Bye-Bye Retirement!

Thanks to all the advice I have gotten on this YT forum - but I'm kinda frustrated (MAD) as my retirement fund keeps slipping into the Pacific and/or Atlantic oceans - and others.
I don't care if you are Repub or Dem, it just seems like our "system" is broken and nobody knows how to fix it.
Glad I have some firewood for this winter and 1 deer in the freezer. Hope, I don't have to sell a tractor to servive - Ie WALMART

Jim Peoria, IL

I wonder how many financial advisors feel like they need body guards?

Funny things happen when nominal regulations are removed in the name of capitalizm. An ethics race to the bottom sucks everything dry. They leverage everything then also sucks that dry making recovery imposible. My tractor needs rear tires.

Sooooo, That's why he doesn't come around anymore. He was here last October when the market was around 14,000. I think he is still getting his percentage. (DUH)!

Damn scary. My father is caught in the middle of it all as he is getting ready to retire, and this is PARTICULARLY a bad time for him.

It pisses me off beyond recognition.

One of the problems is that all these sleze balls who have mismanaged us into this mess are too far removed form the people. If it was 100 or more years ago, the people would have grabbed the suckers and tarred and feathered them as the came out of the bank on the way home. But now nobody even knows what they look like, never mind do anything to them. They do what they think they can get away with. Like the car company CEOs flying to Washington each in their own jets. Now I can see it both ways for the car companies, they made what sold, but on the other hand when they say they are broke and then do this shi*. And if they go bankrupt?? Will they still keep on as before, but without much of the dept that the bankruptsy court erases for them? They are important if for no other reason than they employ thousands of people, we can't forget that.

I think the system is broken. 401K plans were never intended to replace pensions, companies just promoted that to avoid paying more money out to employees. The last financial planner I talked to was putting his money into real estate, even when he was trying to get me to invest in REIT's. Stupid. The wall street guys make money anyway. The AIG thing really gets me - selling insurance without the assets to back it up should be a felony, not a reason for a government bailout.

Everybody's bailing out now to avoid the future capital gains tax. I know 4 landowners that are frantically trying to sell this year to avoid president elects increase.

It was illegal before the deregulation.

I think no one knows what B.O. is going to do, has a lot to do with the falling economy. Don't blame me I voted for the other guy. Stan

Circus... I like your comment about your tractor needing rear tires... mine does too!!

When I checked on a new set of Firestone's last fall, they told me the reason they'd doubled in price was because oil had gone up so much.

I wonder if they'll drop prices back down now that oil is cheaper again? Let's just say I won't be holding my breath

Actually, 401(k)'s WERE sold to both employers AND employees as a replacement for conventional fixed-benefit pensions. Now, IRA's were originally sold to us as a way to supplement retirement income, not replace it.

But originally, IRA's weren't sold as investments in stocks; during the Jimmy Carter administration, IRA's were being pushed by banks and savings-and-loans as a vehicle to sell certificates of deposit. It was only in the 1980's that stock-based IRA's and 401(k)'s were being pushed. And one ex-employer set up his 401(k) program with what he called "discretionary profit-sharing contributions," which meant that he didn't have to contribute squat...and he didn't.

In 2005,when the frame factory where I'd worked for 5 years closed--primarily due to Ford pressuring them to cut their price on the frames at a time when steel prices were nearly doubling--I thought I might be seeing some handwriting on the wall...and I put all my 401(k) in the bank. I haven't doubled my money; I've hardly made anything...but I haven't lost a thing to a falling stock market, except what inflation has taken. I learned that lesson between October 2000 and October 2002, and when my one from a previous 401(k) finally broke even, I cashed out and went to the bank with it.

Know what? I just got lucky. I thought I saw something coming, but I could've just as easily been wrong and lost all kinds of growth over the past three years.

I've still got whole life insurance, too...in case they want to have a funeral when I pass. The financial gurus say you don't want whole life, you need to have term. My grandmother is 97 and still going; can you imagine what term insurance would cost at that age, if you could even get it? [I know, the gurus say "buy term and invest the difference"...and look at where those investments are going these days...so they may as well be saying "buy term and throw away the difference," IMHO.]

I was speaking to the original intent of the 401K. The legislation was passed that created it, but it took a couple of years for the financial types to take advantage of it. It was originally concieved to be a savings plan, not a direct replacement for pensions.

I think it is the other guys fault.

We working-types were warned at the times they were setting up the 401K plans the market can fall as well as rise. We were advised to diversify. I wish now I would have diversified by buying tractors & land. We were warned. Alive & kicking. Mark SW Wis.

Just from my recollection, I believe that following the oil crunch in the early seventies that laws were made to require the average m.p.g. of the big three’s vehicles to improve each year. They thought it more profitable not to comply and lobbied to have and had these laws relaxed. The foreign auto makers built fuel efficient cars that people liked and took the business away from the big three, who built inefficient models that eventually cost too much to own and operate. This was a near perfect storm. Jimmy Carter, with a chemical engineering degree from Annapolis, understood the problem but did not win enough hearts and minds. The domestic manufactures get no sympathy from me.

Sorry my other response was meant for another post.

Know how you feel,I'm retired from Ford.

all this finiacial system going broke sure came up all of a sudden this year. first we are supposed to get "economic stimulus checks"(that i never got) and then all of sudden the whole global finiacial system is toast. sure seems strange that it happened in an election year and close to the current administrations end. our current leader cannot be re-elected so what happened here? our newly elected leadr is gonna inheiret some BIG problems and the media and public will be on him about every move he makes. good luck politicians.

As WC Fields said "Its immoral not to separate a sucker from his money".Its hard for me to believe
how many people were sucker enough to put their retirement $$$ in the hands of these Financial Hucksters.If folks had listened to Peter Schiff back in 06 and 07 they'd of gotten their $$$ out of the Stock Market anyway.Be smart or be poor always have been the 2 choices and always will.

A lot of the problem is that too many people have bought into the Dave Ramsey theory that all we have to do is put our retirement money into "good growth stocks" and we live happily ever after. The ultimate value of publicly traded companies is the profit that can be returned to investors. That is a number that is hard to predict and can change dramatically over a relatively short period of time.

The wealthy group has, or can buy, the necessary experience and financial knowledge to back up their roll of the dice. The average investor does not and must put his trust in the honesty and knowledge of others. That is akin to going into a high-stakes poker game with a couple hundred dollars and limited playing experience. You might draw lucky and hit a streak of winning, but if you play long enough, the odds are that you will leave the table with less than you came in with.

I am reminded of the joke (told by Jerry Clower, I think) about the two hillbillys that sold the same horse back and forth between them, making a nice profit each time. Finally a third hillbilly was convinced they were both making a good living with the sales on that horse, so he bought from one of them because they were doing so well financially with the horse. he ends up with a tremendously over-valued horse and will ultimately take the loss of the "funny money" that had been made between the first two.

Welcome to the world of horse trading!

I disagree as to it replacing pensiond as that was 1 order of business other important one was Ceos etc were maxed out on their contributions so thy took in rest of employees so they could invest more tax free. Maybe this down turn will wake country up

I remember when my banker retired. Interest rates started dropping just after that. He said he might have to go back to work,thought he could always count on at least 7% interest. If you really stop listening to the talking heads who didn't see any of this coming,and think about it,are those artifically low interest rates at the bottom of all of this? Did it cause an unststainable run up in all of the other markets,real estate,stock and commodities? Investors hoping those markets would keep going up indefinately because they couldn't make money from normally safe investments?

I worked for the Farm Credit System from 1974 to 1984, and again from 1990 to 1995- we had a "defined benefit" retirement program (your retirement payment was based on salary and years of service, by a set formula). Long about 1995, they started pushing us to convert to a "defined contribution" plan- basically, a 401k to which we contributed, and they partially matched. In the process, we would also cash out our defined benefit program. They calculated the cash payout, and I was surprised by how small the payout would be, compared to what I could normally expect to draw from the defined benefit program. Of course, they were using wildly optimistic projections on return, which turned out to be false. The pressure was there to convert- letters from the "big guy" (he was about 5'6" tall, as I recall), etc. One day our local manager called me in- when he started talking about the retirement conversion, I figured, here comes some more pressure, because he was always a pretty good "company man". Surprisingly, he opined that with all that pressure, conversion must be a pretty good thing for them, but not so hot for us. He didn't convert, and neither did I.

Looking back, those who converted really got hosed. Looking at what I've made on other stock investments since, their cash-out would have lasted me about 7 years, at the same monthly payout as I'm getting from the defined benefit pension. I started drawing it when I was 56, so now at 60, I'd be more than half way through my retirement money! And that's assuuming I'd been smart enough to get out of the market last spring, before it imploded.

Just think what shape your retirement would be in now if the nnalert (Bush) would have made you put part of your SS in the stock market like they planned.

The key is diversification. The largest percent of my retirement income is fixed income, a large part of which is self-adjusting for inflation -- no one told me how to allocate it, common sense told me that. The part that is in the stock market has declined $250/month so far. Everyone is responsible for their own future. Passing blame does no good.

Hate to confuse you with the facts, but the proposal was for a VOLUNTARY Partial diversion for those under 50 years of age. Not mandatory, and not for all. nnalert like to forget that when talking to SS beneficiaries.

What BO gonna do my friend is hurl big money at all these problems - BUT not his money. I think we all know how the Government gets money. If you benefit from govt programs you'll be fine. Those who don't should prepare to make a bigger contribution. These are the good old days. Get ready to take the ride that the majority voted for.

So are you suggesting the money GW Bush has thrown at this thing, 400 billion or whatever, is not big money ?