What is causing my solenoid to burn out?

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Have replaced it several times over the years on our 333 MH . The one I just took off this morning is barely over 1 yr old so no remaining warranty. It was working perfect then nothing the next time. By using my Fluke meter set to DC , I determined power was getting through the solenoid when the start button is pressed as the difference in potential drops from 12.2VDC to 0VDC while its pressed in but no action at all. Crossing it out did nothing either. With the solenoid off , hitting the terminal on the side of the starter with a jumper cable with the other end on the solenoid supply cable the starter will spin perfectly. This leaves me to the conclusion that its the solenoid,again The only thing I noticed out of place so far is at the battery terminal the cable going to the frame (positive ground) is frayed to less than 1/2 at the battery terminal end. Maybe its causing too much resistance and burning it out?

JB Freeman · Sep 17, 2023

Its been my experience that solenoids burn out because they are energized for too long. Or its just a very cheaply made solenoid. Have you considered replacing the start switch?

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Thank you . They arent very expensive and they all look the same regardless of which site you look at so Im guessing they could all be coming from the 1 source? It rarely takes more that 4 rolls first try to fire it up so the start button might not be a bad idea to replace. From what Im seeing the fuel tank will likely need to come out to get at it but if it helps so be it.

Eric in IL · Sep 17, 2023

CIH requires a continuous duty solenoid in some of their combine cabs. Yet years ago when I needed one, they sold faulty new ones. I bought from a different source and that one is still working.

phil25 · Sep 17, 2023

Well now sparky..

did you miss DC 101 class in school ?
I am back teaching again Mon to Thurs afternoons again.
Anyway your problem..try putting a 12vdc bulb on the start wire at the solenoid end[ solenoid disconnected] an measure voltage before and after..12vdc each time ? if not start switch contact resistance...
4 or 3 wire solenoid ? some have a pull in coil[ the umph to engage] and a hold in coil to maintain the starter contact closed/starter turning.
Yes fix the frayed cables anyway.
Check that there a good ground circuit for the solenoid, some have a sealing/weather gasket and rely on
the mounting screw to complete the circuit, and you can put 12vdc to solenoid with the plunger in the barrel
of course and quickly touch its power post ,the plunger should move easy and fast...maybe you have mechanical friction on the plunger when assembled/starter installed.
Thats my 2 cents worth..besides they are cheaply made units to start with..

keep your electrons in the wire

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Thank you Phil! Ill definitely try those suggestions , theres 1 lead coming from the battery (-) positive ground , then a bit smaller lead (maybe #4?) leaving the same post. My GUESS is the smaller lead goes to the other button on the dash for the manifold heater? Then theres a small (#14?) wire that Im assuming goes to the start button. The second 3/8 or 5/16 terminal has a strap that goes to the terminal on the starter.

r.w.b. · Sep 17, 2023

are you getting a solenoid thats same voltage as your system plus a quality 1 or an elcheepo? grounded real nicely?

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Its 12v , Im only finding the same looking one from any website I look at. I bought this one at a local auto parts store.

tomtinker · Sep 17, 2023

Trying to start with a really weak battery will roast a solenoid.

DoubleO7 · Sep 17, 2023

(reply to post at 13:50:31 09/17/23)

no action at all.

As in no clunk or feeling that the coil is moving the contact bar home?

guido · Sep 17, 2023

Philip d

12 volts in zero out? YOU are not measuring anY voltage at starter end of the Solenoid! No voltage output, of course no start!
If the solenoid was putting the same voltage to the starter as you did then it surely would spin right?

You should get a voltage drop at the starter end of the solenoid NOT ZERO. The starter needs at least 9.6 volts to start spinning, that is called a voltage drop FROM THE 12 VOLT BATTERY.

IN OTHER WORDS, 12 VOLTS IS GOING INTO THE SOLENOID but NOTHING IS COMING OUTOF THE SOLENOID, replace it. And repair all the wire connections, AND replace any freid wires. SQuikey clean connection too,

Guido.

RusselAZ · Sep 17, 2023

Diesel or gas engine? what solenoid are you using? # and mfg please. I'll bet what you are trying to use does not have the capability to handle the in rush current to get the starter started.

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Thank you that all makes sense, I was getting 0 between the 2 terminals on the solenoid with the start button pressed which to my understanding meant that there was therefore no difference in potential so the circuit was closed where as there was 12.2v without the button pressed which meant the circuit was open. But that being said if the current was going to the second terminal then travelling through the strap to the starter terminal like I thought then why didnt the starter spin? Figuring out AC seems easier to me haha

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Its a diesel , Im not sure what the brand of the replacement is

Janicholson · Sep 17, 2023

I understand your voltage analysis and agree. If you checked from ground to the battery cable at the solenoid you would get battery voltage all the time. If you put the meter from ground to the terminal on the solenoid connected to the starter, and turned it to start/pushed the start button, that terminal would also show battery voltage. If the connection was bad to the starter the starter would not spin. If the starter has bad brushes it could be open circuit inside and be erratic. If this starter has a stud on the side to get electricity from the solenoid, and the solenoid is not also used to push the starter drive into the ring gear, I would assume when you touched the cable to the stud, the engine turned. If the solenoid is just a relay (no mechanical link) a ford solenoid from a 1960 Galaxy 390 V8 will substitute Using only the S terminal for the start circuit. Jim

guido · Sep 17, 2023

Philip d,

Zero voltage on the started side? No voltage to the starter no spin

Guido.

Philip d · Sep 17, 2023

Nadda no sound clunk or movement of anything

moresmoke · Sep 17, 2023

While all the solenoids may look the same from the outside, there are differences on the inside. Most are rated around 70A. Recently I was looking for a solenoid to put on a 44D. I found this one that has different contacts and is rated at 200A.

Also, the starter relays that Deere uses must be pretty decent. I used one as a temporary replacement for the snowplow on my pickup. That was 10 years ago and it is still working fine. Also the one I used was a takeoff at that.

Bruce(OR) · Sep 18, 2023

I have seen bad starter motors shorten solenoid life.

Geo-TH,In · Sep 18, 2023

This cheapie clamp-on meter I got off amazon can measure DC amps. It's very accruate.

I'm amazed that the starter current on a lawnmower is north of 100 amps. Can your fluke measure DC amps?

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Measure your starter amps. It is possible your starter needs rebuilt.

What is causing my solenoid to burn out?

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