Hired Hands

Flurette Farm · Jan 22, 2010

I’ve hired a local man several times to do various jobs based on recommendations from my neighbors who use him. He is known for having good work ethics and is always on time. He is the kind of person you can give a job and you never have to go and look to see if he’s working or how the job will be done after you tell him what you need.
He works by the hour and you furnish everything. When he’s done you ask him for his hours and he’s always honest about it. I normally give him a dollar or two above his quoted hourly rate depending on the job.
The problem is my tools disappear (never to return) when he goes home. Not everything, just one or two each time. How do you guys deal with something like this?
I’m not asking for advice from you guys that always want to shoot everybody and have never shot anyone but, from reasonable people who have been faced with similar circumstances. Thanks.

jhilyer · Jan 22, 2010

He's stealing! Never use him again! That's how you deal with it.

You can't confront him; he would just deny it and then it would be akward.

But make sure you know it's him before you make any decisions. Maybe he's just putting them back someplace else.

rrlund · Jan 22, 2010

Yea,the most subtle way is just to ask "have you seen that....." whatever it is that's missing. Do that everytime you notice something is missing. At the very least,he'll know that you're noticing.

JML755 · Jan 22, 2010

I agree with jhilyer. If you continue to use him, then it's the old saying "S---w me once, shame on you, s---w me twice, shame on me". You may be surprised if you ask him about specific tools. He may say, "oh yeah, I ended up with that in my truck and couldn't remember which customer I borrowed it from". Never hurts to ask, but be prepared for a shrug of the shoulders in which case, he'd have lost a customer if it was me.

Sean Feeney · Jan 22, 2010

When you go to pay him square up with him by deducting the cost of the missing tools he lost or stole.

showcrop · Jan 22, 2010

I have had the gamut of different types work for me over thirty years. I believe different types of people require different ways of addressing problems, at least in a small business. You don't want to be cutting off your nose to spite your face. You are obviously happy with him otherwise and good help is very hard to find. I suggest making him aware of the situation by asking casually about the most recent tool missing and make your decision based on his response.

RodinNS · Jan 22, 2010

Just ask him... 'have you seen this, or that, or whatever is missing....'
Mabey it's an honest sort of thing. Mabey not.
The only solution, if he denies knowing anything is to keep him away from the place. You don't need that kind of crap going on.
Now... if he was coming back at night and stealing stuff, that would be a different matter...

Rod

tjdub · Jan 22, 2010

I would want to be sure that he was really stealing tools and not just putting them back in the wrong place. Assuming that he might be actually using your tools on your equipment that is. All I can say is that if I was a hired hand, my Dad would have definitely called the Sheriff and pressed charges against me for stealing tools when I was growing up.

Spook · Jan 22, 2010

I agree. I've hired a couple of guys here, and I was a supervisor a GM for awhile. Some people just take more monitoring than others. Nobody is perfect, and a lot of folks are "situationally honest" - they are as honest as the their situation calls for. If he is a good worker otherwise, just watch your tools around him. I thought I was missing a couple of items a few years ago, turned out I'd left it in another barn.

thurlow · Jan 22, 2010

I had a couple of guys over the years who were thieves; CAN'T ABIDE A THIEF!!! As a farmer and with all the activity going on........ people in and out of the shop; changing equipment, working on equipment, it was totally impossible to monitor anyone's actions. Personally, I don't think it'd do any good to confront him; he's a THIEF!!!! I'd put him on the road permanently.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 22, 2010

An honest mistake would have happened once, stealing would happen every time you use him. If you're happy with the work and wage you pay him then just have him sign out the tools he uses and then he will be aware you are keeping an eye on your tools. If he is stealing them it will stop or he will stop working for you.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 22, 2010

For $25.00 you can buy a security camera @ Wal-Mart---explain to him someone is stealing your tools and you need him to help you install the camera.

Explain you are missing these tools and you need his help finding out where they are, and who is reponsable before you call the law.

Gun guru · Jan 22, 2010

Lock up the stuff.

Walterdavies · Jan 22, 2010

Two of the best workers that I had were ex-cons they worked hard you could trust them to do what you told them and I never lost anything. The only problem was when I would call them back they would be back in jail for Parole violations.
The last time I hired one he showed up with a pistol in his pocket, never called him again.

The worst helpers were Kids from town they were out of shape and couldn't add 2 and 2 and come up with 5 I would ask how bales on that wagon and they would spend an hour trying to count them instead of counting down one side and the end and multiplying. to get the answer.

I don't know what they teach in school these days but I'm sure they don't teach practical math.

Anyway its getting harder to find good help that one can trust. If the tools are old and not expensive then just forget it , maybe mention something about missing tools he could have just put them down and forgot them.
Walt

Bill in IL · Jan 22, 2010

Make up an inventory of what you hand out to him. Then you will know what you need to get back. You can always downplay it and say you are getting older and more forgetful and need to keep track of things on paper.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 22, 2010

He could have put them in his pocket and just forgot about them. If you are absolutely positive he took a specific tool or it is missing after he used it, Just ask something like; Did you use the 1/2" ratchet with the 3/4" deep socket to adjust those springs yesterday? I wanted to tighten them a little more but couldn't find the deep socket. That way you're not accussing him and maybe he did put it in a different place than you normally do. If you know for sure he used it and he totally denies it, then I wouldn't have him back. My sister fired her only employee after a couple years because the employee denied taking $5 out of the till and my sister knew for sure she took it for lunch money. Sad thing if she had told my sister she didn't have lunch money, my sister would have gladly borrowed her $5 or maybe just bought her lunch. The employee would have still had a job if she has just said she took the $5 to get some lunch and was going to replace it. She totally denied it and my sister couldn't trust her anymore. Dave

stan jefferies · Jan 22, 2010

this is a lose lose really, if you mention this to him or make him sign tools out and no more of them go missing I guess this means hes a theif, if he shrugs it off hes probably hiding something, and if he storms off then I guess hes a theif here too. But at least make sure he hasnt just misplaced them, Ive taken wrenches from tractors and put them in the baler and what not, but I get the feeling you are losing tools out of your shop, now Ive never been in such a hurry as to work in the shop fix my problem then throw the tool in the tractor toolbox. Call another customer and see what they think.

tlak · Jan 22, 2010

Paint all your tools pink or put them all on a shadow board.

tlak · Jan 22, 2010

Or hire him one date to clean and list all your tools.

davpal · Jan 22, 2010

Well since you can"t rehabilitate a thief I guess you have to decide if a "handy thief" is worth hiring at your place. You can look the other way and consider it his christmas bonus or you can never call him to come back. I wouldn"t hire him for anything.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 22, 2010

Be sure you're right, then tell him straight out that you are missing tools and ask if he can help you locate them. Maybe he's not dishonest but just forgetful. My neighbor just brought back a socket and ratchet that I loaned him a year or so ago. Was so proud that he remembered to bring it back and sorry it had taken so long. Not a word was said about the half box full of other stuff he has from me. I'll go borrow them back someday..

If that don't work, JUST SHOOT HIM and hang a thief sign on his neck before hanging him from the garage rafters :roll:

I'd way the cost of a few tools against the stress of finding reliable help also.

Dave

Cas · Jan 22, 2010

I had this problem for years in my shop and
yard for years. I bought a decent cctv security
system with a dvr and monitor. I put it in this
past August and I have not even lost a screw driver since then. It has already paid for itself. Right now I record 4 cameras and might
add 2 more in the summer.

Cas · Jan 22, 2010

I had this problem for years in my shop and
yard for years. I bought a decent cctv security
system with a dvr and monitor. I put it in this
past August and I have not even lost a screw driver since then. It has already paid for itself. Right now I record 4 cameras and might
add 2 more in the summer.

MarkB_MI · Jan 22, 2010

I've had a couple of contractors who would borrow my tools and take them home. They always returned the tools and apologized when I mentioned I was missing something. One of them did it often enough that he'll never work at my home again. For the other one, I'm sure it was an honest mistake and he still does work for me.

kyplowboy · Jan 22, 2010

I'd just start asking him, call him and say "hey, I can't seem to find my (insert tool name here), I have not seen it since you were at the house last week. You didn' happen to see where I left it did you?"

I have a buddy who paints all his tool, power or hand bright pink. I mean the neon marker paint pink. Seems to keep the legs from growing.

Dave

Flurette Farm · Jan 22, 2010

I really appreciate all the good and reasonable responses you guys have given. I guess I should have made it plain this guy isn’t just a handy man. He puts up fence, runs electrical lines, installs remote stock tanks and watering systems or whatever may be required for any farm or ranch.
I can stand the looses I just hate to not be able to trust someone. However impact wenches, power drills and saws are hard to put in your pocket and forget. Hand tools I do it all the time.
I do think I’ll use a combination of your suggestions.
1. I’ll have him inventory all the tools.
2. I’ll have him mark with paint (yellow or orange) all items.(so we can find them in the undergrowth)
3. I’ll ask he if he remembers were “we” left the larger items when we working on whatever.
Thanks again.

barn E · Jan 22, 2010

That's his tool allowance. I had one when an apprentice. Like 50 bucks every six months. Wait till he wants a raise and tell him take another tool. See if he flinches. Dave

kyhayman · Jan 22, 2010

I did that today with a GPS unit. Amazingly I found out where it was.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 22, 2010

Yeah, I have an uncle I have to do that with all the time. He don't mean noth'n by it and I don't care if he bums stuff. Any time I can't find something I will call him and ask if he know's where I left my chain saw or what ever. Every time it's the same story, oh crap I came and got that last week and forgot to bring it back, will get it to you right away. Good thing he lives next door.

Dave

Bob · Jan 22, 2010

Simple.

Lock up your tools and let him provide his own. Didn't think of that, did you;=)

Anonymous-0 · Jan 23, 2010

You should at least be there when he does the inventory. What if you've got more than one of something? He might be wondering why the tool inventory and marking them all of a sudden. Dave

Anonymous-0 · Jan 23, 2010

Don't give him the dollar over his quoted hourly rate, the missing tools will compensate[if you are sure he takes them ].I would be inclined to paint them, there is a subtle message there now that he has been working for you.

Anonymous-0 · Jan 23, 2010

Lay them on a piece of plywood and paint them all. When he comes in say use these tools and lock other ones up..When pay time comes look at plywood..

MAY GOD BLESS THE USA

Anonymous-0 · Jan 23, 2010

I was reading this topic, thinking about smaller hand tools: screw drivers, wrenches, pliars, etc. In your second post below, you talk about impact wrench, drill, saw. This is a whole different topic altogether. If he took your large power tools, then stand up like man and get them back from him. Then tell him you do not permit your tools to leave without your approval. Tell him you want to continue your working relationship with him, but no more tools waling off. Tom

BDT in Minnesota · Jan 23, 2010

impact wrenches, power drills and saws!! misplaced???? Where??, I would be asking him where he left them......

Sounds like you hired a fox to guard the hen house...

How many gallons of paint, rolls of barbed wire, plumbing supplies, gasoline, engine oil, machinery parts.......Some stuff that you may not miss for a few years..

So far, you have only noticed the tools???

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