happened to it.The crooks got control of the stock market and ran it up and made money beyond their wildest dreams.They still are.Look at profits for big oil companys.Big companys always lie about the numbers,but the numbers they put out if you doubled that,maybe would be close and they are crazy high.
Thats what happens when you let the fox guard the chicken house.
 
Brian used to come to our township meetings and answer any questions we might have. I found him to be a good guy,Did I miss something? What has he done that I dont know about? I dont folow politics closely
 
Farmers ALWAYS do get the short end of the stick.The reason is that farmers work for a living,crooks stealing from them dont actually work for a living,unless you call stealing work.Its always been that way.Its not just farmers,its EVERYBODY that works for a living is being robbed by those who steal for a living.
 
If you put gas in the tank and burn it,or they put coal in a turbine and make electricity,fuel is being burned and it will still cost you.A lot of the crap about global warming is so they can jack up electricity prices.Once they get that done it wont matter if you have an electric car or not.
 
Just curious. How many of you bxtxhing about gas prices are driving a 4 wheel drive gas guzzler? We have been down this road how many times now? And is anybody making any significant changes? We can not rely on our govenment to fix this problem and certainly not the oil companies. You better figure out a solution for yourself or you will be bxtxhing the rest of your life.
 
Tom,

Your question begs to hear your answer. When greed runs any business, they set loafty and sometimes unrealistic profit targets. In the case of the oil companies, should we begin to use less, they just jack the prices even higher to try to meet those greedy profit targets.
How do you suppose getting rid of "gas guzzlers" will aid in cutting gas prices based on that bit of reality?
They have lied to us about many things, including how much oil and reserve there is. We were supposed to run out of oil shortly. Heck, they can't find enough storage for what they have above ground, and there is so much more that is below ground and not even discovered yet.
Remember another lie, "the price of diesel will drop even more as the usuage climbs." Priced diesel in the last 5 years?
Diesel, even with additives, is much cheaper to get to the pumps than gas, yet it cost MORE? Duh.
Once again, an investor that is leaning on oil stocks for profit wants it to go out the roof, no matter what happens to our economic strenght in the US.
 
That's the trouble,he goes to meetings and answers questions. He went around putting on townhall meetings telling people how to complain at Board of Review without the first clue how the property tax system even works in this state. I spent both days of Board of Review one year straightening people out when they came in all cocky armed with the wrong info that he gave them.
Then he showed up at the Farm Bureau County Meeting trying to con us into supporting an 18 mil tax break for some of his donors who owned recreational property. When I started grilling him about his motives and how he was going to acomplish what he was trying to pull,he got all red in the face and quiet. Haven't quite figured out yet if he thought everybody in the room was stupid or (more likely) he didn't have the first clue what he was talking about.
I agree,he's a nice guy,I don't walk out of the coffee shop if he comes in and sits down with us,but more likely than not,he just sits there, literally,picking his nose. The guy just wasn't ready for that kind of a promotion. I didn't even support his run for State Senate. He claimed to be a banker,shoot,he was a bank teller and even at that,he was so shy that he'd sit back just hoping that somebody else would wait on the customers so he didn't have to.
It's just not a real great comfort to me knowing that he's second in command or that Snyder gives a rats rear end what he has to say,since dollars to donuts he's gonna be wrong.
 
Come on t,you and I have been through all of this. I thought I finally showed you a year ago that these commodity prices are driven by fund traders trading YOUR money for YOUR benefit. If you pay an insurance premium,or have a retirement account,where else are the traders who handle YOUR money going to make it grow? Interest rates are zero so the government can survive from day to day on borrowed money. Everybody thinks they should be able to squirrel away a dollar a week and be worth a million when they retire. Do you want your insurance premiums to be equal to the face value of your policy? Traders HAVE to turn a little bit of YOUR money into a LOT of money. It's no more complicated than that.
 
Just what are the true profits of insurance and oil companies? Please provide documentation and not just what you think they are.
 
I came back and read ITom's comment and was going to respond, then scrolled and read yours 730 and I couldn't have said it better.
Appears there is a ripping off and raping of Americas middle class going on.
 
Just what I thought. You don't have an answer. I will give you credit, you didn't make one up this time.
 
Everything I say is fact, just don't have to prove anything to you.
Some congressman was chasing one of those two around trying to get an actual figure of profit. You would think if they're traded it would break some law, laws don't mean much to them.
 
The trouble is, we all humans are about the same, we all are greedy. Every one of us. 'Wall Street' is us, our money invested, we want higher returns. It's real handy to blame business, but every business, every union, every person setting up a retirement plan, every consumer walking into a store, is looking to get the best deal.

We gotta blame them, and you, and me, all the same. That's the only real truth, and if we all would admit it we'd start down the path of fixing it.

I won't hold my breath. ;)

--->Paul
 
Heh,heh,heh!You sure make it sound good.Ill give you a couple of links to stuff thats even way worse than gas prices.They are both long,but I know they work and its 30,000 dollars for every man woman and child in the USA that they spent of your tax dollars.Tell me how,when these crooks are doing this kind of thing,then lying about it,that it equates into some good old boy crooks trying to make some money for your retirement portfolio?I think you missed the one about the fox guarding the chickenhouse.
http://poorrichards-blog.blogspot.com/2010/12/wall-street-pentagon-papers-biggest.html

and http://ampestatus.com/the-wall-street-pentagon-papers-biggest-scam-in-world-history-exposed-are-the-federal-reserves-crimes-too-big-to-comprehend

Both have the same info,just the second one has a real long discussion with it.

This stock market is rigged and thats wrong.Oil on a rigged stock market so retirement accounts can make money?Not real likely.

Come to the OT and see what I have posted if you want to.Its there under are the federal reserves crimes too big to comprehend.Thats not all,but that is an important one.Especially what Ron Paul says about it.
 
Just look up Micheal W.Masters report to congress in I think it was May 2008.It tells what happened,it has graphs,and a good explanation.Very little has changed,its stock market manipulation.Big banks wanted this and the previous administration gave it to them.So far the present administration has done very little about it,which I take to mean is they are bought out by big banks too,or they cant get it passed because the crooks wont let them.Since all of them are crooks nowdays Id say they are bought off.
 
In California our oil refineries are laying people off. Opperations, maintainance and planning are all running lean. Too much capacity for demand. All the majors are selling their retail stations. They tell me the same thing is happening at their Texas operations. Exploration is strong now but that seems more about current regulatory structure (environmental and taxes) and plans the future. It seems like the oil companies are not expecting big price and profit increases.
 
You did read the same posting by 730 that I did, right?

He said we have plenty of oil, we just refuse to let our domestic oil companies get it. Not trying to start anything, but I thought you were against us producing our oil?

If the next president (rep or dem), comes into office with a mandate to go get our own oil, the prices will drop sharply and immediately. OPEC and other suppliers will try to lower the price to keep us from producing our own. But if we follow it up with a serious and sustained effort to do so, we will see $25 oil again, buck and a quarter at the pump. Wouldn't that be a nice stimulus for the economy? I know it would help me.

I'm just sayin.
 
Not I.

I commute 30+ miles to work and drive a late model four cylinder FWD automobile with six speed automatic transmission.

Aside from the 1968 GMC 2500 bought new by my Father when he retired from GM, I have never owned a truck, 4x4 or otherwise, or any 4x4 vehicle, though I have long lived on a small farm on a long private road with a steep hill in an area where significant snowfall is not uncommon and include antique tractors as one of my hobbies. I DID spend MANY hours learning how to drive on snow with RWD automobiles long before I had a drivers license and have long considered myself an expert, as do others.

Whether one believes in conspiracy theories regarding fuel prices or otherwise, there are USUALLY things that one can do to minimize (not eliminate) the impact to onesself.

Dean
 
And most electricity is produced from coal, something the Green movement hates. So a guy buys an electric car thinking he's saving the world, plugs it into an outlet, and uses coal to run his car. Interesting how some people can't see what's right in front of them.

Kind of like corn for fuel. I don't have a problem with it, but the same people that were pushing for it 20 years ago now want to do away with it because it supposedly raises the price of corn related products. Again, interesting how people refuse to think past step one.

I guess a warm fuzzy feeling has replaced common sense and sound judgement.
 
Actually there is some stronger demand, especially in Asia and India. Don't know if that should be causing these increases, personally I don't think so. OPEC towlies last week said they were aiming for $100/brl, and that they would be comfortable there for a while. Horsestuff!

Read an article today that said in 20 years 350 million Chinese will be living in cities that haven't been built yet. That's a little hard to get your brain around, or mine anyway.
 
I don't think USA Today should be allowed to set gas prices. Maybe Eric Holder could look into that?
 
So you are saying(I think truthfully)that this price is artificially high because oil companys dont like the President.Oil companys need to stay out of our politics and if they jack prices up because they dont like the president thats insane.I am thinking the same thing as you,but I dont see how they can get away with that stuff.How many people use oil,just say 250 million people who have to pay a big may as well say tax because some jerk running an oil company doesnt like the president we elected.We were never going to elect the other guy anyway.Im about tired of this blame the consumer crap!Its one lame excuse after the other.If we dont put regulations on them the price will never go down.They will just think of another excuse to blame it on and the crooked politicians will take their bribe and do nothing,unless we make them do something.Then the crooked bankers will steal some more money from us if we dont stop them either.
 
It's pointless. I'd hoped you had gotten past the extremism,but you're as hooked on that left wing stuff as the listeners of AM talk radio are on the right wing extremism.
It's been a real treat,but there's no point trying to discus anything with you.
 
don't allow fuels to be a commidity thats invested in for profits, have all monoply of fuels(exxon/mobil) dissolved. incresae refiniery operations, and PUT people to work. That will help with price of fuel.
 
What I read in 730s is the same thing I've run into my self that there is already plenty of oil and oil companies are leasing land to store oil that is already above ground.
I also believe not that we don't need to produce our own oil, that we've been lied to repeatedly about running out of oil and I don't think there was any reason to drill the Gulf other than a Bush payoff to the oil companies.
730 said that the quantity of oil was large and some yet undiscovered not about the lack of drilling domestic.
I think we're in the hands of speculators and if a President went after them things would change. The lying speculators have been caught with their hands in the till some much that the people don't believe any of their reasons for prices raising, so that you hardly hear a reason any more.
 
Im sorry,but Wall Street is definitely NOT us.Wall Street has stolen 30,000 dollars from every man woman and child in America recently.Besides other crimes.Its because of taking the regulations off of Wall Street.
 
I guess we will have to disagree then.I dont understand when normally sensible people cant open their mind enough to see whats right in front of them?
Actually neither side is completely right about things.Its about half of one side and half of the other and the truth is in there somewhere.
I just dont buy the right wing stuff because in my life Ive seen lots of problems from it.I admit that I am as hard headedly against the right wing as you are against the left.Maybe even more.It doesnt mean I dont like your replys.I like what sensible people say if I dont agree with it.
 
trucker, I cannot find where he said it was because of THIS president.
G W Bush was prez when Katrina struck, that is when gas and diesel prices shot up. The oil companies said that it was due to "disruptions" caused by the storm. Katrina must still be raging somewhere between the gulf and the pipeline depots. LOL
No matter what you wish to think, it is one of the longer running scams in America. I believe in profitabilty, but not at the expense of strangling our own country.
Going back to before diesel engines first hit the open market, diesel was being basically given away. Once the oil companies saw that there was demand, they stopped giving it away and began to sell it. Albeit, it was about the cheapest fluid in the US short of river water.
(The same thing happened with lobster, they used to be ground up and used for fertilizer until a taste was developed for them. Still, oil companies have gone way over where lobster prices ((in relation)) have ever gone)
Can we do anything about it today? No. Does that mean that we ignore it and keep electing the same crooks who are all in the same "fraternity"?
I say we take a long look at who is "connected" and begin to break the connections at the voting booths.
If they have to be "connected" in order to serve this country, then they do not need to be there.
 
Supply and demand. When more is used, prices rise. (also strongly influenced by commodities markets)This is a world-wide market, not just the U.S. Unless usage drops or major increses in production, we will never see lasting price reductions. And the oil companies are no more greedy than any other industry or government. They just happen to deal in something we really want/use.
 
True,but to start with put the law back like it was so that paper stocks arent considered to be real stocks.If they dont want to do that,make them take delivery of the billions of barrels they have on paper.When they cant toss them in jail,THEN put the law back to what it was before the crooks took over.Also make the banks pay back 12 or 13 trillion dollars they stole from the taxpayers.
Once fuel is actually back on supply and demand look for gas at around 1.50 a gallon,a recovery,and people back to work.If enough people dont have jobs,make oil companys hire people to pump gas everywhere and pay them decent.Thats the least they can do for robbing us.Also break them up into smaller companys.Even after the crooks took over the stock market,the price of fuel didnt go up much until the last big merger about 5 years ago of the big companys.Bust them back to 25 or 30 companys instead of 5 and never let them get that big again.To keep them that way,if they start fixing prices,bust them smaller.
Now all we need to do is hold the politicians feet to the fire until they do what I said.
 
You need to study this all some more.The stock market is not tied to supply and demand and hasnet been for years.The stock market is artificially high because of speculators calling paper stocks real and thats how they ran up the price of oil which brought up a bunch of other stuff with it,actually everything.
 
An atttiude that either the nnalert or nnalert are the absolute party is like thinking that only one religious denomination will go to Heaven. (although there are still people that are that gullible)
There are good points and bad points to either party. It also depends on the people, of which, we have learned that Bill Clinton was run down for having an affair, affairs are not just reserved for nnalert.
Having just one party is also like a football game with just one team. You may think that your team MUST win or you will be sick for days, but it takes an opposing team to make it happen.
 
In what way is the stock market not controlled by supply and demand? If no one is buying a stock (no demand) the price of that stock will fall. If more people are buying than selling, the stock price will rise. That's the essence of supply and demand, isn't it?
 
Oh I think there is a reason for this high price connected to this president.That is extortion.But I agree with what you say.Yes that time they used Katrina for running it up and it just kept going up.Also like you say about the connected politicians have to go,yes they do!Plus we have been throwing out incumbents and we still get the same crook back in.I know whats wrong is because it takes a fortune to get them elected.That has to stop.States maybe should pass laws that no politicians will take any corporate money or go to jail.They will each only get so much money to spend.Plus run all of the lobbiests out of Washington DC.Just those 2 things would make a big difference.I dont even care to waste my time reading excuses from the politicians.They work for us ,we dont work for them.
I think we could do something about it if everybody was on the same page about all this stuff.
You are right about the scam.Also it seems to be crazy that they would dislike the President,he has hurt them very little,if at all, that I can see.They will have excuses after excuses,but its all so they can make money.The crooks are using us like an ATM machine and I dont see any good guys, wearing white hats, riding in to stop them.So I guess that means that we the people need to fix this or keep on suffering.Another thing that would help is to bust every corporation,especially big oil,down to where they dont have so much power.
 
Supply and demand is the way it worked until about 2002.After then the speculators could buy a paper stock and call it real.All this stock is,is paper,but since they cant get delivery of the oil because its not pumped out of the ground yet,they say its a shortage.That drives up the price to crazy highs as we saw in 2007 and 2008.
All that happened was that they took the restrictions off of the stock market to where they could call a paper stock a real thing.So we need to put that restriction back on the stock market and it will go back to supply and demand.
Also while we are at it,we need to bust the oil companys in to smaller companys so there is competition and end price fixing.That should get the recovery going and people back to work again.Clearly we are in a depression caused by that simple thing of repealing that law on the stock market.Now also NAFTA and CAFTA hurt us bad too and also need repealed.
 
Yep; Global Economy.(GrRrrr)... Would fuel prices be exempt???

Are oil companies Santa Claus or the Grinch?

Was wondering if all of our Alaskan oil is consumed in the USA??

Many folks may have no choice but to park the speed boats and paddle a canoe.

Hope the good people at the TREK bicylce factory in Wisconsin are keeping busy.. I enjoy mine..
 
Great reply!Our problem now is we cant elect people that are any different than the ones we threw out because they all take money to get in.That means that they are all working for the same people,who are buying their way into power,and demanding they do the same favors,on both sides.Meet the New Boss Same as the Old Boss.We dont get fooled again!
 
I'm in MI too and agree about the gas prices but, "no one can afford anything in the stores"? That's what I thought too untill this Christmas season. The people were hauling stuff out like it was free! Went to Cabela's today and it was a feeding frenzy at the gun counter. I agree Mi economy sucks but folks are still finding disposable income somewhere, (not me).
 
Yes, I've been hearing reasons. Both China and India's economies grew at over 10% in 2010. That's enormous growth in countries with over a billion people each.

I don't pretend to understand very well just how speculation works. The one thing I do know is that people make a lot and lose a lot doing it. There is a lot of government regulation there, so I don't know how there could be continued gross criminal acts be committed. I think rrlund made the point that it's not just speculators making money when commodities rise. Many pension funds and mutual funds are invested in those markets. That means grandma and grampa's retiement funds.

There is a lot of oil in the Gulf. Many other countries are producing oil there, I don't think they would be if it weren't a good place to do so. China, Venzuela, Norway, and others wouldn't spend the investment money required to put rigs there if they weren't paying off. So I'm not sure that I agree with you about why we are drilling there. The way I understand it is that it's more expensive drilling offshore than on land, and that makes sense to me. So much land that could produce oil has been closed to drilling by government agencies that oil companies have been forced to go offshore.

I don't pretend to know everything, or even all that much. But I do know that if we produce our own oil we will create hundreds of thousands of jobs, and we will lower the cost, both very good things.

Best to you and yours in the New Year.
 
Just read yours again and had to respond to the Gulf/Bush payoff. Dude, we were drilling in the gulf when Nixon was president, 30 years before he was elected.

Do some research and enlighten me. Find out which is more expensive, drilling on the open sea or on land. I'll be interested to know, because I don't now, I just think I do.
 
Google George Carlins the truth about Wall Street.
Its a big club and you arent in it.Still true and getting worse all the time.
 
The Gulf issue was the recent flap that we needed to open it and Alaska and the East coast because we were running out.
Doesn't seem to be such a hot topic after the oil spill.
 
Complaining about fuel prices is a big waste of forum space.The only way we can affect the price is to stop buying it, that aint gonna happen.
 
While some of the retirement funds are made off an investment in a business that produces a product and are getting a return on how well it sells, a big part is made from stocks and commodities that come strait out of your pocket.
Insurance companies have a slush fund of monies that they're suppose to keep on hand in case something happens and they make billions off it without paying heir customers interest or giving a discount on premiums. If an investment agent gets a 300 million dollar bonus for the year, info from the last bunch to go to jail, who is getting scr@wed out of that money. Obviously it had to come from some where, so you and I pay higher premiums and his clients get a little interest on their investment instead of what they could have received.
 
You said, "Obviously it had to come from some where, so you and I pay higher premiums and his clients get a little interest on their investment instead of what they could have received."

Insurance and investments are two different things, you seem to be describing them as the same thing.

No on is forced to purchase insurance.(Yet). People voluntarily enter contracts because they enjoy the peace of mind they receive for their premium payments. They have a need, (protection and peace of mind), and an insurer provides that at a price that allows them to be profitable. The client must agree that the price is fair, or not purchase then plan. Again, no one is forcing anyone to purchase that policy, the client feels it is a fair transaction.

On the investment side it's the same thing. I've never had anyone come up to me on the street, stick a gun in my ribs, and tell me to give them all my money so they can invest it for me. People freely and by choice choose to give their money to investors that they trust to make their money work for them. Are there unscrupulous people out there, sure, Bernie Madoff. But he is not the typical broker. His clients should've known the returns he was promising were too good to be true, as they turned out to be. So, as you have been fond of saying in the past, peoples' greed got the best of them. Rather than invest in safe, secure, traditional investments, they wanted to make fast easy bucks, and look what it got them. I would say the market worked in that case. People that tried to game the system got burned.

The man you pay your premiums to isn't the one selling investments. Why don't you go down to your local Mutual Fund guy and have a sit down. I bet you would find him to be honest and helpful, and you might understand all of this a little bit better.

I'm just sayin.
 
May be wrong but I don't think Insurance and investments are two different things. Both receive investor money and try to turn a profit for their investors while skimming an unrealistic amount off of it.
(No on is forced to purchase insurance) I disagree with this statement. Of course nobodies holding a gun to you, but try to own and drive a vehicle, own a house, or get decent care at a medical facility and tell me how there isn't an implied gun held to you. Tell me how long you could drive around without insurance, and no an Amish buggy is not a realistic answer to transportation.
The amount I quoted for a yearly bonus may have been an extreme example but when they say the securities and exchange watch dogs are waiting to move to one of these lucrative positions and is said that the secretaries are entitled to their 100k a year it sorta proves to me these people make that much and you and I pay for it.
 
Yes, I have auto insurance. I shopped around and found the best deal I could, one that I thought was reasonable. I pay just under a grand a year for full coverage, and a little exrta for commercial liability coverage for the delivery thing. I had quotes from over $2,000 to just a little lower than the one I choose. A lot of competition in that industry. Lots of companies working to get my buisness. The one I choose actually came down a little on price to be more competitive. So as the consumer do I feel like I got a fair deal. Absolutely. Did anyone take advantage of my need to have insurance? Not that I can tell. They simply fulfilled my need. Supply and demand.

But if I felt strongly enough that it was impossible for me to purchase insurance at a fair price, (which I don't), I would do something else. I could move to NYC and walk and ride subways like millions of people there do. Or I could move down south and get a home close to where I worked and not need a car either. There are options, again, if you feel strongly enough. Just being poor, like me, and thinking things costs too much so someone's taking advantage of me isn't reality. Like I've said in the past, I made choices that I now have to live with. I should've gone to college. I could've stayed in the Navy until retirement, (at age 38!!). But I choose a different path. No one choose it for me, so I'm not looking to blame The Man, the Government, or anyone else for my less than stellar performance thus far. I still think I'll do ok in the end.

Don't let the class warfare kooks beat you. When did we all become entitled to have all the same things everyone has? Prior to WWII most people lived on farms and had very little. So was it after the war that all of a sudden we were supposed to have everything the Rockefellers had? Was it the 60's, the 80's? I didn't know it ever happened at all. The media and other certain groups push it in our faces, try to make us envious and jealous of those who have more. But if you follow that line of reasoning, all the third world countries could look at us and say "Hey, you have so much, you must have taken it from me!". Nope, I don't buy into any of that. I have never taken anything from anyone, and my country has helped more people in the world than every other country combined.

Government, nor any other entity, can guarantee outcomes in life. The best, and only thing they should do, is to make certain everyone has an equal opportunity. What people make of it is there own reward or consequence.

I'm 44 and going back to school. I get a degree and maybe make six figures before I'm all done. You could do the same. And you know what? Then your whole perspective changes.
 
Come on man. Do just a little research, as easy as a google search, show us where you're getting your information. I'm not challenging you, I'd like to know where you're getting these facts so that I can judge them for myself, that's all. If what you're saying is true I'd like to know, might change my mind.

I humbly stated previously that I certainly don't know all there is to know about this stuff, but cannot believe there is mass corruption across the board as you say. Many people every year are indicted and sent to prision for insider trading and other infractions. Show me that all the rest, or a great majority of the rest, are cheating.

No offense, but just because John Stewart, the actor/comedian, says it, doesn't make it so. Likewise, when a source on the right says it, I don't just take it for granted either. I want to see reports, articles, who writes them, how they lean, who they work for, and what their agenda might, be so that I can weigh those factors and be better able to know what's right and what might be propaganda, by either side.

So, while it may surprise you, I don't just listen to Rush and that's the end of it. I go online and find additional sources, original sources, etc.. I think if you started doing the same some of your opinions may change. It's a hard thing to face, that some of the opinions we've held for a long time might be wrong. I know I've had to do often enough.

I'm just sayin.
 
Looks like your NY option is just trading one expense for another and based on the higher expenses in NY you might pay more than you are now, just not buying insurance.
To think and believe things are wrong in the world and can't be changed doesn't affect me. I don't think having more or advanced degrees would change an outlook of what appears to be obvious that I pay for people without insurances and for other people to line their pockets by higher costs to me.
I believe liability car insurance should be set by the Gov.. and be one price across the nation because I'm forced to buy it and only the options, like full coverage, boats, etc should be a negotiated price.
 
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