ARGH#!! Chain Baler Woes

Cuss marks, kick the tires, more cuss marks!!

Still trying to get a patch in the bale, and think I'm startin' to see what all the big hub-bub over the belt balers is all about! :>(

I use a chain baler and to make good feed, the moisture of the hay has to be just about right, especially so, if ya raise alfalfa. Grass doesn't matter so much.........

Morning before last, we have a heavy, sloppy, wringin' wet dew. Tried to bale and the water is just literally runnin' off (and out of) the baler. Don't wanna take a chance on any bad, heated hay so I quit.

Neighbor across the fence is just balin' like crazy with his new belt balers. :>(

Yesterday, I figure I'll try it again. Wind blew all night, no dew at all and it's way TOO DRY! Baler is just grinding the hay and dumping about half of it out on the ground in the form of powder. Ending up with a bunch of 3" stems. :>(

Again, neighbor across the fence is just balin' along like crazy with his belt babies. :>)

Will try it again this morning in an hour or so and hope for a moderate dew on that 8-day old hay.

Either that or burn it, plow it all up and plant the field back to buffalo grass. Refuse to spend $40K-up on a silly baler. :>)

Allan

I've had both types; a closed throat Vermeer, an 851 and later, an open throat Vermeer. After buying the open throat Vermeer, I kept the NH for a long time as a 'back-up', but the Vermeer is what I used.

I was in the parts house yesterday morning.

Guys were packin' roll and roll of new belting out the door. Farmer after farmer buying new belts.

That doesn’t smell right. What's up with that scenario?

Also, I notice ya never see an "old" belt baler in the field. It's either new or it's a chainer. Are the belt balers a "throw-away" deal?

Allan

Allan the belt baler I got rid of last year was 20+ years old. It still had the orginal belts on it.

If not for the screw up on my part it would still be running today.

There are a lot of old belters in this neighborhood.

A good used one can be had for $5,000 to $10,000.

That is the exact reason the chains left this area is cause of the dry grinding.

Gary

Allan,
What brand rd baler cost $40K-up? Mine with netwrap and mega-tooth pick-up sure didn't even cost $30K. As far as belts go I installed new belts on my old baler at 27,000 bales not because they were un-usable but because in certain dry conditions I was have bale starting problems. The tread was worn down same as tires wear. Now to your neighbor baling next to you when water was dripping out of your baler. I'd bet his hay was too wet also and with the added hyd. tension of a belt baler his hay will mold !!.
I don't bale Alfalfa but if one wanted the most leaves I think netwrap would be the only way to go because of the 7-8 seconds is all it takes to wrap a bale.

I have run round balers for years starting out with a JD 410 and now use a JD 678. Store the baler inside out of the sun and rain and expect well over 10,000 bales from a set of belts. Keep good maintenace on the lace pins too. Replace when worn or broken.

I have a Vermeer 504I belt baler that is about 10 years old. It will always start a roll even if the windrow is no bigger than the size of you leg. I use to bale silage rolls to wrap and it is not even a silage baler. Last time I wrapped silage hay I was baling some good green orchard grass and it came an absolute frog choker and soaked that field good. I kept rolling. Had no belt problems. I remember it made real good silage hay. It runs so quiet in regular hay sometime I have to look back to see if it is still back there. All you hear is the tractor motor.

Hi Allan, I think our old hessten cost 1,500. One new belt & a hose. It only does the 1200 pound bales though. Still better than small squares.

Allan

I seem to recall you were impressed with the neighbor's NH688. That baler is part of what New Holland calls Roll Belt Balers. Rollers on the lower front, mounted on a swinging arm, and belts on the rest. This provides an small open area for the core to form, kinda like a soft core baler, but then the belts tension up and form the rest of the bale. This means almost no plugs or failure to start the core.

The series started with the model 660 in the early 90's. I heard there were some problems with bearings, but my cousin ran one from new to until last year and never replaced a belt or bearing. The next model was the 664, just a minor upgrade of the 660. I THINK it also added the option of net wrap. The 688 had a few more minor changes, but were basically the same. The BR780 was the next model, new sheet metal, same baler underneath. I think the current BR780A isn't all that much different from a BR780, but I haven't been around enough to know. Case-IH now sells the Roll Belt balers under their model numbers, and have done so for at least 3 or 4 years. If you stand behind a 660 with the tailgate open and then stand behind a BR780 with the tailgate open, there is no difference in the major components. Also the pickup on my 664 looks to be almost identical to the pickup on a late chainer baler, and I know you are already familiar with the Bale Command system some used.

It shouldn't be be hard to find an earlier series Roll Belt for reasonable coin, have a lot of parts familiar to what you already have and enjoy the capabilities of one of the newer balers.

John

You are useing an 851 or 853 aren't you?

I have used those balers and dry hay is a real trick to say the least..

Is the bale not starting at all??

If so you may want to make the windrow larger than normal.. This will put more hay into the baler at once so the bale gets bigger quick..

We welded 3/4 inch square stock on the big roller in the bottom to help in starting the bale to roll. It didn't help much...

I changed to a Gehl 2780 belt baler and i've got to say i'll never go back to a chain baler..

When new holland did away with the floor chains, thats when the problems started..

depending on the baler, there are ways to fix this problem so that it's not real bad.. Like i mentioned above, welding square stock on the floor roller. Then spray the bed liner stuff on the inside of the chains.. This helps a lot believe it or not.. I can't remember at the moment all we did to make the baler work good..

If you want more help, give me a # and i'll call you..
I had new holland chain balers for 25 plus years...

Allan you should be able to find a Deere 535 or 566 for under 10 grand in good shape easily. Except for the monitor and a few other changes they are basically the same as the new ones. Belts will save a lot of leaves. On smooth fields I go about 8MPH so the leaves don't have a chance to drop out. My last Deere 566 had 10000+ bales on it and it still had the original laces on the belts. I change the lacing pins every year. One thing with the belts they don't like the sun so storing under cover is important.

There's 3 reasons for replacing belts on a more or less modern belt baler of any color.
1. After 15K-20K bales, they are worn out.
2. Baling lumber and steel.
3. Operator doesn't understand or care how to make an even bale side to side.
I'm a big fan of the NH endless belts, but they can be replaced with laced belts as needed to save labor.
Changing the lace wire/pin on laced belts yearly or so is very good practice.
Most belts sold in-season probably could have been diagnosed as junk prior to the season. Given decent operating conditions, I'll put belt maintainence costs against chains any time.

Paid $17k for our 567 JD last year. Has around 13,000 bales on it now with original belts that look like new. Had to repair one belt splice this year and put new pins in. Total cost was around $100 for the pins and belt repair.

Our CIH 3650 soft core baler had original (endless) belts on it after over 20 years of use and was still working fine when we sold it.

I've also run a CIH RS561, NH 688, and a JD 535. I'll take the JD baler over the others any day!

my dad just bought a New Idea round baler for $575. needed a few belts but otherwise it works great! makes 1000 lb bales.
Df in WI

I think I missed something. What do you mean floor chais are better, seems rather curious, I always thought the roller wuld be better.

JoshuaGA

I use a NH 634 ( belts, 4 X 4 rolls ) baling grass only. Usually does a fine job. However there have been some days with bright sun and very low humidity, that this baler would not make a full roll due to hay grinding and crumbling. It would fill to about half size and the hay would be so dry that it was crumbling into almost chaff and falling down onto the pickup and choking up the throat going into the bale chamber. Only thing to do is dump it out and quit for the day. So it is not only chain balers that can have the problem.

I have 2 New Holland 851 chain balers I use all the time and bale all sorts of different hay with them with no problem.

I have one NH 851 I bought at an auction 3 years ago and have only greased it and oiled the chains no other work done on it in about 1200 bales of hay.

Allan,

I have a pair of Vermeer 605C's. (had one, picked up another at auction for $350 to use as parts, worked better than the one I had so I keep both greased and ready, if a bearing goes down, betl lace breaks, or tire goes flat I am running in 15 minutes, when one goes down real bad, that one will be for parts.) I used to have a 851, would not take another for ether of the two 605C's. Not shure when they were made but I am pretty sure they have been around longer than I have. Don't see alot of old balers at all around here but I like my old belters.

Dave