Wheels Coming Off Again

I agree with those who expressed concern whether the wheels are coming off. We are in for a time of big change and not, I believe, for the better. I think we are just about where the Brit's were after WWII. We are by any classical definition, bankrupted from fighting too many wars eventhough their WWII was necessary. They became the largest debtor nation after WWII. after being the largest loaner nation before WWI. They lost their manufacturing base due to neglect and evolved into financial service ecomomy (which they told themselves was the next stage of economic development. They also had a big, young and rising maufacturing power to face after WWI and capitulate to after WWII because of that countries power and the debt owed to that power the USA. Sounds frightenly similar to where we find ourselves today.

Better time arounfd the corner? I certainly hope so but really don't believe so.

I firmly believe that better times will come around again. I will not even attempt to guess when though.

I hear gas consumption is way down. There's yer sign.

I hope things get better because I paid a lot into Social Security & I want to get some of it back starting in about 5 years.
Your historical analysis of what happened to Great Britain is sobering.

I am not of the opinion that our civilization is going to end. I just don't think that the current economic and political trends can continue. Our whole economic system ( and culture ), has been based on cheap energy and cheap food. And our political system is based on 2 parties that offer very few options between them. It is going to be very interesting couple of years.

Wife went to Wally World today.

Said that there were lots and lots of empty shelves.

Asked the clerk what the heck was going on and she was told that they were having a heck of a time getting shipments (trucks) in.

Allan

Which means a lot of people who have been letting the gov't support them or have jobs that produce nothing of real value will have a whole lot of adjusting to do.Like doing something productive for a change.Many now don't know what a days real work is.

I feel the Unions have bankrupted them selves and this country.GM has people taking early retirement so they can hire new people at half the pay rate.Teachers are the largest labor union in our state and all the money problems with the schools every where no one talks about the pay and benefits teachers get.I sold 300.00 worth of scrap metal last week and ask the junk dealer where it was going.He said it all goes to China or Japan to come back to us as a car or toy. I remember working in a Union shop some 30 years ago and one of the old timers who did nothing all day came to me and said "I have my union to protect my job" to do nothing and make the most money.I feel the unions are on the way out.They are not working for what they were designed to do.I still believe people who work should be paid--and not support people who watch other people work.My opinion--thats all.

Here in Mich the housing boom which has been going strong for my whole life has come to a complete stop.On one hand its about time on the other is lots of people leaving to find work where it is still happening. Lots and lots of the newer houses are for sale or foreclosed cause so many were living so close to the edge the bubble has burst.The difference between good times an bad is only 20 bucks a month. If all the bills are paid and you have ten bucks left your doing okay but ten short and its gloom and doom.

I wonder how their trucks can be late. They haul the majority of their freight in their own trucks.
And they can"t blame it on unions (like someone on this post claims) because Wally World is the biggest anti-union company there is. I suppose it must fuel caused, huh? LOL

Walmart hauls a lot of their own stuff but they have huge distribution centers where other firms deliver stuff which is then broke down for each store. The center for here is just 110 miles in SC. So, it is probably not receiving goods on time at the depots thats screwing them up. I have found over the years though, that what ever I go for is represented by an empty shelf. Nuff said Henry

i am not a big fan of unions i think they have taken advantage of some companys but I would say the problem with bussness today is greed the average american ceo makes 30 times the average salary of the worker of that company. and that isn't enough for them so they close plants here and build stuff in 3rd world countries. look at the oil companys 30 billon profit per quarter or how every other comercial on the tv is some drug company tring to sell me some drug that my doctor should give me when I need it, not becouse i saw it on the tv. and who pays for all this, the little guy. I agree with other writers we are in for some big changes. I like to think it will get better but time will tell. I am thank full that 5 years ago I started working from my shop at home. at $4 gas I am glad i am not driving 60 miles a day to work.

You are right. It takes that stuff a long time to get here from China. And then it has to be handled by the trucks or rail or what ever. But in this part of the country the only trucks you see backed into Wally docks generally are there own.

I am a young'n on this board but I have been saying that for about ten years now. Don't know whats going to happen but sum'tins gotta give. The wastefull spending by the general public and goverment is going to lead to some wild times when the notes are called.

Dave

Hay--Mtc I have been a member of IAM for 40 years. I will have to agree, organized labor is on the way out. I disagree that they are the cause of the problems we face today. Blame Politicians--- the Unions killed themselves by not representing their people! If it weren't for organized labor, minimum wage would be $3.00 per hour and our 12 year olds would be working for that wage.

Lots of carriers are pulling Walmart loads. Swift, MS Carriers, Hunt, and many more..

Wal Mart uses their trucks to haul loads from their distribution centers to their stores.
The distribution centers use owner operators or out side carriers to supply the distribution center.

Socialistic Insincerity will continue as long as there's anyone or anything to tax. It's part of the great pay-as-you-go welfare system.
The depression of the 1930s and 40s fueled the idea we couldn't take care of families and ourselves so the government said, "We can do it better. Just send your saving to Washington. We'll even set up the Income Tax Program so you won't forget to send it in. We'll have your boss send some too. We'll use the money until you retire and your sons and daughters can send their money to us and we'll send some back to you.
Don't worry We're here to 'hep ya'."
I know I'm an old cynical puff of methane but I'm convinced SS was the beginning of the 'world owns me a living' culture we see today.

The only people who are strapped for cash are those spending more than what they make.

Families with 3-6 kids used to be raised in a three bedroom house with one bathroom. One car in the driveway, a garden and Mom stayed at home. Takeout meals and restaurant meals were a luxury for special occasions.
There was money put away and saved from each paycheque. No credit cards or debt except the house mortgage.
Now we "Have to Have" a bedroom/bathroom/LCD screen TV for every child. Two 4X4's in the driveway, no food reserves for more than a week preserved and stored in the basement or freezer.A boat, ATV and snowmobile is "essential" too. So are the vacations via air travel too.So is the $1000+ BBQ, pool and or hot tub.
The paycheque is gone and back account into overdraft within two days.
Why is status so important?
What is Status? Status is spending money you don't have on things you don't need to impress people you don't like.

Here's another quote that explains the problem as well as any.
Quote"tlak

05-29-2008 16:17:39
64.130.174.70
647345


I'm not ready to give up my life style for a bunch of F'n crooks, as simple as it is and as broke as I am".

Unquote

Unions have become a double edged sword. Imagine the work site conditions,employee pay and lifestyle without unions? Think present day China.
Problem is union shops tend to fill up with unproductive "dead wood" that should be fired. If everybody was keen, worked and didn't want to claim lifetime disability for a "sore back". Union shops would be just fine.

MY OPINION - the economy is cyclic. What goes up, sooner or later must come down. The US has historically gone from boom to bust. We've been artificially kept in boom for many years. But even the artificial supports can't prevent the inevitable, they only delay it. Just as the stock market goes through "adjustments" (anybody remember the wreck Oct. of 2000?) the US economy is entering an adjustment period.

From what I've seen here, most of us on this forum are resilient and resourceful. People that work the land have to be tough. My parents and grandparents grew up hard, kicking and scratching. While I didn't have to grow up hard, I've got their attitude and their strengths. Same goes for James and his family. We will survive. That doesn't mean it will be pretty or that we won't suffer losses, but we will get through.

I am concerned for the changes coming. I don't know if they will be for the better. I suspect it will bring more government control of our lives and the only thing the government does well is take our money.

I am absolutely sure of this - my God is sufficient and He has promised that He will not put more on me than I can bear. I'm gonna make it and I'm gonna make sure James does, too.

Someone here talked about the poeple that had to have everything, 2 4X4's, pool, hot tub etc. Well for year we have been told that MOST of the economy is from consumption (Comsumer) sales so they were just helping the economy along BUT WHAT ENABLED THE CONSUMER ECONOMY WAS GOOD PAYING UNION MANUFACTURING JOB. When you lose them you CAN NOT support a CONSUMER socitity.
I liked the comment about the British. ONE OF THE THING THAT BROKE THEM WAS THEIR 75 YEARS IN IRAQI. NOW WHO HAS THIER TOE IN THERE NOW AND WHO WANTS TO SPEND ANOTHER 75 OR 100 YEARS THERE?

Kent

buickanddeere-----I agree with you 98%. I can remember, years ago, when I worked on cars, tractors, motorcycles, almost anything. I worked a full time job and worked in my makeshift shop with dirt floor until after midnight. We didn't have a late model air conditioned car to transport our three kids but we made it just fine. I was always taught to satisfy my needs before desires. Now my wife and I are living comfortably on three nice UNION retirements. Yes I started at the bottom but desired better and accomplished it. I have had all my kids, several times to thank my wife and I for the way we raised them. This to me is SUCCESS!

Wal Mart for the most part,when you haul to the distribution center its through a broker.Also lots of people wont haul to Wal Mart because of their attitude.They act like they own you and the driver is a kindergartener.You can set there hours and hours.They are still better than Fleming who they put out of business in my opinion.When you get a "broker"load,its between the truck company and the broker to negotiate the price.For the last 3 or 4 years the "brokers"have been trying to get the pay lower and lower.Now Wal Mart has good brokers getting loads for them,but they see the bad brokers who rip off people getting away with it and try to do it themselves.Wal Mart is ok loads,but nothing to brag about by the time you blow half a day getting it unloaded.Actually they usually get you unloaded when you back in the door,it can take them a couple of hours to check you in,and another hour up to 4 to get you paperwork.
If it werent for unions,nobody would be making the pay they are in this country.Now whenever I worked for a union,I worked hard,more than 40 hours,and had benefits.Somehow,the post hippie generation of union workers got this idea of not having to work.These people,even when the handwriting was on the wall,to work or they were going to close the warehouse,wouldnt.They tried to scam drivers worse until they just became so disgusting,the company went out of business rather than try and work with them any more.Fleming is who I am talking about but there are lots of them just like that.That attitude and Wal Marts attitude of not having unions is the reason we are where we are now,with lots of Wal Marts.Is it better,a little,but its not better for the workers.There are only about 1/4 the people working on the Wal Mart dock that "worked"on a Fleming dock.
The trucking industry needs a lot of improvement.There is no excuse for the condition the trucking industry is in other than greed and stupidity.These companies will run the owner operators into the ground,then they will cry they cant handle the freight.They are too inefficient to handle the freight because they have sub standard drivers,truck stops are full of them every day to where people that work driving a truck cant even get in a truck stop when they need it.Shelves empty at Wal Mart,there are your "cheap,non union"drivers that would rather play video games than drive the truck.Soon as somebody says something to them,they quit and go work for another company,usually after tearing up a bunch of stuff.You get sub standard drivers when you break the owner operators.This is just the start,in another year,if things dont change to where owner operators are still hauling freight,it will be lots worse.You wont get things delivered anywhere on time any more,and it will cost a fortune to get anything hauled.Wal Mart will be in sad shape,maybe broke by then.While that could be good,you need somebody standing there ready to take up the slack.Wal Mart is the bottom of the barrel.Nobody is waiting to take their place.Next is the National Guard to deliver your groceries.I doubt thats going to work very well.

Global oil output 85 mil barrel per day.
Global oil usage 87 mil barrel per day.
Global out of inventory or storage 2 mil barrel per day.
US imports 16 mil barrel per day.
If every regulation were dropped, US could not produce enough oil to live without OPEC.
Refineries are only running at 82 percent.
Ethanol is a joke. Is a problem adding to a problem.
Only hope is to get electric power generation off natural gas, on to clean coal, with some wind farms. Divert natural gas to liquification for transportation use.
Every drilling rig in Texas is tied up, booked months or years in advance. Drilling as fast as can drill, no wackos to stop it here. Natural gas piplines are growing like weeds.
Chinese cars will increase 30 fold in next 10 years. Yes 3000 percent in 10 years.
China will outbid us for OPEC oil supplies. Why? Because we have enriched them buying their low quality products at Wally World. Why? Because US consumers are tightwads, always putting price ahead of quality.
We are a consumer nation, dependent on China, OPEC, and others to live. Lost our manufacturing base.
We have 20 - 30 million criminals who have crossed our borders against the law. They have babies like rabbits at taxpayer expense of 10000 to 25000 per baby at public hospitals - ANCHOR babies. Drive without insurance, legal citizens have to support with "uninsured motorist" insurance. Public schools going broke with Spanish requirements at taxpayer expense. Public hospitals raising taxes for criminal medical care.
We have deficit spent for 7 years. Now 30 plus percent of every tax dollar you send in is spent on INTEREST only financing of the deficit, and it is still growing.
Our military is wore out. Needs complete equipment refurbishment or replacement. Much of the tracked vehicles will be demolished in the deserts of Iraq, not even fit to bring home for rebuilding. We will need Billions and Billions to fix up our military.
These are the good ole days. Energy cost will continue to rise, at alarming rates.
Tom