Back stabbing sales practices from mechanics

Pep Boys is having a sale on tires right now; and since the wife's car needs some tires I figured I would take it down this morning and get a new set put on.

After removing the tires from the car the salesman tells me the mechanic recommends new shocks and a front end alignment also. Since the car only has 45,000 miles on it I want to see the tires and ask the mechanic why he thinks I need these extra services.

Mechanic says........
Right rear tire is cupping all the way across the tire so that means shocks need replacing.

The shock looks good with no leaking or other signs it is bad; Only one tire is cupping like this; and car only has 45,000 miles so I ask him if he is sure the shock is bad or could the problem be this one tire was run out of balance.

Mechanic now back tracks and says cupping COULD be caused by worn shock but he was not sure what the real problem was.

So lets look at the front tires now.
Outer edge of both front tires has a VERY slight cupping or odd wear. This means the front end is out of align.
I look at both tires and point out that all 4 groves are wore to the wear markers but none of the groves are wore down bald to where no grove is visible. This tells me that both front tires have worn to within 1/16 to 1/8 of a inch across the whole tire over 45,000 miles. Could this edge wear be caused by hard cornering. Knowing that the tires have never been rotated I feel this is pretty good wear so I ask him if he thinks he is a good enough mechanic to adjust the front end better than it is right now.

Please just put the tires on so I can get out of here.

I really hate when a shop tries to sell me some service I do not really need; but I love seeing their face once they find out I know more than their young punk want to be mechanic knows.

I wish I could take my car in for service JUST ONCE and have the problem fixed right the first time and not have to weed threw all the sales pitch for stuff I do not need.

Many of those mechanics get commission on any parts and labor they can sell you.

Edge wear is caused by not enough air pressure.

Since the edge wear is only on the out side of the front tires and none on the inside; and the car is equipted with TPMS I have to assume the pressure was right in the tires.

Our local NAPA store also has a good sized service department. I've worked with most of the techs at one time or other over the years, and have taken them a lot of legitimate business.

It shocked the heck out of me several months ago when my wife took her Chrysler T&C in for an oil change and the owner tried to pull what amounted to a flat out scam on her. He told her the tires were worn past the wear markers, the outer tie rod ends were loose and needed replacing, and said if they replaced the tie rod ends they'd have to do a four wheel alignment. He estimated $1200. My wife left the place wondering if the van was safe to drive home.

I checked it myself and the worst place I could find on the tires was still 40%, the tie rod ends were as tight as new, and even if you did replace the tie rod ends you normally just check the toe-in, a full four wheel alignment is not called for.

My wife still has oil changes done there, but I told the guys in the shop that unless I ran into a situation where they had the only game in town, I would no longer do business there, and I told them why. I know these guys, and if they start losing money because their boss is pulling scams, they'll straighten HIM out in a hurry.

neighbors wife took her car for new tires.
she was told she needed brakes as well as the brakes were so bad she shouldn't drive car home.
about 6 months to a year later brakes weren't working very well. took it to neighborhood mechinic and the brakes were shot! they had been installed wrong!

You have the advantage over the mechanic at places Pep Boys because you know how your car is driven and how it's maintained. He just knows he gets paid to do what he's told. Sometimes it's the service writer who tries to oversell, moreso than the mechanic. So did the MECHANIC try to sell you the work, or did the snake-oil-pushing service writer...who, once he discovered you knew something about these things, managed to throw the mechanic under the bus?

The service writer is DEFINITELY on commission. The mechanic might or might not be. Most places, service writers get a percentage on both labor AND parts; many mechanics are paid flat rate, and only get incentives if the shop manager puts a "spiff" on certain service procedures or parts sold. So I tend to think you're likely pulling your trigger on the wrong target.

Hello john ln la,
If the ouside threads are cupping, it is a sign of low air pressure. The tires squat too much and they cup just the way yours did.
Now that you have new tires, would not be a bad idea to have the front end checked.
Sometimes, new vehicle's front ends are off,just enough to make the tires wear out unevenly, right off the assembly line.
If only one tire is cupping, provided it has been in the same position, you may have a bad shock. The shock will look just like the others.
The valving can fail internally,and then the shock will not provide the proper dampening to the suspension. The rebound bumpers in the car will tell you the story. If the shock is bad the rebound bumper may have a lot of wear in comparison to the other side. If the shock is
BAD the bumper may be gone. So there are ways
to diagnose your problem, if you have any.
I'm betting that all is well.
Guido.

Hello john,
Check the tires with a gauge you know to be accurate. The % allowed for low tire pressure at the dash board are not close enough to prevent the cupping you describe. I believe that is 20% before you get an alarm. Anything more the 5 % you got cupping coming down the road.
Tire gauges are cheap, and if you need to buy one, get a name brand from a company that makes tire valves.
Guido.

If you look on the walls of any shop that sells tires there are posters with pictures of how a tire wears and the cause of that wear. You description of your tires indicate bad shocks, low air pressure and possibly camber adjustment.

Low air pressure is unexcusable.

I look at my tires everyday before I get in the vehicle and check the air pressure at every oil change. I change the oil every 2-3K miles.

If you got 45,000 miles out of your tires that's darn good. The tires that come on the vehicle from the factory are usually a much fresher tire than the ones you can buy at local tire dealer. Older tires wear much faster. Just pull you 5 year old spare out and put it on and run it and see how long it lasts.

I used to work at a tire place many years ago. We all worked on commision. Boss was a snake, used to scare old lady terrible. Every time a car came in it seemed to need $600-$800 worth of work. Most was a joke. thats how these places live.

The last time I went to get my car inspected at a Sears Auto Center (last, meaning I never went back) they told me it needed a front end alignment. When I asked what made them think so, they said uneven tire wear. I suggested it was remarkable that they could see uneven tire wear on a set of tires I had bought that same week and had driven less then a hundred miles.

Yea, that's the name of their game. It's fairly unusal for them to try that on a male, but quit common for them to pull it on a female although I know a few women that know as much if not more than I do when it comes to automobiles.

I resolved the problem you mention, the last two sets of tires I purchased (one set at Pep Boys, last set at Discount Tire) I pulled the wheels off and that's all they get. 4 wheels, 4 tires. I drop them off in the AM, pick them up in the PM. A little more effort on my behalf, but my blood pressure stays steady!

A family friend of mine is a nice guy that is a little slow from an army injury.He took his wifes car in for an oil change and they sold him 4 new high priced tires.The car had 20000 miles.

My question is why don't you find a good mechanic that you trust and stick with him.

Price shoppers and folks that don't look after their cars are the problem,,, their are good trustworthy mechanics out their.

At this time I don't see a fought with the Pep-Bo mechanic recommendation,,,, their is a problem,,, mite just be your lack of maintenance,, are a bad shock,,, just cuzz it does not leak does not mean it could not be bad.

Now yer car has 4 new shoes,,, you mite want to keep a eye on your investment,, but if you don't have the time you can put the blame on someone else who has never seen the car before

Had one of there experiences a some time age. Took my jeep into a Goodyear tire store for a set of tires. I had noticed a slight ticking noise in the right rear wheel when brakeing. so I asked then to check it out. A clip that held the shoes on had broken, allowing the shoe to come out just far enough to tic a small pimple of rust in the drum. easily seen. they tryed to tell me the ticking noise was the chain in the transfer case, and if I didn't replace it right away, ($400) it would breake and ruin the entire case. never went back there. but put 120,000 more miles on that jeep and transfer case. Sold it to a college student. Still see it on the road now and then.

Here's a few from a w/shop manual. does yours fit into any category?

abnormal wear on both sides of tread.
" " in centre of tread.
" " on inside of tyres.
" " on outside of tread.
Lightly worn spots at centre of tread.
heel and toe wear. [sawtooth effect]
feathered edge on one side of tread pattern.
flat spot at centre of tread.
spotty or irregular wear.

I am not trying to be mean, but it sounds like you don't trust this store, so why do you go to it? As knowledgeable as you sound about cars, I would think you could find a reputable mechanic that sells tires, so you would not have to worry about what it is they are trying to upsell to you.

Sometimes I just wish I could find a competent mechanic. I hate having to take a vehicle back 3 or 4 times to get stuff adjusted that should've been fixed and tested the first time around.

Just for information:.

There is no original equipment shock with 50,000 miles on it that is doing what needs to be done to give the designed ride and handling. None.

OEM shocks are marginal at best when new.

A local Chevy dealer has the best prices around
on oil and filter changes, but always trying to
scam me into getting things that I don't need.
I feel sorry for the little old ladies that fall
for their tricks.

We quit going to pep boys years ago. Sales people were clueless.

If you added all the fingers and toes together of all the people on this board, it wouldn't add up to how many times a man tried to put something over on me because I was a woman. I'm not being ugly, its seems to be an unfortunate fact of life.

Just glad I was "daddy's girl" and grew up helping him with the cars and anything else that needed doing.

Never did like working on cars. If I needed the wife's car fixed, I always took it to the best wrench I knew for the work that needed done. Biggest problem anymore is the older, experienced mechanics that used common sense are retiring. Seems like a lot of the younger ones coming out of trade schools (under 30)are being taught bad habits from the big box shops (Pep Boys / Sears)who are ALWAYS out to improve their bottom line. This, to me, has never meant the best service or value tyo the consumer.

I very seldom take my car to any shop. I do all my own mantinence myself such as oil changes. The car is still under warrenty so IF it needs any thing it would go back to the dealer. And both my cars are Toyota (pickup with 125,000 and car with 45,000 miles) so neither have had a need for a mechanic in the past.

The only time I look for a shop is tires or things I can not do such as a alignment. This place had a sale of buy 3 tires get the 4th free so I tried them.

I will get over it by the next time I need tires; and may even go back to this same place if they have the right price on the brand tire I want but I know enough to only get the tires and nothing else.

In May of '98 I bought a used '97 full size Dodge cargo van. It had 147,000 miles on it already! They told me it had a new tranny in it because our local (bought out all the competition) transmission shop had changed the fluid, but left it 4 quarts low. So, when I get it, it is slow going into reverse-forward was fine. Went to the seller to get her new transmission paperwork, then went to the shop. Immediately, it was diagnosed (without any testing) as needing a new transmission. I said that was interesting, as it had a new one in it from 3 months ago, and I had the papers to prove it! All of a sudden, we can fix it. Turns out, you can add a pressure boosting pump in these, and that is all it needed! Greg

That mechanic slipped up, he shoulda squirted a little oil on the shocks, to convince you! That's what pep boys does around here!