partsman vs. ford engineers

any other partsmen have trouble with ford parts? after 30 plus years it is getting worse for me.for example( i don't remember the exact year) late 80's ford pick up fuel pump for the 300 6 cyl...plastic or steel tank, forward or aft tank, wheelbase ..etc. about 6 months ago a guy called on an ecm for his 98 taurus. he knew it was the 3.0 but didn't know if it was dohc or ohv. i had 23 choices. he called back and said it was the ohv..that narrowed it down to 7 choices..to find the correct ecm i needed not only the oe# on ecm but also a calibration code.
yesterday i get a call from a lady wanting a brake rotor for a 99 ford ranger. she knew that it was a 2 wheel drive. i always try to get as much information as possible about the vehicle because i want to get my customers the right part the first time. well, on this ranger i needed to know 2 wheel or 4 wheel anti lock brakes,torsion bar or coil spring suspension, gasoline or flex fuel, and 10 9/32 or 11.28 diameter rotor. after i asked about 2 or 4 wheel anti lock brakes she told me (again) that it was a 2 wheel drive. i told her i knew that but needed to know about the abs and several other things. she proceeded to holler (i assume at her husband, but also in my right ear) asking about the abs. i figured he would have to go look so i told her hold on i need to know some more things. she told me i had an attitude and hung up on me. thank you ford engineers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

I no longer drive Ford or Chrysler for some of those exact reasons!

I can really relate to your frustrations. We did automotive and light truck repair for close to 15 years as kindly a sideline in my business. Had 1 full time mechanic. The parts situation got progressively worse with serial number breaks in the middle of the year,GVW ratings, trying to find parts numbers on the old rusty parts and it goes on and on.Customers wanting to pay less than flat rate to get it fixed. When my last mechanic decided to quit a while back I said enough is enough. No more automotive work. We now only work on tractors and heavy equipment.

napaguy,
My hat is off to you. The insane parts situation is caused by three things. First, the car companys are on a tear to eliminate the aftermarket. Care sales are a break even effort. All the profit comes from the service bay. The dealers can answer all of those hard questions, but they will never tell the aftermarket.

Second, outfits like the one you work for are getting worse too. NAPA is a small cog in a company called Genuine Parts Company. They also own Motion Industries and a few other operations. I have had to bypass my NAPA jobber, and Motion too, for several years because common parts are just no longer available.

Finally, I never call my local NAPA jobber with a parts request. I call them with a list of numbers. My blood pressure rises when I call up and ask for twenty #CS1504, a case of #1115 filters, and one #IC5500 coil. The standard response is "What does that fit?" I get the third degree on my parts needs.

Almost all of the old timers that once manned the counter are gone. One person now owns all of the NAPAs for a hundred miles, in any direction. If you are still dealing with this mess after thirty years; I would have tossed in the towel long ago. The biggest problem is above you. Have you ever dealt with Gates, Wix, or Echlin? All of the suppliers are run by MBAs that do not even know what they produce. I want to buy product by the case but they do not even know that they produce what I want. They are all just bone headed and they try to squeeze the maximum profit from every angle. Echlin makes almost all of those Ford electrical products and they also sell them to NAPA. They try to keep it quiet so they can move product in the most profitable manner.

When you go home; forget about those idiots as soon as you walk to your car. Life is too short to bother with lawyers, MBAs, politicians, and other assorted thieves.

Charlie

Not exclusive to Ford or Chryslers either. My nephew has an early model year GM truck that has an oil filter that the books say shouldn't belong on there, but had it on the previous year trucks. It was a PITA when we did the first oil change.......25 miles from the nearest parts store. Yea, he had dropped the oil and filter without looking at the filter that the parts man had given him.

Thank the feds.

Dean, former GM design engineer

Years ago I worked behind parts counter...people would think they were smart....gotta XX 350 and need XXX for it.

OK....is that a FORD TRUCK or a GM motor you are working on?? etc. etc. etc. and I got chewed out by boss cause guy stormed outta the store PO'd at me. I was NOT a mind reader...GGGRRRRRR!!

And parts are NOT "all the same"...even back then!!

I think it's more of a computer programmer problem & the parts man expecting it to be correct than anything else. Knowing what you want or having the part number doesn't seem to matter.

A couple of years ago I got just as irritated as your customer at one of my local NAPA stores. All I wanted was a dimmer switch for my 81 F100. Engine size? Doesn't matter. Transmission? Doesn't matter. 2 wheel drive or 4 wheel drive? Doesn't matter. AC? Doesn't matter. Power steering? Doesn't matter. power brakes? Doesn't matter. Frustrated, I finally just told the parts guy that it was the same dimmer switch that Ford had used on every truck and car it had built for the last 40 years. There is only one! Old parts guy's just click through the junk screen's as they have learned the part they are after will be the same in the end. Newer stuff is harder, but a good old parts man is still priceless!

its just a sign of the times same in farm equipment and automotive eveyone want there own specal car tractor so you end up with 100 different models. ues to be i could care one or two fuel filter in my truck not anymore i dont even keep them now to many differnt ones.

Sadly the same thing holds true for off road equipment whether it's used in agriculture or construction. As one response stated it stems, to some degree, from the OEM trying to cut off the aftermarket. Still I think the majority of the problem comes from two other areas. One is that the OEM's offer up so many different options nowdays that it's all but impossible to put all of them on one vehicle without effecting something else. In other words if you get option X the vehicle needs different brakes, if you get option X and Y together then it needs both different brakes and a different suspension to handle option Y. Then if you get X, Y, and Z together then you need a still another brake and suspension design and some other change to handle option Z.....and on and on and on.

The second thing is that the OEM's source parts from where ever they can get them the cheapest, quickest, or simply on time for a specific assembly line schedule. For instance I was looking Friday for a 4.6 liter engine for a '98 F150 pickup. From my understanding there are 4 different choices for the 'same' engine. There is a 4.6 Windsor (VIN code 6) with either a 6 or 8 bolt flywheel and a 4.6 Romeo (VIN code w) with a 6 or 8 bolt flywheel. The VIN code part is no problem to figure out but after calling nearly a dozen different places that specilize in nothing but used and rebuilt engines nobody was able to tell me how to know whether the engine is a 6 or 8 bolt on the flywheel without having the engine out. Funny thing though it really doesn't matter as long as whichever engine you get has a flywheel attached as either will fit.

When you take both of these things and add them together, and then throw in the fact these parts are often asked for by people who have no idea what they need the part for, or what they really want, yet expect to be told what they need, then you wind up with exactly the situation finding parts talked about...A NIGHTMARE.....

I've found out it's more of a problem with the parts books than it is the ford engineers. You ask 15 questions about the vehicle and when you're done the same part number comes up for all the different vehicles. I need an alternator for a 1980 chevy pickup. Is that two wheel drive or 4 wheel drive? Does it have tilt wheel and cruise? 3.73 or 4.10 gear ratio? Manual or automatic transmission? Sliding rear window? Were you born in the USA? Whats your mothers maiden name? After all that the same alternator comes up that fits 100 models of trucks for the last 15 years. They should just have a PART NUMBER on the alternator I can give you and have it done with.

Napaguy, I assume by your handle that you are a NAPA counterman. It seems that a GM, Mopar or Ford partsman can pick a lot of this info from the car's VIN number. Do the NAPA books help you in that way, or do they rely only on the customer knowing what they have ?

My feeling is that a lot of these problems could be avoided if the car owner would try to collect as much info (VIN #, make, model, year, casting # part # etc.) and have it ready when the partsman needs it.
Also I have learned to stay calm and work with the parts guy as much as possible. Have as much info avalible as possible, and if while pawing through the parts book or computer, he asks you the same question four times, you give him a straight answer four times without an attitude or change of tone.
Anything you can do to make his day easier will make yours easier too.

thats why i drive a Dodge ya just don't need any parts

That is the truth, I always tell them the year and make and color 1st. New guys at the counter can't figure it out if it isn't in the book. Went in for
points for a Kholer once new guy started the 20 questions, and decided they didn't have the points meanwhile the old guy who had heard the conservation and was going in the back to get parts for another customer came back with the points.

After a career as a dealership parts man and manager, I can say that the biggest problem/advantage is the new computerized parts cataloging systems. Because of the way the manufacturers build the vehicles, it IS possible that a certain year Ranger can have EITHER 2-wheel or 4-wheel ABS...and if you have the correct manufacturer-specific parts software, the VIN will tell you which that vehicle has. Without the software, you're only guessing.

That allows the dealer to get rid of the better-paid, more-experienced counterpersons, and replace them with lowest-common-denominator, minimum-wage psuedo-counterpersons if they can type in the VIN correctly. Dealers can then cut overhead, and with almost all manufacturers now offering dealers free overnight delivery on certain classes of parts, dealers can also cut inventory to the bone...also saving dollars.

So there IS a method to their madness...but at the expense of jobs, and and at the cost of customer consternation about having to answer so many questions when dealing with an aftermarket parts seller. And NO, it DOESN'T help that so many aftermarket parts programs ask superfluous questions like whether or not the vehicle has cruise control when trying to determine what wiper blades fit a particular vehicle [I'm thinking about my last AutoZone experience here].

So don't blame Ford; blame the people who write your parts software for not connecting with a VIN database like the OEM's do.

When I had my FedEx Home Delivery truck, I carried the VIN in my wallet! Seemed even lug nuts, at the Freightliner counter, needed the VIN to get it right! Greg

some where along the line someone must have replaced housing for oil filter on my massey 333.
i went to napa store told them what i needed went home changed oil and filter and saw new filter and old one didn't look the same.
so back to napa i go with the old filter oh yea we can get that filter but it will cost more money.
new filter cost about 25 dollars ouch!

being this complicated is one of the reasons i will never ,ever, buy a new vehicle of any type, besides they all look alike , and the styling is, well, flat missing, i keep my old paid for for years trucks, for a new one i got my eye on a restored 1953 chevy, its all new with improvements, [ 383 stroker, automatic and power brakes] just cant convince the owner he doesnt need it now---yet